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This is not hyperbole: if this statement is accurate, a coup d'etat is in progress in which our illegitimate "President" is overriding the authority of the judi
by Tulip68 10y ago
This is not hyperbole: if this statement is accurate, a coup d'etat is in progress in which our illegitimate "President" is overriding the authority of the judicial branch and it is time for every American who still believes in our constitution and our fundamental values of equality, diversity and multiculturalism take a stand and along with every congressman, every law enforcement officer, reporter, corporation, etc. to put aside petty partisan bickering and remove this fascist con-man from office immediately. If we don't, history will judge us all the same way as we judge those who looked aside while Hitler made a mockery out of his country's democratic institutions en route to handing himself supreme power.
I cannot overstate the danger we are all in every day this psychopathic fascist is allowed to remain in that office. He must be stopped immediately. Our most fundamental and cherished values are at stake here.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- douche 10y agoIts interesting how overreach in executive orders on one side is greeted as business as usual, versus being viewed as grounds for secession when the shoe is on the other foot
- matthewmacleod 10y agoNo, it's not that interesting. Context obviously matters, and I am baffled that so many people are pretending not to understand that.
- douche 10y agoWhat the hell is this context that you speak of? Defending the country's borders? Defending native industry? Preventing immigration from groups statistically likely to commit terrorist acts?
- DavidSJ 10y agoLiterally not a single terrorist attack has been committed on US soil by individuals from the affected countries in the last 42 years.
- Tulip68 10y agoThe statistics on these people committing terrorism is literally zero. Not a single act of terrorism within the United States has been committed by a single person from any of these targeted countries. The statistics are unambiguously clear that you are statistically far more at risk from some white Christian guy who's obsessed with abortion than from some frightened refugee just looking for a roof over her/his head who happens to be of the Muslim faith.
- cmurf 10y agoSending Jews on boats back to Germany because they might not be refugees but Nazis looking to infiltrate the mainland? Scared little bunny rabbits. Go scurry and hide rather than demand the rest of the world live in fear with you.
- dang 10y agoCommenting like this will get your account banned, so please don't do it. Comments here need to become more civil and substantive, not less, as topics get more divisive. If you can't do that, please don't post. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html Also, please don't use HN primarily for political battle. That's an abuse of this site, and we ban accounts that do it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515696 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515696.
- cmurf 10y agoI have a substantial history on HN aside from commenting on recent politics. And it's a gross distortion that you assert I've used this account primarily for "political battle". The parent asked a question "Preventing immigration from groups statistically likely to commit terrorist acts?" and I answered it with a rhetorical question based on historical fact. Jewish refugees were returned to Germany under the auspices that they might be Nazis and threaten the security of the U.S. and they were murdered as a result. The context of this entire thread is an executive order made on the International Holocaust Remembrance Day, a day in part, we remember how complicit we were in the murder of Jewish refugees by not protecting them, all because we were scared of hypotheticals rather than stand up for refugees. The ensuing national guilt is why we established the refugee policies we've had since WWII. Those policy makers refusing these refugees deserved to be called scared bunny rabbits, that's what they were and innocent people died because of the con game we played: that refugees were likely to commit terrorist acts. Calling them scared bunny rabbits is a kindness, and it is polite, and it is civil. Imagine what I really think. http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11/10/trump-election-autocracy-rules-for-survival/ http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11/10/trump-election-autoc... Now, if you folks can't handle political conversations, ban the submissions, not the ensuing discussions.
- kyrre 10y agohttp://quietkit.com/box-breathing/ http://quietkit.com/box-breathing/
- aerovistae 10y agoAgain, I will point out that the article linked to here says they will ALSO continue to comply with all judicial orders. Read carefully. Really, the entire statement isn't that exciting, it just says "Agency will continue to follow legal structure of government as all agencies do." Mostly it's just an attempt to reassure people that things aren't as out of hand as they seem.
- skuhn 10y agoIf the point is actually to reassure the reader, the tone is completely off. I don't find seething rage to be very reassuring.
- Aloha 10y agoIt depends on the ideology of the reader its trying to reassure.
- timClicks 10y agoYou left out contempt and complete lack of sympathy. People die without access to asylum.
- skuhn 10y agoNo one has the right to demand entry! (especially not people we gave green cards and visas to after subjecting them to years, or decades, of bureacracy and vetting)
- aerovistae 10y agoI agree completely.
- org3432 10y agoThe point of the article is clearly to show they're not complying with the court order.
- org3432 10y ago
- jquery 10y agoCongress has given the Executive broad powers to control immigration from countries. Please explain how a coup d'etat is happening. Obama bombed many of these countries and killed citizens of them, but I don't remember that being a scandal.
- closeparen 10y agoA federal judge issued an injunction against enforcement of part of the executive order. In a release titled "Response To Recent Litigation," DHS announced that it would continue to enforce the order. That sounds for all the world like the executive branch rejecting the authority of the judicial branch.
