4 ms·

I use C# daily at work and my dislike can be summed up by one word: Microsoft. They may have changed course but open source software has for 10+ years largely

I use C# daily at work and my dislike can be summed up by one word: Microsoft. They may have changed course but open source software has for 10+ years largely avoided the platform. This means C# is Java with nicer syntax but 10% the libraries and terrible cross platform support. There's been countless times at work when I needed a certain library and I already knew what the Java equivalent was, but what I was looking for simply didn't exist. Database clients, data processing, http2, image manipulation, etc... With Java I get everything I do from C# plus all the stuff they've been raving about working on in .NET core . Plus I get choice. There's 3 full featured IDE's, 20 or so servers, 6 or 7 JVM's

nightski 10y ago
This really sounds like a lack of knowledge of the .NET ecosystem. Every area you mentioned has extensive library coverage. In addition there are several C# IDEs available, including from JetBrains who creates IntelliJ! Roslyn makes fancy features such as auto complete available to text editors as well such as VS Code or Atom.
- throwawaydbfif 10y ago
  Okay so my latest issue http2... In C# you have to be running the newest version of Windows to use it. You know how happy my boss was to hear that we needed new server licenses to use http2? Very. Use .NET core? Not ready yet for production yet but probably will be in a few years. In Java I can run Jetty or Netty on whatever and use http2. Old Os or whatever doesn't matter because the protocol isn't tied to the OS network stack.
  - WorldMaker 10y ago
    .NET Core 1.x is perfectly suitable for building new production apps today.
    - slowmovintarget 10y ago
      Having used it in production for a more than a month now... No. No it's not. Mono and .Net Core RC1 were more stable for the same workloads.
      - WorldMaker 10y ago
        Anecdotally, I've not seen any issues, but then I've also been hosting on IIS. Obviously, YMMV. ETA: Also, my comment above was meant to be from the perspective of that it is a technically finished product with an active support lifespan. I did not mean to imply that it was better (or worse) than any alternatives, but that under the accepted definition of "production ready" where a thing is finished and supported, it is suitable to that.
        cryptarch 10y ago
        Maybe "finished and supported" is the definition of production ready in Microsoft-land, but I'd say "stable, well-tested and batteries-included" is a lot more important. .NET Core has none of that going.
        WorldMaker 10y ago
        Again, this seems like an anecdotal divide more than anything. .NET Core has certainly seemed "stable, well-tested, and batteries-included" for any of the projects where I have used it.
  - ahoka 10y ago
    Net core wouldn't help as kestrel does not support http2 yet. We just put an nginx proxy in front of our cluster now, which may or may not solve your issues.
- topbanana 10y ago
  Not to mention that the best C# IDE is better than any of the Java ones.
  - steego 10y ago
    I have to disagree. Unlike the VS Resharper plugin, the JetBrains IDEs are really good. Unlike VS, they rarely lock the UI thread doing paternalistic busywork that adds very marginal value to my work. I'm use VS all the time, so I'm not going to dump on it too much, but there is definitely room for improvement. I'm only vaguely familiar with VS 2017, but I understand they've put their IDE on a diet.
  - ahoka 10y ago
    To be honest VS is horrible compared to NetBeans... Maybe it's on par if you pay extra for resharper, but I find that ridiculous.
  - TheCoelacanth 10y ago
    I'm not sure how you can justify this assertion. I find both IntelliJ and NetBeans to be much nicer to work in than Visual Studio.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
toyg 10y ago
> my dislike can be summed up by one word: Microsoft. It's not just the current gap, but the absence of long-term guarantees that the ecosystem will stay on the current open-source trajectory. Microsoft can close SQLServer back down tomorrow; nobody can take away Postgres (even when someone tries, like Oracle with MySQL, the community reacts pretty quickly). C# is a nice language and if you stick to the classic MS ecosystem you can be very productive, but if you're not invested in Windows and you're not ready to spend real money for it (either right away or at short notice), you should probably look elsewhere.
- throwawaydbfif 10y ago
  Exactly. Even with C# open, until enough years pass for the community to build up, you're still in the House of Microsoft...They just keep the doors open now.

nightski 10y ago

This really sounds like a lack of knowledge of the .NET ecosystem. Every area you mentioned has extensive library coverage. In addition there are several C# IDEs available, including from JetBrains who creates IntelliJ! Roslyn makes fancy features such as auto complete available to text editors as well such as VS Code or Atom.

throwawaydbfif 10y ago
Okay so my latest issue http2... In C# you have to be running the newest version of Windows to use it. You know how happy my boss was to hear that we needed new server licenses to use http2? Very. Use .NET core? Not ready yet for production yet but probably will be in a few years. In Java I can run Jetty or Netty on whatever and use http2. Old Os or whatever doesn't matter because the protocol isn't tied to the OS network stack.
- WorldMaker 10y ago
  .NET Core 1.x is perfectly suitable for building new production apps today.
  - slowmovintarget 10y ago
    Having used it in production for a more than a month now... No. No it's not. Mono and .Net Core RC1 were more stable for the same workloads.
    - WorldMaker 10y ago
      Anecdotally, I've not seen any issues, but then I've also been hosting on IIS. Obviously, YMMV. ETA: Also, my comment above was meant to be from the perspective of that it is a technically finished product with an active support lifespan. I did not mean to imply that it was better (or worse) than any alternatives, but that under the accepted definition of "production ready" where a thing is finished and supported, it is suitable to that.
      - cryptarch 10y ago
        Maybe "finished and supported" is the definition of production ready in Microsoft-land, but I'd say "stable, well-tested and batteries-included" is a lot more important. .NET Core has none of that going.
        WorldMaker 10y ago
        Again, this seems like an anecdotal divide more than anything. .NET Core has certainly seemed "stable, well-tested, and batteries-included" for any of the projects where I have used it.
- ahoka 10y ago
  Net core wouldn't help as kestrel does not support http2 yet. We just put an nginx proxy in front of our cluster now, which may or may not solve your issues.
topbanana 10y ago
Not to mention that the best C# IDE is better than any of the Java ones.
- steego 10y ago
  I have to disagree. Unlike the VS Resharper plugin, the JetBrains IDEs are really good. Unlike VS, they rarely lock the UI thread doing paternalistic busywork that adds very marginal value to my work. I'm use VS all the time, so I'm not going to dump on it too much, but there is definitely room for improvement. I'm only vaguely familiar with VS 2017, but I understand they've put their IDE on a diet.
- ahoka 10y ago
  To be honest VS is horrible compared to NetBeans... Maybe it's on par if you pay extra for resharper, but I find that ridiculous.
- TheCoelacanth 10y ago
  I'm not sure how you can justify this assertion. I find both IntelliJ and NetBeans to be much nicer to work in than Visual Studio.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

toyg 10y ago

> my dislike can be summed up by one word: Microsoft. It's not just the current gap, but the absence of long-term guarantees that the ecosystem will stay on the current open-source trajectory. Microsoft can close SQLServer back down tomorrow; nobody can take away Postgres (even when someone tries, like Oracle with MySQL, the community reacts pretty quickly). C# is a nice language and if you stick to the classic MS ecosystem you can be very productive, but if you're not invested in Windows and you're not ready to spend real money for it (either right away or at short notice), you should probably look elsewhere.

throwawaydbfif 10y ago
Exactly. Even with C# open, until enough years pass for the community to build up, you're still in the House of Microsoft...They just keep the doors open now.