4 ms·

could you highlight some particular comments that you think are bad? All I see that could be deemed offensive is references to Stevie Wonder being blind, and ba

could you highlight some particular comments that you think are bad? All I see that could be deemed offensive is references to Stevie Wonder being blind, and bad puns linking his physical blindness to saying that Michelle Obama is "lovely". Suggesting that a blind man is physically blind is just stating a fact, and making a pun around that is exactly the offensive humour I mentioned earlier. I may have missed some stuff that's lower down though.

pavlov 10y ago
Here's some I collected in a few minutes, until I couldn't take it any more. Most of the 600+ comments are like this. "He didn't see the bulge in the First Yeti's crotch, so it all worked out!" "- So much for the story of blind people's other senses improving. He couldn't smell her bile?" "- Or jock sweat?" "Those who have seen a Sasquatch up close and personal say the stench is the first thing you notice. I think the real reason Trump is staying in NYC for the time being is to give Stanley Steamer time to get all those Cleveland Steamers out of the drapes." "They made the decision to throw the drapes away! Also paint the entire place with anti-Wookie stench paint for Purina's paint division." "Does he know he's serenading to a man?" "If he could see her...he'd likely puke and gouge his eyes out." "Yup, anyone who thought he might be faking it can rest assured, he's as blind as a bat." "He can't see the Wookie!" ""Isn't she ape-y" just doesn't have the right ring to it." "A little Braille on Micheal might answer a few questions." "Just give Mikey a quick cup check. Besides, Stevie ain't blind." "Well, to be honest, they HAD to use Stevie. Anyone else would've been turned to stone." "Serenading Chewbacca, how precious." "Stevie wonder has no idea how lucky he is to be blind singing for that sow or correction boar..." "You know how blind people feel a persons face to get an idea of what they look like? Stevie did that and asked "who let the wookie in!?" "Wonder performed his hit songs “Isn’t She Wookie” and My Wookie Amour,” changing the lyrics to the latter song to include “My Michael Amour” while the First Wookie looked on."
- beaconstudios 10y ago
  looks to me like a bunch of offensive humour centered around the idea that Michelle is unappealing, the conspiracy/meme/joke that Michelle is actually a man (based on her being more masculine than Barack), and the fact that Stevie Wonder is blind. What's so horrifying about that? The idea that joking about a woman being masculine is transphobic and/or sexist is a left-wing concept, and something that the modern right definitely doesn't agree on. Same with jokes about Stevie Wonder being blind - you wouldn't act indignant if a comedian made a joke about it on-stage (or at least, the majority of the population wouldn't) but it's unacceptable when the joke is made by an individual? I think the issue of perception is rooted in deeply-held left beliefs that the right doesn't share. You think referring to Michelle as "ape-y" is racist because a core progressive tenet is that racism is a constant undercurrent of modern society, and that it's somehow the core motivator of anyone who isn't a progressive. Thus, you are looking to make the connection between conservative and racist. All these comments are, is mockery aimed at left-leaning individuals. The focus of the modern right on humour (driven by things like 4chan, South Park, and so on using humour to criticise the left) is such that you often find jokes and circle-jerking mixed in with critique and discussion.
- pavlov 10y ago
  beaconstudios, your reply is marked dead, but I want to comment on some points you made there. I'm really trying to understand what you're thinking. You wrote: "looks to me like a bunch of offensive humour centered around the idea that Michelle is unappealing" It's obvious to me that the "jokes" are about her being a black woman. "All these comments are, is mockery aimed at left-leaning individuals." How do you know that? How can one distinguish between actual racism and nudge-nudge-wink-wink "mockery at left-leaning people", if they look the same? Previously you blamed me of automatic attribution. Aren't you the one attributing some kind of positive ironic/humorist twist to these comments, even when there's no objective evidence of such? Can you just wave away any kind of cruelty and bullying by assuming it's a joke? In programming terms, I think of racism as duck-typed, and these comments definitely "implement the interface", so to speak. I guess you must think of racism as somehow statically typed... But I'm at a loss to understand how anything could be racism, if this isn't. (Besides, I don't understand what Mrs Obama ever did to deserve this level of meanness. As far as public figures go, she was a model of grace and compassion.)
  - beaconstudios 10y ago
    That's pretty stupid that my comment was marked dead - apparently offering insight into why something may not be racially motivated is a no-go here now? > It's obvious to me that the "jokes" are about her being a black woman. I think that depends on your perspective. I disagree about that, but neither of us can know what the poster was intending. I can't say for sure in individual cases, but what I'm trying to convey is a general attitude in the modern right. Extracting intent from text is always quite hard, especially text that is using metaphors that can be both racially charged and refer to someone being large and/or ugly. > How do you know that? How can one distinguish between actual racism and nudge-nudge-wink-wink "mockery at left-leaning people", if they look the same? I can't know it for sure, but I honestly believe that much of the discernment comes down to cultural perspective. The modern right and left are extremely culturally different when it comes to online behaviour and problems with cultural interaction and misinterpretation come into play. Consider a more extreme example of online culture: 4chan's mode of communication. Everyone calls each other "fags" and the n-word is thrown around like it's nothing. It might appear to outsiders to be a hub of extreme overty homophobia and racism, but anyone who's actively used 4chan for any period can tell you that these are cultural artifacts that arise from 4chan's values around humour, opposing social norms and in-group signalling. I could flip the script on you (or more accurately, the modern left) on this one and call out the regular articles that often start "Dear White People" as being racist. The modern left claims these statements are not racist due to their core values and cultural interpretation, which I do not share, and thus we're prone to disagree. > Aren't you the one attributing some kind of positive ironic/humorist twist to these comments, even when there's no objective evidence of such? Yes I am, because that's all I can do - after all, I didn't write the comment in question. I can, however, give you insight into a pattern of language that the right uses now that you may see as "this is 100% undeniably racist". There are many many more examples that aren't as grating as referring to a black woman as "ape-y" - that's a particularly pointed example that I can't say for sure isn't a racial attack. But I'm not trying to play judge over internet comments - I'm trying to provide a tiny bit of insight into an issue that's tearing the nation apart. > In programming terms, I think of racism as duck-typed, and these comments definitely "implement the interface", so to speak. I guess you must think of racism as somehow statically typed... But I'm at a loss to understand how anything could be racism, if this isn't. Building off the metaphor you've constructed, I could say that many comments that the left and right hold in contention only partially implement the "racism" interface, and also implement some other interface such as "humour" or "criticism" or "mockery". The left's interface definition of racism has evolved over time to encompass more and more minute complaints to the point where the "racism" interface is basically a superset of many other interfaces. Political correctness and the definition of hate speech has grown to the point where it flags up many false positives and people lose their jobs over them. Hence people rebelling against political correctness. > (Besides, I don't understand what Mrs Obama ever did to deserve this level of meanness. As far as public figures go, she was a model of grace and compassion.) I think it's largely partisanship to be honest. Both sides could be fairly accused of attacking the other just because they're the other side. The propagation of "good vs bad" morality in politics is really quite cancerous.

