7 ms·

“The Origins of Totalitarianism“ is out of stock on Amazon

46 points by artsandsci 10y ago

chippy 10y ago
Since we are talking books - You could give The Mass Psychology of Fascism by Wilhelm Reich a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mass_Psychology_of_Fascism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mass_Psychology_of_Fascism It was banned and burnt by the Nazi's in the 1930's but significantly it was one of several books of the authors which was burnt by the US Govt. in 1956!
- mtrn 10y ago
  On a related note, Canettis main work deals with the 20th century phenomenon of the "mass" and its constituents: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowds_and_Power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowds_and_Power
- derrickdirge 10y ago
  Poor Wilhelm Reich. Whatever you think about the validity of his research, it must have been agonizing for him to watch so much of his work literally go up in flames. It's hard to imagine how such destruction of knowledge could ever be justified. If you are, or plan to be, in the New England area, I highly recommend visiting 'Orgonon', Reich's former home and current museum in Rangeley, Maine. It's fascinating and tragic.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
hugh4life 10y ago
Meh, you're better off reading this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Need_for_Roots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Need_for_Roots
- maldusiecle 10y ago
  Simone Weil's work is fascinating and enlightening, certainly worth exploring if you've never been exposed to it before. That said, if you're looking for concrete political understanding, probably don't read the work of a French mystic who starved herself to death.
  - mlmlmasd 10y ago
    > That said, if you're looking for concrete political understanding, probably don't read the work of a French mystic who starved herself to death. That's like saying 'probably don't concern yourself with Godel's mathematics because he was mentally ill and starved himself to death'. Such a stupid reason to look down on someone's work for.
    - AnimalMuppet 10y ago
      Well, "mystic" and "concrete political understanding" don't coexist very comfortably. "Starved herself to death" may still be irrelevant, though...
      - mlmlmasd 10y ago
        Not really, there is nothing about being labeled a 'mystic' that means the person is less politically informed. The Catholic Popes are arguably in the same bucket but were and are some of the most politically informed and influential people on the planet. Simone Weil was very politically active and quite well informed.
Semiapies 10y ago
I remember a lot of people buying The Road to Serfdom eight years ago. Then, as now, I wonder how many bothered to read it.
- mlmlmasd 10y ago
  > I remember a lot of people buying The Road to Serfdom eight years ago. Not sure how that's relevant.
  - AnimalMuppet 10y ago
    Because the same panic was happening when Obama came into office. It was just the other side that was doing the panicking.
MrZongle2 10y ago
More Trump hysteria. After the last two months of temper-tantrums, you'd think that the checks and balances within the US government were a work of fiction and GOP brownshirts were roaming the streets, beating up anyone who didn't adhere to the Aryan ideal. Rational thought has been replaced with emotional, knee-jerk responses and panic in many circles. It's pathetic.
- AnimalMuppet 10y ago
  There's a fear that this time, the checks and balances may fail. And they operate slowly, so to people who have grown used to internet time, it looks like they're failing. I remain guardedly optimistic, but I understand the concern.
  - MrZongle2 10y ago
    On one hand, I think that under any administration -- whether they are new or newly re-elected -- Americans should warily view the actions of the Executive branch. I think we're all in agreement that those checks and balances are important, and I think most of us would agree that there's little good in weakening them for whatever reason. After an election won by Team Coke, then it is natural for Team Pepsi to be unhappy and view everything that Team Coke does with skepticism. It's also expected that some supporters of Team Pepsi hope that Team Coke stumbles a bit, gets egg on their face, and generally looks bad while taking a victory lap. But I think we're a bit beyond that. To move to a more specific analogy, we're at the "Glenn Beck telling his audience about Obama's FEMA camps" stage of hysteria and nonsense, writ large. This mania has crept into just about every facet of American life at this point that involves the Internet or the media. It's built upon a foundation of hearsay and rumor -- the Trump administration has been in power for less than two weeks and has signed no legislation into law, implemented 8 Executive Orders, and has appointed zero judges. Concern is fine. Concern implies vigilance and understanding. What we're seeing is more akin to frenzy.
- akiselev 10y ago
  Checks and balances work on a societal level and our judicial system is deliberate and slow (as it should be). While legal challenges are resolved, literally millions of people can be caught in the crossfire between ideologies, causing unimaginable harm to them and our society. I'm happy none of this has impacted you yet, but many of us know how this slippery slope goes after watching first hand how it happens in other countries. Many of us have friends and relatives who we are afraid won't be able to return to the lives they've built here. Many of us are scared that we're next. If you don't panic when the very ideals of your democracy face an existential threat, it won't be around much longer.
loudtieblahblah 10y ago
I really wish Manufacturing Consent was as well. Of all the talks of "fake news", I've not seen anyone even mention this institutional analysis of the media.
madcaptenor 10y ago
The Kindle version is $1.99, though.
stcredzero 10y ago
What disturbs me most in recent years, is the lack of self-awareness concerning groupthink among fellow members of the left in the US. I keep seeing thinking and behavior along these lines: Because the other side are so horrible in their views/morals we are justified in doing bad things to them. People seem to think that being "on the side of justice" means they can emotionally wound, attack the livelihood, shout down, or physically/bureaucratically exclude people whose views they do not like. Gandhi had a phrase for this: "An eye for an eye, making the whole world blind." Just because "the other side" is so horrible, doesn't mean you are justified in going not quite as far. Being on the side of justice means according all of your fellow human beings the same rights and respect, even your opponents and even your "enemies." A democratic society whose leaders no longer stand up for principles is a society that is breaking down. A movement that claims it is about "justice" but which doesn't stand up for principles -- even when it comes to calling its "own side" into account -- is philosophically and ethically bankrupt.
- liberte82 10y ago
  I agree completely. I think people are panicking and being pushed one way or the other. We need to remember our kindness and empathy now more than ever.
  - stcredzero 10y ago
    We need to remember our kindness and empathy now more than ever. When someone says this, it's time to run, or maybe a little late for that.
- loki49152 10y ago
  It will all become clear to you when you accept that it was the American Left who inspired the Fascists, Bolsheviks, and Nazis in Europe. All of them were leftist/socialist ideological movements. All of them copied policies that the American Progressives had put in place years before. You are not fighting them. You are them.
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
gech 10y ago
I believe Eric Hoffer is a worthy and relevant addition to this thread. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer

