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The important part: the group was not banned for their beliefs or their speech. It was banned for violating the TOS, in particular for doxxing.

by diego 10y ago

sergiotapia 10y ago
They were trying to find out the identity of the person who assaulted a man in the airport and report them to the police. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf008xA1x1Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf008xA1x1Q
- Dobbs 10y ago
  That is just about the textbook definition of doxxing. Hunting down the real life information about a person and posting it on the internet. This has blown up in reddit's face before (boston bomber) and so the site has a very very strict anti-doxing rule. It isn't up to reddit to hunt down that individual, it is up to the police.
- enkid 10y ago
  Efforts like that during the Boston marathon bombing had them ID an innocent person, which got picked up by some media outlets.
- omginternets 10y ago
  "Doxxing for a cause is still doxxing." I think that's the policy that's being applied.
  - shard972 10y ago
    Then why on earth is /r/shitredditsays still around? They have been getting in trouble for doxxing for years along with constantly brigading which apparently is another bannable offense. As someone who has been dogpiled by that sub with people attempting to doxx me for the crime of having a different opinion in /r/worldnews, I have absolutely no idea why reddit turns a blind eye.
    - eridius 10y ago
      I think the difference is, if the moderators respond to reports of doxxing by removing the offending material, the subreddit can stay, even if the members keep submitting new material. If the moderators refuse to do anything about it, or, in this case, actively encourage it, then the subreddit itself must go. That said, I've never visited SRS, so I don't know how their moderators respond to reports of doxxing.
      - AckSyn 10y ago
        SRS is where you can get doxxed, and the admins turn a blind eye to their behavior on a regular basis. They'll give them the proverbial slap on the wrist and things will cool down for a while, but they're the admin's pet subreddit so they get away with everything. Brigading, vote maniuplation, doxxing, etc. The entire admin team needs to go, and almost all of the mods on the default subs as well.
    - omginternets 10y ago
      I didn't mean to imply they were being fair about it. I meant to suggest that this was probably their rationale.
      - shard972 10y ago
        It probably is their rationale, but it's just showing how reddit admins seem to be taking sides and turning a blind eye to parts of the community they agree with and banning the parts they don't. Reddit used to have vibrant discussion in most threads, everything now is either completely hostile back and forths or completely a circlejerk. Rarely any middle ground seems to exist anymore and it's a real shame.
      - MK999 10y ago
        you mean pretext
        omginternets 10y ago
        You're nitpicking.
- NoodleIncident 10y ago
  Digging up personal information / identities online is by definition Doxxing.
- striking 10y ago
  To reddit, those are one and the same. Making any sort of public information available about someone who isn't a public-facing personality is a bannable offense. It's part of the reddiquette, and every subreddit that's allowed to remain on the site that has issues with this kind of thing has rules about it that they've worked on with the admins. You can see a great example of how not to go afoul of reddit's sitewide rules on public information at r/KotakuInAction's rules (https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_2._no_personal_information https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_2._n... and https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_5._we_are_not_your_personal_army https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_5._w...)
- taneq 10y ago
  Publishing a person's real-life contact details in association with an online witch hunt absolutely is doxxing. "Trying to find out the identity of a person" in a public forum is guaranteed to result in a person's details (not necessarily that person) being made public knowledge. There's a reason we have paid professionals to investigate this sort of thing. Not only are they less likely to get swept along by the mob, but their preliminary findings and suspicions are not published and so the mob doesn't seize on someone who "looks guilty" (or even someone who is guilty but who still has a right to due process and a fair trial) and punish them for something they probably didn't do.
- Zikes 10y ago
  Last time they decided to play detective it did not go well. https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/reddit-find-boston-bombers-founder-interview/315987/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/reddit-...
gottam 10y ago
Disagreed. The name "altright" itself is now banned. You can no longer make a subreddit named that so effectively, the speech and beliefs are now banned under the guise of TOS violation. Usually when moderators misbehave they tend to trade out moderators, they made a special exception to make sure the subreddit isn't remade. They also tend to selectively enforce these rules on subreddits that dont align with their own political views. You can always start one that isnt called "altright" but you're less likely to get eyes on it which may be the entire point. They're well within their rights to ban whomever they want, but they should be upfront about deleting subreddits that dont align with them politically rather than this game they're playing finding some TOS reason to remove an entire topic from the site. It doesn't make sense otherwise to punish everyone for the actions of a few.
briholt 10y ago
This now the default social media censorship tactic. Apply the TOS harshly to your opponents and loosely to your allies. When an Alt Right sub doxxes people, they get banned; when an SJW sub doxxes people, they get ignored.
- a_bonobo 10y ago
  Do you have a source for that? Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me
  - AckSyn 10y ago
    It is a conspiracy, and one I've witnessed many times outright on /r/politics where they ignore those who solicit (both in sending/receiving) people's information via PM. That site has turned into an utter hole in the last 10 months, regardless of the fact that it was on a steady decline already. I'm not sure if it can be brought back to center where it used to be or if it's better to "nuke it from orbit."
  - briholt 10y ago
    https://www.reddit.com/r/SRSsucks/comments/4j1ehl/exposing_rshitredditsays_20/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SRSsucks/comments/4j1ehl/exposing_r...
    - hackuser 10y ago
      This looks very much like an angry, obsessive Internet rant in some kind of war. I don't find those things convincing or even worth reading. Is there something more reliable?
      - briholt 10y ago
        If a sub banning someone for reporting members' rape threats doesn't convince you, nothing will.
        10y ago