pavlov 10y ago

Here's some I collected in a few minutes, until I couldn't take it any more. Most of the 600+ comments are like this. "He didn't see the bulge in the First Yeti's crotch, so it all worked out!" "- So much for the story of blind people's other senses improving. He couldn't smell her bile?" "- Or jock sweat?" "Those who have seen a Sasquatch up close and personal say the stench is the first thing you notice. I think the real reason Trump is staying in NYC for the time being is to give Stanley Steamer time to get all those Cleveland Steamers out of the drapes." "They made the decision to throw the drapes away! Also paint the entire place with anti-Wookie stench paint for Purina's paint division." "Does he know he's serenading to a man?" "If he could see her...he'd likely puke and gouge his eyes out." "Yup, anyone who thought he might be faking it can rest assured, he's as blind as a bat." "He can't see the Wookie!" ""Isn't she ape-y" just doesn't have the right ring to it." "A little Braille on Micheal might answer a few questions." "Just give Mikey a quick cup check. Besides, Stevie ain't blind." "Well, to be honest, they HAD to use Stevie. Anyone else would've been turned to stone." "Serenading Chewbacca, how precious." "Stevie wonder has no idea how lucky he is to be blind singing for that sow or correction boar..." "You know how blind people feel a persons face to get an idea of what they look like? Stevie did that and asked "who let the wookie in!?" "Wonder performed his hit songs “Isn’t She Wookie” and My Wookie Amour,” changing the lyrics to the latter song to include “My Michael Amour” while the First Wookie looked on."

