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I have lots of respect for spiritual people and adherents to both religious and non-religious supernatural practices, but I can't pretend that the association w

I have lots of respect for spiritual people and adherents to both religious and non-religious supernatural practices, but I can't pretend that the association with supernatural beliefs didn't put me off getting into meditation and yoga for a long time, despite the very real empirical benefits. I understand that for you these beliefs (which, whether they are true or not, are not scientifically proven, which is important for me) increase the benefit you get from meditation, but for the non-spiritual these associations are a barrier to entry that must be overcome. I now meditate regularly and love it, but I still have some measure of resistance to yoga.

metaphorm 10y ago
so...why do you call it "supernatural" practice? if you admit that there are very real, empirically verifiable benefits and results, then doesn't that make it part of nature? where's the "super" coming from? you say "these beliefs are not scientifically proven, which is important for me". What constitutes scientific proof? what do you suppose ought to be proved, that isn't proved? You already admit that there are very real benefits. A followup question for you: if you meditate regularly now, what do you meditate on? Mindfulness based stress reduction? That's like dipping your toes into an ocean.
- E6300 10y ago
  I assume that by "supernatural" and "these beliefs", the above poster is referring to the stuff about > People are like radios and broadcast their thoughts, and you'll be picking them up without knowing it.
  - metaphorm 10y ago
    that's a remarkably similar idea to what Jung called the collective unconscious. is that also a "supernatural" theory? or just psychology?
    - E6300 10y ago
      It depends. Does Jung's idea depend on mind reading? If so, then yes, it would be supernatural.
  - Anthony-G 10y ago
    > People are like radios and broadcast their thoughts, and you'll be picking them up without knowing it. I interpreted that sentence as stating that people absorb thoughts and ideas via communication with other people expressing their views. The process of adopting an idea can often be a subconscious one. On more than one occasion, I’ve had friends impart to me some useful piece of knowledge, an interesting piece of trivia or some observation about the world, only for me to point out to them that it was me that shared those thoughts with them in the first place. It’s useful to understand the source of my thoughts but for my own part, if my memory works at all, it’s doing well to retain thoughts, knowledge or ideas. I’m doing very well if I can also remember the source of the thought. My interpretation of the quoted sentence was that meditation would help one achieve that awareness.
    - E6300 10y ago
      I'm sorry, but your interpretation is simply wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi > Siddhis are spiritual, paranormal, supernatural, or otherwise magical powers, abilities, and attainments that are the products of spiritual advancement through sādhanās such as meditation and yoga. Incidentally, these are some siddhis mentioned in that article: * Reducing one's body to the size of an atom * Expanding one's body to an infinitely large size * Becoming infinitely heavy * Becoming almost weightless * Hhaving unrestricted access to all places * Realizing whatever one desires * Possessing absolute lordship * The power to subjugate all * Knowing the past, present and future * Tolerance of heat, cold and other dualities * Knowing the minds of others and so on * Checking the influence of fire, sun, water, poison, and so on * Remaining unconquered by others
dmos62 10y ago
To quote a renown yogi, "mysticism starts where mastery ends." Apart from calmness and concentration, a significant benefit provided by such practices is emotion control, meaning you can choose the emotion you want to experience. Not only stimulus and reaction decouple, but you conciously produce stimulus, and choose reactions to foreign stimuli. This concept of real choice is hard to imagine for those who haven't experienced it.

metaphorm 10y ago

so...why do you call it "supernatural" practice? if you admit that there are very real, empirically verifiable benefits and results, then doesn't that make it part of nature? where's the "super" coming from? you say "these beliefs are not scientifically proven, which is important for me". What constitutes scientific proof? what do you suppose ought to be proved, that isn't proved? You already admit that there are very real benefits. A followup question for you: if you meditate regularly now, what do you meditate on? Mindfulness based stress reduction? That's like dipping your toes into an ocean.

E6300 10y ago
I assume that by "supernatural" and "these beliefs", the above poster is referring to the stuff about > People are like radios and broadcast their thoughts, and you'll be picking them up without knowing it.
- metaphorm 10y ago
  that's a remarkably similar idea to what Jung called the collective unconscious. is that also a "supernatural" theory? or just psychology?
  - E6300 10y ago
    It depends. Does Jung's idea depend on mind reading? If so, then yes, it would be supernatural.
- Anthony-G 10y ago
  > People are like radios and broadcast their thoughts, and you'll be picking them up without knowing it. I interpreted that sentence as stating that people absorb thoughts and ideas via communication with other people expressing their views. The process of adopting an idea can often be a subconscious one. On more than one occasion, I’ve had friends impart to me some useful piece of knowledge, an interesting piece of trivia or some observation about the world, only for me to point out to them that it was me that shared those thoughts with them in the first place. It’s useful to understand the source of my thoughts but for my own part, if my memory works at all, it’s doing well to retain thoughts, knowledge or ideas. I’m doing very well if I can also remember the source of the thought. My interpretation of the quoted sentence was that meditation would help one achieve that awareness.
  - E6300 10y ago
    I'm sorry, but your interpretation is simply wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siddhi > Siddhis are spiritual, paranormal, supernatural, or otherwise magical powers, abilities, and attainments that are the products of spiritual advancement through sādhanās such as meditation and yoga. Incidentally, these are some siddhis mentioned in that article: * Reducing one's body to the size of an atom * Expanding one's body to an infinitely large size * Becoming infinitely heavy * Becoming almost weightless * Hhaving unrestricted access to all places * Realizing whatever one desires * Possessing absolute lordship * The power to subjugate all * Knowing the past, present and future * Tolerance of heat, cold and other dualities * Knowing the minds of others and so on * Checking the influence of fire, sun, water, poison, and so on * Remaining unconquered by others

dmos62 10y ago

To quote a renown yogi, "mysticism starts where mastery ends." Apart from calmness and concentration, a significant benefit provided by such practices is emotion control, meaning you can choose the emotion you want to experience. Not only stimulus and reaction decouple, but you conciously produce stimulus, and choose reactions to foreign stimuli. This concept of real choice is hard to imagine for those who haven't experienced it.