- jquery 10y agoIANAL but the injunction was narrow in scope. Nothing in the DHS response contradicts that.
- pduszak 10y agoThe very first line implies that the injunction will be ignored. If they didn't want that interpreted that way, then they should have definitely written it differently.
- anarazel 10y agoThe injunction was only about travelers in flight or already landed. Most of those have been released. The statement says "in a foreign land" and "without ties to the United States" - which is outside of what the injunction applies to.
- icelancer 10y agoYes, because the stay is not permanent. It only applies to those in transit and those affected now. The statement then goes on to say: "The Department of Homeland Security will comply with judicial orders..." So no, the executive branch is not rejecting the authority of the judicial branch.
- 10y ago
- gotchange 10y agoThe ball now is in the Judiciary's court. If this dept goes rogue, they should intervene and make some arrests for people violating the court orders and laws. This looks day after day like a classical far-right takeover of the govt and people in the US should be really alarmed by these developments.
- sdenton4 10y agoExecutive branch is the arm that makes arrests, though. If the executive decides to ignore the courts, we done here, no more Constitution.
- cmurf 10y agoAlarmed also at their own naivety: Central Park Five, Birtherism, Steve Bannon the president's chief strategist and senior counsel and white nationalist former operator of Breitbart.com. The writing has been on the wall the whole time. Checkout the other executive order, the shakeup of the national security council which now has two conspiracy theorists on it (three if the president is included). Don't count on Congressional Republicans to fix this. They've used coded bigotry since 1968. And now it's become uncoded. But either way always consistently there is the bigotry. Now maybe some Republicans finally have an OMFG moment and can now actually hear the dirty dog whistle, and will revaluate. But for Pence, Ryan, McConnell, it's too late. We keep failing each test. We couldn't flick them off at the primary. And then not at the general. At each step it gets harder and harder to fix, by design. The policy is sadistic. They are attacking the weakest among us. It's easy for them to do it, and amounts to a test, how much they can get away with.
- wfunction 10y ago-1 downvoted, this is definitely hyperbole.
- peterwwillis 10y agoThat did, in fact, include hyperbole. You are excited and over estimating the danger, and misstating facts such as his legitimacy. Those kind of things will cloud the discussion and prevent support from the kind of groups you need to defeat him. The smart move would be to collect information and watch him fail, then move for impeachment. Then start dealing with Pence.....
- Tulip68 10y agoIt is not absolutely not hyperbole. And, based on your username, I will venture a guess that you are privileged white male who is fortunate enough to not (for now) be among Drumpf's scapegoats. I challenge you to speak to some of the thousands of Muslims, refugees, undocumented migrants and others whose very existence is threatened by this fascist "President" and see if they think I'm engaging in hyperbole. Do. Not. Minimize. The. Danger. We. Are. All. In. Just. Because. You. Are. A. Privileged. White. Person.
- peterwwillis 10y agoIs this a troll?
- XiaomiFan 10y agoDon't waste your time with people like this. Do not acknowledge them.
- myrandomcomment 10y agoTrump is an asshole however he is our legitimate president no mater how much some of us do not like it. He won the election as the rules require. Period. Let's not forget that. The office should be respected no matter what asswipe he is in it. If you disagree with his policies then call your congressman, et. al. Protest by all means. That is your right as an American. He was elected because a large majority of people in individual states did not follow thought with their duty to vote pure and simple. Let's make sure that those voices are heard and we do not make this same mistake in 4 years. The man scares the hell out of me but I am not going to say he is not the ligitimate president because he won and I do not like him. It is our duty to protest and make our voice heard if we disagree. It would have been great if we did the before the election but your fellow Americans did not and we have to live with that. Please do not give me any bulsshit about the popular vote because that is not they way the rules work. If you do not like that then do something about it. He, president trump is the president no matter how much it sucks.
- sdenton4 10y agoDisregarding the system of checks and balances means he's not acting within the system of government. This is a constitutional crisis.
- grzm 10y agoAs I understand it, your parent is (if verbosely) pointing out the use of the phrase our illegitimate "President", and points out that we can and should be protesting. These points aren't in contradiction of yours. Indeed, depending on the outcome of everything surrounding this Executive Order, your point as well as those of your parent may all well be true.
- pduszak 10y agoAnd his point is that the president doesn't have the right to override judicial ruling? He's a president, not an emperor.
- icelancer 10y ago
- tn13 10y ago> put aside petty partisan bickering and remove this fascist con-man from office immediately. All I see is the fascist partisan bickering in your post. Trump has legitimately won the election and is doing what his powers let him do. He was clear about Muslim ban before election too and people voted for him. I think we can make better arguments as to why his moronic executive orders hurt USA in a major way and perhaps work to gather political support to reduce the damage but getting angry and abusive does not help.
