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Yep. Sadly, it seems HN may be getting overrun by Trump apologists. Where's the next good place to be after HN gets gaslighted to not knowing the meaning of w

Yep. Sadly, it seems HN may be getting overrun by Trump apologists. Where's the next good place to be after HN gets gaslighted to not knowing the meaning of words?

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
hueving 10y ago
>gaslighted Let's not use that term here. It's just an appeal to ridicule dressed up as something meaningful.
- metafunctor 10y ago
  No attempt to ridicule here, just an attempt to convey a concept in one word. Gaslighting, I think, means a kind of manipulation where seeds of doubt are gradually sown, questioning the targets' perception and sanity. I still think it's a great word to use if someone tries to claim that banning entire countries and their citizens is not racist.
  - hueving 10y ago
    Yes, and labeling behavior as that concept is an appeal to ridicule. You are classifying something you disagree with as something designed to mess with your perception of reality rather than actually intellectually engaging it. >banning entire countries and their citizens is not racist Because it's not in most cases (unless a particular race only comes from that set of banned countries). It's xenophobic. Please use the correct terms if you are going to level such strong accusations to such large numbers of people you don't seem to have any understanding of.
    - selllikesybok 10y ago
      Racist xenophobia, to be extra accurate.
    - grzm 10y ago
      With respect to the word racist and its usage, I think we're in the midst of watching it expand its meaning. I'm not sure what to think about it, given that I both strive to use words carefully and precisely, while also understanding that language changes and attempts to control it can prove ultimately (frustratingly?) futile. I'd hate for that to be one more thing that gets in the way of effective communication, particularly on difficult issues like this. After all, the point is ultimately to communicate: if we let strict adherence to a single definition of a word from getting in the way of understanding. Better to just ask what meaning is being used if necessary, while perhaps lamenting the loss in precision in silence.
      - flukus 10y ago
        Racist seems to be expanding and contracting. The whole "you can't be racist against white people" thing has been gaining traction lately. It's quickly becoming a word devoid of all meaning.
        grzm 10y ago
        That's a separate issue in finding common ground as to what amounts to negative discrimination. I'm definitely not interested in litigating this one.
akjainaj 10y ago
I flagged it because 1) I'm tired of so many articles about politics here, 2) the author sounds like a whining brat, 3) if you don't like what's been elected you are going to have to deal with it.
- tqwcs 10y ago
  So we all have to wait 4 years to complain about Trump? We can't try to do what we can to stop his policies now? I remember the Republicans trying to stop Obama for 8 years.
  - akjainaj 10y ago
    You can do whatever you want about Trump, I simply had enough of reading about it on Hacker News. These articles are not of my interest, and I don't think so many of them belong in this site, so I flag them because I don't want to see any more of them here. I am not speaking for the rest of people who flagged them, of course. Just for myself.
- mikeash 10y ago
  Complaining about it is part of dealing with it. If we can mount enough public pressure, maybe we can get this madman impeached before he does something irreversible.
  - akjainaj 10y ago
    The only way he's getting impeached is if he does something illegal. Taking into account how the spotlight is on him 24/7, I'm sure he won't do anything dumb that could get him impeached. I like Pence much better than Trump, but nope, that's not going to happen.
    - mikeash 10y ago
      There are good arguments that he already has. But ultimately, it doesn't matter. Although technically speaking he needs to break the law to be impeached, in practice you just need a majority of the House to impeach, and two thirds of the Senate to convict. If Congress doesn't want to remove the President, it doesn't matter what laws he breaks. If Congress does want to remove him, then they'll find some legal excuse to justify it. There's no official oversight of the process, nobody to say "no, that crime didn't happen" or "that crime doesn't qualify for impeachment."
justinlaster 10y ago
I called this out a few months ago, and got told by a moderator to not employ conspiracy theories. Yet, week by week, I watch as brand new accounts show up on these types of posts to spout the same short-sighted, toxic talking points that always get vomited out by Trump supporters. They don't say anything related to technology, they always tend to comment on political posts. I've been watching a few accounts and there has been no change in behavior. This is not a left vs right issue. A lot of these people forgo basic philosophical principles about knowledge, and seem to shun any use of logic and reason (part of the reason you will not get anywhere by engaging them, they simply don't care).
- willstrafach 10y ago
  > Yet, week by week, I watch as brand new accounts show up on these types of posts to spout the same short-sighted, toxic talking points that always get vomited out by Trump supporters. I have noticed this as well and did not mention until recently, thought I was overthinking it. Good to see some others noticing this.
gonvaled 10y ago
I flagged it for two reasons: 1) Internal american politics: other political issues are promptly flagged, while UK and USA political issues fare better. I do not accept that. 2) Lots of citizens (and others) in the USA are up in arms about this, while the real suffering that the USA is causing around the world (read "killing innocent civilians") does not get noticed anymore. You seem to be outraged about this because it is a new policy which makes the USA look bad, but you do not seem to be outraged in the same way by long standing policies practiced by all US presidents which are actually having a worse impact in the world. Obama got a Nobel Peace Prize on his second day on office and did not even close Guantanamo ffs.
analbeads 10y ago
I cannot imagine how thick of a bubble one would have to be living in for HN to seem like it is "overrun by Trump apologists"
grzm 10y ago
Sadly, it seems HN may be getting overrun by Trump apologists. The HN community is pretty diverse, including both members who support Trump and those who don't. That diversity is important, because, among other things, I don't think any of us are accurately and wholly described by a single test, ideological or otherwise. While you might very strongly disagree with members on a particular issue or issues, it's important to remain civil and respectful, even more so on contentious issues.