beaconstudios 10y ago
looks to me like a bunch of offensive humour centered around the idea that Michelle is unappealing, the conspiracy/meme/joke that Michelle is actually a man (based on her being more masculine than Barack), and the fact that Stevie Wonder is blind. What's so horrifying about that? The idea that joking about a woman being masculine is transphobic and/or sexist is a left-wing concept, and something that the modern right definitely doesn't agree on. Same with jokes about Stevie Wonder being blind - you wouldn't act indignant if a comedian made a joke about it on-stage (or at least, the majority of the population wouldn't) but it's unacceptable when the joke is made by an individual? I think the issue of perception is rooted in deeply-held left beliefs that the right doesn't share. You think referring to Michelle as "ape-y" is racist because a core progressive tenet is that racism is a constant undercurrent of modern society, and that it's somehow the core motivator of anyone who isn't a progressive. Thus, you are looking to make the connection between conservative and racist. All these comments are, is mockery aimed at left-leaning individuals. The focus of the modern right on humour (driven by things like 4chan, South Park, and so on using humour to criticise the left) is such that you often find jokes and circle-jerking mixed in with critique and discussion.
pavlov 10y ago
beaconstudios, your reply is marked dead, but I want to comment on some points you made there. I'm really trying to understand what you're thinking. You wrote: "looks to me like a bunch of offensive humour centered around the idea that Michelle is unappealing" It's obvious to me that the "jokes" are about her being a black woman. "All these comments are, is mockery aimed at left-leaning individuals." How do you know that? How can one distinguish between actual racism and nudge-nudge-wink-wink "mockery at left-leaning people", if they look the same? Previously you blamed me of automatic attribution. Aren't you the one attributing some kind of positive ironic/humorist twist to these comments, even when there's no objective evidence of such? Can you just wave away any kind of cruelty and bullying by assuming it's a joke? In programming terms, I think of racism as duck-typed, and these comments definitely "implement the interface", so to speak. I guess you must think of racism as somehow statically typed... But I'm at a loss to understand how anything could be racism, if this isn't. (Besides, I don't understand what Mrs Obama ever did to deserve this level of meanness. As far as public figures go, she was a model of grace and compassion.)
- beaconstudios 10y ago
  That's pretty stupid that my comment was marked dead - apparently offering insight into why something may not be racially motivated is a no-go here now? > It's obvious to me that the "jokes" are about her being a black woman. I think that depends on your perspective. I disagree about that, but neither of us can know what the poster was intending. I can't say for sure in individual cases, but what I'm trying to convey is a general attitude in the modern right. Extracting intent from text is always quite hard, especially text that is using metaphors that can be both racially charged and refer to someone being large and/or ugly. > How do you know that? How can one distinguish between actual racism and nudge-nudge-wink-wink "mockery at left-leaning people", if they look the same? I can't know it for sure, but I honestly believe that much of the discernment comes down to cultural perspective. The modern right and left are extremely culturally different when it comes to online behaviour and problems with cultural interaction and misinterpretation come into play. Consider a more extreme example of online culture: 4chan's mode of communication. Everyone calls each other "fags" and the n-word is thrown around like it's nothing. It might appear to outsiders to be a hub of extreme overty homophobia and racism, but anyone who's actively used 4chan for any period can tell you that these are cultural artifacts that arise from 4chan's values around humour, opposing social norms and in-group signalling. I could flip the script on you (or more accurately, the modern left) on this one and call out the regular articles that often start "Dear White People" as being racist. The modern left claims these statements are not racist due to their core values and cultural interpretation, which I do not share, and thus we're prone to disagree. > Aren't you the one attributing some kind of positive ironic/humorist twist to these comments, even when there's no objective evidence of such? Yes I am, because that's all I can do - after all, I didn't write the comment in question. I can, however, give you insight into a pattern of language that the right uses now that you may see as "this is 100% undeniably racist". There are many many more examples that aren't as grating as referring to a black woman as "ape-y" - that's a particularly pointed example that I can't say for sure isn't a racial attack. But I'm not trying to play judge over internet comments - I'm trying to provide a tiny bit of insight into an issue that's tearing the nation apart. > In programming terms, I think of racism as duck-typed, and these comments definitely "implement the interface", so to speak. I guess you must think of racism as somehow statically typed... But I'm at a loss to understand how anything could be racism, if this isn't. Building off the metaphor you've constructed, I could say that many comments that the left and right hold in contention only partially implement the "racism" interface, and also implement some other interface such as "humour" or "criticism" or "mockery". The left's interface definition of racism has evolved over time to encompass more and more minute complaints to the point where the "racism" interface is basically a superset of many other interfaces. Political correctness and the definition of hate speech has grown to the point where it flags up many false positives and people lose their jobs over them. Hence people rebelling against political correctness. > (Besides, I don't understand what Mrs Obama ever did to deserve this level of meanness. As far as public figures go, she was a model of grace and compassion.) I think it's largely partisanship to be honest. Both sides could be fairly accused of attacking the other just because they're the other side. The propagation of "good vs bad" morality in politics is really quite cancerous.