- Tulip68 10y agoHe lost the popular vote by millions of votes. The majority of America has made it very clear they do not want this fascist to be their President and the only reason he got through is because of Russian hacking our election to try and throw our country into chaos (and boy have they ever succeeded). And don't you dare lecture me about getting "angry" over this. Why don't you learn some empathy and consider how you'd feel if you were among the millions of Muslims, refugees and undocumented migrants whose very existence is at stake thanks to some angry old white people who are so afraid of brown people coming into the country they thought they'd teach us all a lesson by voting for a failed businessman con-artist turned neo-fascist politician for President.
- grzm 10y agoHe lost the popular vote by millions of votes. True. That said, the popular vote does not matter in any sense other than showing how the country as a whole is pretty evenly divided. If the popular vote (as opposed to the Electoral College) were the deciding factor in the election, the campaigns and GOTV efforts would have been run very differently, and the result wouldn't likely look like it did. Don't get me wrong, this is very important. The fact that the country was closely split along in an election for historically unfavorable candidates shows just how dissatisfied voters were as a whole with both candidates, and how much work we can do to find common ground—surely there is some: many (most?) people aren't single-issue voters. (The fact that the Electoral College results and the popular vote results haven't been in agreement is definitely a problems as well, and one that should be addressed. But that's a separate issue, and not the rules the 2016 election was conducted under.)
- icelancer 10y ago>The Department of Homeland Security will comply with judicial orders The President is not issuing a coup. It says directly in the statement they will comply with the judicial orders.
- mdsfwrz 10y agoThere is wide misconception about what the court stays were on-- they actually prevented deportation, not detention. DHS did not say they were going to deport people against the court orders.
- mdsfwrz 10y agoSource: https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/825593794875813888 https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/825593794875813888 And in Mass (and Mass only) now they are not allowed to detain: https://twitter.com/sdooling/status/825602397007409153 https://twitter.com/sdooling/status/825602397007409153 Although some are reporting otherwise: http://nypost.com/2017/01/29/customs-agents-ignore-judge-enforce-trumps-travel-ban-aclu/ http://nypost.com/2017/01/29/customs-agents-ignore-judge-enf... It seems they are mistaken
- downandout 10y ago>...a coup d'etat is in progress in which our illegitimate "President..." Well there's a rational statement. We had an election. Trump won it, under the rules which have been in place for centuries. Clinton knew what the rules were as well, and she didn't play the game as well. Another country attempted to influence public opinion during the election, which has also been going on for centuries. I assume your "illegitimate President" comment is due to the leaked emails. If the Hillary/DNC emails had all been about how they were going to work hard for America, then the leak wouldn't have affected her and would have actually helped her. Instead, they were about unethical and illegal activity aimed at ensuring she won the election. If you engage in that sort of thing as a Presidential candidate/political party executive, you should get caught and you should lose.
- random_upvoter 10y agoI'm sorry but this is exactly hyperbole. In a democracy you have elections, and the person who wins the election is invested with certain powers for a limited amount of time. If you want to undermine the whole game just because Trump is unpalatable to you, proceed at your own risk. You may set in motion a self-fulfilling catastrophe much worse than the worst Trump could ever do. At the very least keep in mind that roughly half of the country wanted Trump for president. Have you considered how they might feel about deposing the person they voted for?
- cmurf 10y agoYes exactly. Nixon's approval was about 24% upon departure. It will take far more damage than this ban to get an approval rating low enough to motivate and give cover to this Congress.
- gwright 10y agoI find this sort of overwrought rhetoric more disturbing than lawful, if objectionable, policy changes. We've got institutional processes for dealing with executive branch policies that we disagree with. It certainly looks like the legislature and the judiciary are responding and peaceful assembly and protest can help motivate change as can healthy reporting by the press. On the other hand you are advocating for overthrow of the government and a complete disregard for the democratic process and the rule of law. Instead of arguing on the merits your spit out overwrought accusations of fraudulent, fascist, and psychotic behavior. Our most cherished value is that of the rule of law. Even in the presence of flawed policies and corrupt practices, belief and adherence to the rule of law provides a way to respond to and rectify these mistakes. Asserting that things are so bad that the rule of law should be disregarded and that someone should be removed from office because you don't agree with their lawful policy changes is a certain path to disaster.
- smsm42 10y agoNew rule: if post starts with "this is not a hyperbole", the chance of it being hyperbole are >95%. So far confirms very well.
- hyperdunc 10y agoSince when are diversity and multiculturalism part of our fundamental values? There's certainly an argument to be made that diversity of thought and behavior has a net positive effect on society. However, it's become apparent that the dogma of multiculturalism is causing major problems where a certain religion is concerned. We'd be foolish to ignore this fact.