Yep. Sadly, it seems HN may be getting overrun by Trump apologists. Where's the next good place to be after HN gets gaslighted to not knowing the meaning of words?

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

hueving 10y ago

>gaslighted Let's not use that term here. It's just an appeal to ridicule dressed up as something meaningful.

metafunctor 10y ago
No attempt to ridicule here, just an attempt to convey a concept in one word. Gaslighting, I think, means a kind of manipulation where seeds of doubt are gradually sown, questioning the targets' perception and sanity. I still think it's a great word to use if someone tries to claim that banning entire countries and their citizens is not racist.
- hueving 10y ago
  Yes, and labeling behavior as that concept is an appeal to ridicule. You are classifying something you disagree with as something designed to mess with your perception of reality rather than actually intellectually engaging it. >banning entire countries and their citizens is not racist Because it's not in most cases (unless a particular race only comes from that set of banned countries). It's xenophobic. Please use the correct terms if you are going to level such strong accusations to such large numbers of people you don't seem to have any understanding of.
  - selllikesybok 10y ago
    Racist xenophobia, to be extra accurate.
  - grzm 10y ago
    With respect to the word racist and its usage, I think we're in the midst of watching it expand its meaning. I'm not sure what to think about it, given that I both strive to use words carefully and precisely, while also understanding that language changes and attempts to control it can prove ultimately (frustratingly?) futile. I'd hate for that to be one more thing that gets in the way of effective communication, particularly on difficult issues like this. After all, the point is ultimately to communicate: if we let strict adherence to a single definition of a word from getting in the way of understanding. Better to just ask what meaning is being used if necessary, while perhaps lamenting the loss in precision in silence.
    - flukus 10y ago
      Racist seems to be expanding and contracting. The whole "you can't be racist against white people" thing has been gaining traction lately. It's quickly becoming a word devoid of all meaning.
      - grzm 10y ago
        That's a separate issue in finding common ground as to what amounts to negative discrimination. I'm definitely not interested in litigating this one.

akjainaj 10y ago

I flagged it because 1) I'm tired of so many articles about politics here, 2) the author sounds like a whining brat, 3) if you don't like what's been elected you are going to have to deal with it.

tqwcs 10y ago
So we all have to wait 4 years to complain about Trump? We can't try to do what we can to stop his policies now? I remember the Republicans trying to stop Obama for 8 years.
- akjainaj 10y ago
  You can do whatever you want about Trump, I simply had enough of reading about it on Hacker News. These articles are not of my interest, and I don't think so many of them belong in this site, so I flag them because I don't want to see any more of them here. I am not speaking for the rest of people who flagged them, of course. Just for myself.
mikeash 10y ago
Complaining about it is part of dealing with it. If we can mount enough public pressure, maybe we can get this madman impeached before he does something irreversible.
- akjainaj 10y ago
  The only way he's getting impeached is if he does something illegal. Taking into account how the spotlight is on him 24/7, I'm sure he won't do anything dumb that could get him impeached. I like Pence much better than Trump, but nope, that's not going to happen.
  - mikeash 10y ago
    There are good arguments that he already has. But ultimately, it doesn't matter. Although technically speaking he needs to break the law to be impeached, in practice you just need a majority of the House to impeach, and two thirds of the Senate to convict. If Congress doesn't want to remove the President, it doesn't matter what laws he breaks. If Congress does want to remove him, then they'll find some legal excuse to justify it. There's no official oversight of the process, nobody to say "no, that crime didn't happen" or "that crime doesn't qualify for impeachment."

justinlaster 10y ago

I called this out a few months ago, and got told by a moderator to not employ conspiracy theories. Yet, week by week, I watch as brand new accounts show up on these types of posts to spout the same short-sighted, toxic talking points that always get vomited out by Trump supporters. They don't say anything related to technology, they always tend to comment on political posts. I've been watching a few accounts and there has been no change in behavior. This is not a left vs right issue. A lot of these people forgo basic philosophical principles about knowledge, and seem to shun any use of logic and reason (part of the reason you will not get anywhere by engaging them, they simply don't care).

willstrafach 10y ago
> Yet, week by week, I watch as brand new accounts show up on these types of posts to spout the same short-sighted, toxic talking points that always get vomited out by Trump supporters. I have noticed this as well and did not mention until recently, thought I was overthinking it. Good to see some others noticing this.

gonvaled 10y ago

I flagged it for two reasons: 1) Internal american politics: other political issues are promptly flagged, while UK and USA political issues fare better. I do not accept that. 2) Lots of citizens (and others) in the USA are up in arms about this, while the real suffering that the USA is causing around the world (read "killing innocent civilians") does not get noticed anymore. You seem to be outraged about this because it is a new policy which makes the USA look bad, but you do not seem to be outraged in the same way by long standing policies practiced by all US presidents which are actually having a worse impact in the world. Obama got a Nobel Peace Prize on his second day on office and did not even close Guantanamo ffs.

analbeads 10y ago

I cannot imagine how thick of a bubble one would have to be living in for HN to seem like it is "overrun by Trump apologists"

grzm 10y ago

Sadly, it seems HN may be getting overrun by Trump apologists. The HN community is pretty diverse, including both members who support Trump and those who don't. That diversity is important, because, among other things, I don't think any of us are accurately and wholly described by a single test, ideological or otherwise. While you might very strongly disagree with members on a particular issue or issues, it's important to remain civil and respectful, even more so on contentious issues.