46 points by artsandsci 10y ago

Since we are talking books - You could give The Mass Psychology of Fascism by Wilhelm Reich a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mass_Psychology_of_Fascism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mass_Psychology_of_Fascism It was banned and burnt by the Nazi's in the 1930's but significantly it was one of several books of the authors which was burnt by the US Govt. in 1956!

mtrn 10y ago
On a related note, Canettis main work deals with the 20th century phenomenon of the "mass" and its constituents: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowds_and_Power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowds_and_Power
derrickdirge 10y ago
Poor Wilhelm Reich. Whatever you think about the validity of his research, it must have been agonizing for him to watch so much of his work literally go up in flames. It's hard to imagine how such destruction of knowledge could ever be justified. If you are, or plan to be, in the New England area, I highly recommend visiting 'Orgonon', Reich's former home and current museum in Rangeley, Maine. It's fascinating and tragic.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

hugh4life 10y ago

Meh, you're better off reading this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Need_for_Roots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Need_for_Roots

maldusiecle 10y ago
Simone Weil's work is fascinating and enlightening, certainly worth exploring if you've never been exposed to it before. That said, if you're looking for concrete political understanding, probably don't read the work of a French mystic who starved herself to death.
- mlmlmasd 10y ago
  > That said, if you're looking for concrete political understanding, probably don't read the work of a French mystic who starved herself to death. That's like saying 'probably don't concern yourself with Godel's mathematics because he was mentally ill and starved himself to death'. Such a stupid reason to look down on someone's work for.
  - AnimalMuppet 10y ago
    Well, "mystic" and "concrete political understanding" don't coexist very comfortably. "Starved herself to death" may still be irrelevant, though...
    - mlmlmasd 10y ago
      Not really, there is nothing about being labeled a 'mystic' that means the person is less politically informed. The Catholic Popes are arguably in the same bucket but were and are some of the most politically informed and influential people on the planet. Simone Weil was very politically active and quite well informed.