The important part: the group was not banned for their beliefs or their speech. It was banned for violating the TOS, in particular for doxxing.

by diego 10y ago

The important part: the group was not banned for their beliefs or their speech. It was banned for violating the TOS, in particular for doxxing.

sergiotapia 10y ago

They were trying to find out the identity of the person who assaulted a man in the airport and report them to the police. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf008xA1x1Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf008xA1x1Q

Dobbs 10y ago
That is just about the textbook definition of doxxing. Hunting down the real life information about a person and posting it on the internet. This has blown up in reddit's face before (boston bomber) and so the site has a very very strict anti-doxing rule. It isn't up to reddit to hunt down that individual, it is up to the police.
enkid 10y ago
Efforts like that during the Boston marathon bombing had them ID an innocent person, which got picked up by some media outlets.
omginternets 10y ago
"Doxxing for a cause is still doxxing." I think that's the policy that's being applied.
- shard972 10y ago
  Then why on earth is /r/shitredditsays still around? They have been getting in trouble for doxxing for years along with constantly brigading which apparently is another bannable offense. As someone who has been dogpiled by that sub with people attempting to doxx me for the crime of having a different opinion in /r/worldnews, I have absolutely no idea why reddit turns a blind eye.
  - eridius 10y ago
    I think the difference is, if the moderators respond to reports of doxxing by removing the offending material, the subreddit can stay, even if the members keep submitting new material. If the moderators refuse to do anything about it, or, in this case, actively encourage it, then the subreddit itself must go. That said, I've never visited SRS, so I don't know how their moderators respond to reports of doxxing.
    - AckSyn 10y ago
      SRS is where you can get doxxed, and the admins turn a blind eye to their behavior on a regular basis. They'll give them the proverbial slap on the wrist and things will cool down for a while, but they're the admin's pet subreddit so they get away with everything. Brigading, vote maniuplation, doxxing, etc. The entire admin team needs to go, and almost all of the mods on the default subs as well.
  - omginternets 10y ago
    I didn't mean to imply they were being fair about it. I meant to suggest that this was probably their rationale.
    - shard972 10y ago
      It probably is their rationale, but it's just showing how reddit admins seem to be taking sides and turning a blind eye to parts of the community they agree with and banning the parts they don't. Reddit used to have vibrant discussion in most threads, everything now is either completely hostile back and forths or completely a circlejerk. Rarely any middle ground seems to exist anymore and it's a real shame.
    - MK999 10y ago
      you mean pretext
      - omginternets 10y ago
        You're nitpicking.
NoodleIncident 10y ago
Digging up personal information / identities online is by definition Doxxing.
striking 10y ago
To reddit, those are one and the same. Making any sort of public information available about someone who isn't a public-facing personality is a bannable offense. It's part of the reddiquette, and every subreddit that's allowed to remain on the site that has issues with this kind of thing has rules about it that they've worked on with the admins. You can see a great example of how not to go afoul of reddit's sitewide rules on public information at r/KotakuInAction's rules (https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_2._no_personal_information https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_2._n... and https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_5._we_are_not_your_personal_army https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/wiki/rules#wiki_5._w...)
taneq 10y ago
Publishing a person's real-life contact details in association with an online witch hunt absolutely is doxxing. "Trying to find out the identity of a person" in a public forum is guaranteed to result in a person's details (not necessarily that person) being made public knowledge. There's a reason we have paid professionals to investigate this sort of thing. Not only are they less likely to get swept along by the mob, but their preliminary findings and suspicions are not published and so the mob doesn't seize on someone who "looks guilty" (or even someone who is guilty but who still has a right to due process and a fair trial) and punish them for something they probably didn't do.
Zikes 10y ago
Last time they decided to play detective it did not go well. https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/reddit-find-boston-bombers-founder-interview/315987/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/reddit-...

gottam 10y ago

Disagreed. The name "altright" itself is now banned. You can no longer make a subreddit named that so effectively, the speech and beliefs are now banned under the guise of TOS violation. Usually when moderators misbehave they tend to trade out moderators, they made a special exception to make sure the subreddit isn't remade. They also tend to selectively enforce these rules on subreddits that dont align with their own political views. You can always start one that isnt called "altright" but you're less likely to get eyes on it which may be the entire point. They're well within their rights to ban whomever they want, but they should be upfront about deleting subreddits that dont align with them politically rather than this game they're playing finding some TOS reason to remove an entire topic from the site. It doesn't make sense otherwise to punish everyone for the actions of a few.

briholt 10y ago

This now the default social media censorship tactic. Apply the TOS harshly to your opponents and loosely to your allies. When an Alt Right sub doxxes people, they get banned; when an SJW sub doxxes people, they get ignored.

a_bonobo 10y ago
Do you have a source for that? Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me
- AckSyn 10y ago
  It is a conspiracy, and one I've witnessed many times outright on /r/politics where they ignore those who solicit (both in sending/receiving) people's information via PM. That site has turned into an utter hole in the last 10 months, regardless of the fact that it was on a steady decline already. I'm not sure if it can be brought back to center where it used to be or if it's better to "nuke it from orbit."
- briholt 10y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/SRSsucks/comments/4j1ehl/exposing_rshitredditsays_20/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SRSsucks/comments/4j1ehl/exposing_r...
  - hackuser 10y ago
    This looks very much like an angry, obsessive Internet rant in some kind of war. I don't find those things convincing or even worth reading. Is there something more reliable?
    - briholt 10y ago
      If a sub banning someone for reporting members' rape threats doesn't convince you, nothing will.
      - 10y ago