4 ms·

This is ridiculous. What's the argumentation? Are non-asian people withheld from positions or unable to start startups because of Asian people? Or, are people f

This is ridiculous. What's the argumentation? Are non-asian people withheld from positions or unable to start startups because of Asian people? Or, are people from less privileged societies/economies more driven towards success/entrepreneurship? Is there space for lucid and argumented discussion when these kind of statements are being made at all? edit: ok. I get it. Not all that thinly-veiled "not white people hurr durr" talk/racism. No point of discussion.

otalp 10y ago
He's talking about Steve Bannon, Trump's main advisor, who ran Brietbart, which hosts plenty of White Supremacists. That's basically the argument- Asians aren't Americans, we need more of 'us' at the top. That's why Bannon will complain about too many Asian CEOs but won't talk about a lack of Black CEOs. He's not concerned with diversity of any kind, he wants homogeneity.
winter_blue 10y ago
Well, Bannon (Trump's Chief Strategist) is part of what's called the "alt-right" movement. Quoting from a ProPublica article[1]: "The alt-right believes in racially separate nation-states." They are okay with immigrant founders like Peter Thiel and Elon Musk, since they are white. It seems like it's non-white immigrants they want to keep out. They also don't seem concerned with the economic impact of excluding non-white immigrants, as Bannon said "A country is more than an economy." [1] https://www.propublica.org/article/right-wing-extremism-white-nationalism-q-and-a-chip-bertlet https://www.propublica.org/article/right-wing-extremism-whit...
- mistermann 10y ago
  FWIW, there is no single definition for "alt-right". You're free to choose the definition that best advances your political leanings, but implying specificity to one description seems a bit disingenuous to me.
  - joshwcomeau 10y ago
    I think it's pretty obvious that "alt-right" is an alias of "white supremacist". Neo-Nazis wanted a less loaded term so they came up with a new one, but it's the same people, same ideas.
    - mistermann 10y ago
      It's not that you're "wrong", but there are plenty of people who consider (or refer to themselves) as being alt-right, who are not white supremacists.
  - 1024core 10y ago
    Your response doesn't add anything to the discussion. What are these other definitions you speak of? Please tell us and cite them, so we can make up our own minds which is more credible. Throwing in adhominems like "advances your political leanings", etc. is irrelevant. It's not like there's some alternate definition of "alt-right" that implies they're leftists!
    - mistermann 10y ago
      > Your response doesn't add anything to the discussion. What are these other definitions you speak of? Please tell us and cite them Be honest: are you being open minded? Here are a variety of definitions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right
  - somebehemoth 10y ago
    What "alt-right" definition are you referring to that does not include racists?
    - mistermann 10y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right Some people have (perhaps unwittingly) chosen to identify as alt-right to distance themselves from mainstream Republican conservatives.
s_kilk 10y ago
Steve Bannon is simply a White Supremacist, there isn't really any argumentation to speak of.
- cabalamat 10y ago
  > Steve Bannon is simply a White Supremacist No, I don't think he is, in that he doesn't want whites to lord it over non-whites. What he wants, as I understand it, is for different races and cultures to live in different societies/countries.
  - becarefulyo 10y ago
    So he believes in racial segregation but is not racist?
    - cabalamat 10y ago
      I didn't say he isn't a racist.
  - mhneu 10y ago
    That kind of segregation within nations is a recipe for wars and conflict. It didn't work out well for the Nazis and the neo-Nazis wanting the same thing also seems like a bad idea.
  - geofft 10y ago
    Then he's welcome to be the senior counselor to the president of an all-white country. America, though, is distinctly not an all-white country. Does he want to make it one? Am I, as an American-born child of Indian immigrants, expected to move somewhere else?
    - actsasbuffoon 10y ago
      Sadly, I believe the answer is yes. Richard B. Spencer is a leading figure in the American Alt-Right (he even created the name). Here's a section from the beginning of his Wikipedia article: Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is a noted American white supremacist. He is president of the National Policy Institute, a white nationalist think tank, and Washington Summit Publishers, an independent publishing firm. Spencer has stated that he rejects the description of white supremacist, and describes himself as an identitarian. He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture. I'm not sure what a "peaceful ethnic cleansing" would look like, and I don't think I want to find out.
xapata 10y ago
You'll need to discuss with Bannon what "our culture" means and who "we" are. When you say lucid and argumented, I'm guessing you've already excluded such nebulous thoughts from what arguments are acceptable. Or you could try to convince him that the idea of culture is too vague too be useful and we should only discuss policy with more concrete things. Edit/Clarification: I disagree with Bannon. More specifically, he would probably consider me "them" instead of "us". This seems to be one of my least popular comments. Care to explain why?
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

