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I think the difference is that film has archival formats to keep them around. If you have a film reel you can rescan it for a new format, whether it be VHS, Bet

by jclardy 10y ago

I think the difference is that film has archival formats to keep them around. If you have a film reel you can rescan it for a new format, whether it be VHS, Betamax, DVD, Bluray, HD-DVD or whatever is next. For software we have the source code, but given Apple's iOS ecosystem you are likely tied into that platform (Especially for early software when there was little cross platform tooling.) The problem with the App Store is that neither users nor developers have a good method for keeping their apps around (other than releasing a binary for jailbroken devices.) You can't just create a DMG and host it on S3 to allow any old iOS device to install because the platform is locked down. The issue is that a lot of the history of mobile gaming is going to be lost (And some already has been with the purging of non-updated apps already happening) because the App Store is the arbiter for users obtaining software. The "simple" solution is for apple to allow users to install IPA files outside of the App Store, like Android can install APK files. Developers can build their app in an old version of Xcode and put it up for install on their own terms.

parasubvert 10y ago
Apple does allow developer users to install IPA files outside of the App Store. I can easily take an app off Github, build it with Xcode, and install it on my iPhone, for example. There are even scripts to do this similar to a "configure; make; make install", eg: https://github.com/phonegap/ios-deploy https://github.com/phonegap/ios-deploy This doesn't require the $99 it used to either, anyone can do it, though it does require you to get a free signed developer certificate from Apple which signs the app (you'll also need to tell your device to trust your cert). You can even distribute an IPA file and install it via iTunes and not the App Store, but it needs to be signed by a trusted authority (your company; your dev cert; or most likely Apple, as long as it is a non-revoked cert).
- problems 10y ago
  Seriously? That's awesome, I'm really glad Apple's taken that step in the right direction. Question though, has it had a large impact on popularity of pirated apps if you no longer have to jailbreak to use them?
  - mikeash 10y ago
    It should be noted that it's quite limited. You can only install a few of these apps on a given device, and they expire quickly. It's not really practical for sideloading in the general case.
    - saurik 10y ago
      In practice, what people do is they pay something like $5 a year to get added to a shared pool of developer accounts. In China they also had a really slick scam going for a long time involving pools of otherwise-unused enterprise certificates (though I haven't tracked this one recently, and so maybe they got hit even harder than the resigning services have been). I will also point out that for many of the use cases of piracy, which involves games and other content where the user rapidly get "bored" and moves on to other content, a limit of three at a time for only seven days doesn't matter: people can pirate a few games and play them for a weekend, and then move on to pirate other games. (If you are curious, I'm of course excited by these things and like explaining them as it further weakens the argument some people try to make that jailbreaking leads to mass piracy, something even the US Copyright Office doesn't believe; but this line of analysis makes the whole situation more obvious ;P;)
- ValentineC 10y ago
  > This doesn't require the $99 it used to either, anyone can do it, though it does require you to get a free signed developer certificate from Apple which signs the app (you'll also need to tell your device to trust your cert). There's a limit of 3 installs per device, though. And you'll have to re-sign the app every 7 days if you choose to go down this path. > You can even distribute an IPA file and install it via iTunes and not the App Store, but it needs to be signed by a trusted authority (your company; your dev cert; or most likely Apple, as long as it is a non-revoked cert). Doesn't this specifically require an Enterprise Developer account?

by jclardy 10y ago

parasubvert 10y ago

Apple does allow developer users to install IPA files outside of the App Store. I can easily take an app off Github, build it with Xcode, and install it on my iPhone, for example. There are even scripts to do this similar to a "configure; make; make install", eg: https://github.com/phonegap/ios-deploy https://github.com/phonegap/ios-deploy This doesn't require the $99 it used to either, anyone can do it, though it does require you to get a free signed developer certificate from Apple which signs the app (you'll also need to tell your device to trust your cert). You can even distribute an IPA file and install it via iTunes and not the App Store, but it needs to be signed by a trusted authority (your company; your dev cert; or most likely Apple, as long as it is a non-revoked cert).

problems 10y ago
Seriously? That's awesome, I'm really glad Apple's taken that step in the right direction. Question though, has it had a large impact on popularity of pirated apps if you no longer have to jailbreak to use them?
- mikeash 10y ago
  It should be noted that it's quite limited. You can only install a few of these apps on a given device, and they expire quickly. It's not really practical for sideloading in the general case.
  - saurik 10y ago
    In practice, what people do is they pay something like $5 a year to get added to a shared pool of developer accounts. In China they also had a really slick scam going for a long time involving pools of otherwise-unused enterprise certificates (though I haven't tracked this one recently, and so maybe they got hit even harder than the resigning services have been). I will also point out that for many of the use cases of piracy, which involves games and other content where the user rapidly get "bored" and moves on to other content, a limit of three at a time for only seven days doesn't matter: people can pirate a few games and play them for a weekend, and then move on to pirate other games. (If you are curious, I'm of course excited by these things and like explaining them as it further weakens the argument some people try to make that jailbreaking leads to mass piracy, something even the US Copyright Office doesn't believe; but this line of analysis makes the whole situation more obvious ;P;)
ValentineC 10y ago
> This doesn't require the $99 it used to either, anyone can do it, though it does require you to get a free signed developer certificate from Apple which signs the app (you'll also need to tell your device to trust your cert). There's a limit of 3 installs per device, though. And you'll have to re-sign the app every 7 days if you choose to go down this path. > You can even distribute an IPA file and install it via iTunes and not the App Store, but it needs to be signed by a trusted authority (your company; your dev cert; or most likely Apple, as long as it is a non-revoked cert). Doesn't this specifically require an Enterprise Developer account?