Semiapies 10y ago

I remember a lot of people buying The Road to Serfdom eight years ago. Then, as now, I wonder how many bothered to read it.

mlmlmasd 10y ago
> I remember a lot of people buying The Road to Serfdom eight years ago. Not sure how that's relevant.
- AnimalMuppet 10y ago
  Because the same panic was happening when Obama came into office. It was just the other side that was doing the panicking.

MrZongle2 10y ago

More Trump hysteria. After the last two months of temper-tantrums, you'd think that the checks and balances within the US government were a work of fiction and GOP brownshirts were roaming the streets, beating up anyone who didn't adhere to the Aryan ideal. Rational thought has been replaced with emotional, knee-jerk responses and panic in many circles. It's pathetic.

AnimalMuppet 10y ago
There's a fear that this time, the checks and balances may fail. And they operate slowly, so to people who have grown used to internet time, it looks like they're failing. I remain guardedly optimistic, but I understand the concern.
- MrZongle2 10y ago
  On one hand, I think that under any administration -- whether they are new or newly re-elected -- Americans should warily view the actions of the Executive branch. I think we're all in agreement that those checks and balances are important, and I think most of us would agree that there's little good in weakening them for whatever reason. After an election won by Team Coke, then it is natural for Team Pepsi to be unhappy and view everything that Team Coke does with skepticism. It's also expected that some supporters of Team Pepsi hope that Team Coke stumbles a bit, gets egg on their face, and generally looks bad while taking a victory lap. But I think we're a bit beyond that. To move to a more specific analogy, we're at the "Glenn Beck telling his audience about Obama's FEMA camps" stage of hysteria and nonsense, writ large. This mania has crept into just about every facet of American life at this point that involves the Internet or the media. It's built upon a foundation of hearsay and rumor -- the Trump administration has been in power for less than two weeks and has signed no legislation into law, implemented 8 Executive Orders, and has appointed zero judges. Concern is fine. Concern implies vigilance and understanding. What we're seeing is more akin to frenzy.
akiselev 10y ago
Checks and balances work on a societal level and our judicial system is deliberate and slow (as it should be). While legal challenges are resolved, literally millions of people can be caught in the crossfire between ideologies, causing unimaginable harm to them and our society. I'm happy none of this has impacted you yet, but many of us know how this slippery slope goes after watching first hand how it happens in other countries. Many of us have friends and relatives who we are afraid won't be able to return to the lives they've built here. Many of us are scared that we're next. If you don't panic when the very ideals of your democracy face an existential threat, it won't be around much longer.

loudtieblahblah 10y ago

I really wish Manufacturing Consent was as well. Of all the talks of "fake news", I've not seen anyone even mention this institutional analysis of the media.

madcaptenor 10y ago

The Kindle version is $1.99, though.

stcredzero 10y ago

What disturbs me most in recent years, is the lack of self-awareness concerning groupthink among fellow members of the left in the US. I keep seeing thinking and behavior along these lines: Because the other side are so horrible in their views/morals we are justified in doing bad things to them. People seem to think that being "on the side of justice" means they can emotionally wound, attack the livelihood, shout down, or physically/bureaucratically exclude people whose views they do not like. Gandhi had a phrase for this: "An eye for an eye, making the whole world blind." Just because "the other side" is so horrible, doesn't mean you are justified in going not quite as far. Being on the side of justice means according all of your fellow human beings the same rights and respect, even your opponents and even your "enemies." A democratic society whose leaders no longer stand up for principles is a society that is breaking down. A movement that claims it is about "justice" but which doesn't stand up for principles -- even when it comes to calling its "own side" into account -- is philosophically and ethically bankrupt.

liberte82 10y ago
I agree completely. I think people are panicking and being pushed one way or the other. We need to remember our kindness and empathy now more than ever.
- stcredzero 10y ago
  We need to remember our kindness and empathy now more than ever. When someone says this, it's time to run, or maybe a little late for that.
loki49152 10y ago
It will all become clear to you when you accept that it was the American Left who inspired the Fascists, Bolsheviks, and Nazis in Europe. All of them were leftist/socialist ideological movements. All of them copied policies that the American Progressives had put in place years before. You are not fighting them. You are them.
- dragonwriter 10y ago

gech 10y ago

I believe Eric Hoffer is a worthy and relevant addition to this thread. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer