6 ms·

just because it is this way doesn't mean we can't do better.

seanp2k2 10y ago
Sure, but rolling this back now, especially in this political climate, seems exceedingly unlikely.
sandworm101 10y ago
But to what advantage? Before governments knew who was arriving on thier shores travellers would be held for days, even months, sometimes on dedicated islands. Even in the 90s, 10+ hours to clear customs and immigration was not unussual in many countries. Today, law enforcement and immigration officials can rely upon advance data and do away with lengthy in-person background checks for all. This is why land crossings, which are unannounced, take so much longer and are more unpredictable than air crossings. Fly to Dubai. Then try driving to Dubai. Same boarder, vastly different inspection.
- nemesisj 10y ago
  Spoken like someone who rarely crossed borders in the 90s. I spent significant time crossing borders in the 80s and 90s and it never took much time. This was primarily between PR China and the USA so not your friendliest border but also involved land crossings between Hong Kong and PR China. Most of these tickets were purchased in cash months in advance. I'm not sure why you think it was so onerous without info sharing.
  - sandworm101 10y ago
    Try Saudi, or russian boarders, or vietnam. I spent a great many hours in long lines to see stonefaced boarder guards carrying more bullets than brains.
cloakandswagger 10y ago
What would be better in this case? Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? I'm a pretty staunch libertarian and even I can see the benefit here. Until we reach the border-less, one-world utopia that so many people seem to be gunning for, it's valuable to know who is coming/going from your country.
- hrehhf 10y ago
  > Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? Yes.
- ryanlol 10y ago
  >Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? This is the reality in large parts of EU, I've flown several times without having my real name on the ticket. Hell, when I fly private it's even better. Show up at airport, meet pilot, get on the plane, hand the pilot a pile of cash. No passport control or security at any point, and this isn't just EU. So far no massive disasters have resulted from this.
  - refurb 10y ago
    Hmmm... I've flow a ton in the EU and always had to show ID that matched the name on the ticket. I did fly in SE Asia a few times where no ID was required and the name didn't have to match.
    - ryanlol 10y ago
      >Hmmm... I've flow a ton in the EU and always had to show ID that matched the name on the ticket. Yeah, those are the rules. However, the only place where your passport and ticket will be compared is at the gate and they certainly never look very carefully.
- icebraining 10y ago
  At the very least, the DHS shouldn't have free reign over flights that don't actually go into, from or even over the US.
- ptero 10y ago
  Which, to me, is the point of the border checks. The country can request all the information it wants at this time from people who want to enter and refuse admission if they do not comply (or if it does not like what is sees). But this is separate from airline tickets, passenger manifests, etc.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

Sure, but rolling this back now, especially in this political climate, seems exceedingly unlikely.

But to what advantage? Before governments knew who was arriving on thier shores travellers would be held for days, even months, sometimes on dedicated islands. Even in the 90s, 10+ hours to clear customs and immigration was not unussual in many countries. Today, law enforcement and immigration officials can rely upon advance data and do away with lengthy in-person background checks for all. This is why land crossings, which are unannounced, take so much longer and are more unpredictable than air crossings. Fly to Dubai. Then try driving to Dubai. Same boarder, vastly different inspection.

nemesisj 10y ago
Spoken like someone who rarely crossed borders in the 90s. I spent significant time crossing borders in the 80s and 90s and it never took much time. This was primarily between PR China and the USA so not your friendliest border but also involved land crossings between Hong Kong and PR China. Most of these tickets were purchased in cash months in advance. I'm not sure why you think it was so onerous without info sharing.
- sandworm101 10y ago
  Try Saudi, or russian boarders, or vietnam. I spent a great many hours in long lines to see stonefaced boarder guards carrying more bullets than brains.

cloakandswagger 10y ago

What would be better in this case? Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? I'm a pretty staunch libertarian and even I can see the benefit here. Until we reach the border-less, one-world utopia that so many people seem to be gunning for, it's valuable to know who is coming/going from your country.

hrehhf 10y ago
> Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? Yes.
ryanlol 10y ago
>Should anyone be able to show up to an airport, pay for a ticket and board a flight anonymously? This is the reality in large parts of EU, I've flown several times without having my real name on the ticket. Hell, when I fly private it's even better. Show up at airport, meet pilot, get on the plane, hand the pilot a pile of cash. No passport control or security at any point, and this isn't just EU. So far no massive disasters have resulted from this.
- refurb 10y ago
  Hmmm... I've flow a ton in the EU and always had to show ID that matched the name on the ticket. I did fly in SE Asia a few times where no ID was required and the name didn't have to match.
  - ryanlol 10y ago
    >Hmmm... I've flow a ton in the EU and always had to show ID that matched the name on the ticket. Yeah, those are the rules. However, the only place where your passport and ticket will be compared is at the gate and they certainly never look very carefully.
icebraining 10y ago
At the very least, the DHS shouldn't have free reign over flights that don't actually go into, from or even over the US.
ptero 10y ago
Which, to me, is the point of the border checks. The country can request all the information it wants at this time from people who want to enter and refuse admission if they do not comply (or if it does not like what is sees). But this is separate from airline tickets, passenger manifests, etc.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]