otalp 10y ago

He's talking about Steve Bannon, Trump's main advisor, who ran Brietbart, which hosts plenty of White Supremacists. That's basically the argument- Asians aren't Americans, we need more of 'us' at the top. That's why Bannon will complain about too many Asian CEOs but won't talk about a lack of Black CEOs. He's not concerned with diversity of any kind, he wants homogeneity.

winter_blue 10y ago

Well, Bannon (Trump's Chief Strategist) is part of what's called the "alt-right" movement. Quoting from a ProPublica article[1]: "The alt-right believes in racially separate nation-states." They are okay with immigrant founders like Peter Thiel and Elon Musk, since they are white. It seems like it's non-white immigrants they want to keep out. They also don't seem concerned with the economic impact of excluding non-white immigrants, as Bannon said "A country is more than an economy." [1] https://www.propublica.org/article/right-wing-extremism-white-nationalism-q-and-a-chip-bertlet https://www.propublica.org/article/right-wing-extremism-whit...

mistermann 10y ago
FWIW, there is no single definition for "alt-right". You're free to choose the definition that best advances your political leanings, but implying specificity to one description seems a bit disingenuous to me.
- joshwcomeau 10y ago
  I think it's pretty obvious that "alt-right" is an alias of "white supremacist". Neo-Nazis wanted a less loaded term so they came up with a new one, but it's the same people, same ideas.
  - mistermann 10y ago
    It's not that you're "wrong", but there are plenty of people who consider (or refer to themselves) as being alt-right, who are not white supremacists.
- 1024core 10y ago
  Your response doesn't add anything to the discussion. What are these other definitions you speak of? Please tell us and cite them, so we can make up our own minds which is more credible. Throwing in adhominems like "advances your political leanings", etc. is irrelevant. It's not like there's some alternate definition of "alt-right" that implies they're leftists!
  - mistermann 10y ago
    > Your response doesn't add anything to the discussion. What are these other definitions you speak of? Please tell us and cite them Be honest: are you being open minded? Here are a variety of definitions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right
- somebehemoth 10y ago
  What "alt-right" definition are you referring to that does not include racists?
  - mistermann 10y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right Some people have (perhaps unwittingly) chosen to identify as alt-right to distance themselves from mainstream Republican conservatives.

s_kilk 10y ago

Steve Bannon is simply a White Supremacist, there isn't really any argumentation to speak of.

cabalamat 10y ago
> Steve Bannon is simply a White Supremacist No, I don't think he is, in that he doesn't want whites to lord it over non-whites. What he wants, as I understand it, is for different races and cultures to live in different societies/countries.
- becarefulyo 10y ago
  So he believes in racial segregation but is not racist?
  - cabalamat 10y ago
    I didn't say he isn't a racist.
- mhneu 10y ago
  That kind of segregation within nations is a recipe for wars and conflict. It didn't work out well for the Nazis and the neo-Nazis wanting the same thing also seems like a bad idea.
- geofft 10y ago
  Then he's welcome to be the senior counselor to the president of an all-white country. America, though, is distinctly not an all-white country. Does he want to make it one? Am I, as an American-born child of Indian immigrants, expected to move somewhere else?
  - actsasbuffoon 10y ago
    Sadly, I believe the answer is yes. Richard B. Spencer is a leading figure in the American Alt-Right (he even created the name). Here's a section from the beginning of his Wikipedia article: Richard Bertrand Spencer (born May 11, 1978) is a noted American white supremacist. He is president of the National Policy Institute, a white nationalist think tank, and Washington Summit Publishers, an independent publishing firm. Spencer has stated that he rejects the description of white supremacist, and describes himself as an identitarian. He advocates for a white homeland for a "dispossessed white race" and calls for "peaceful ethnic cleansing" to halt the "deconstruction" of European culture. I'm not sure what a "peaceful ethnic cleansing" would look like, and I don't think I want to find out.

xapata 10y ago

You'll need to discuss with Bannon what "our culture" means and who "we" are. When you say lucid and argumented, I'm guessing you've already excluded such nebulous thoughts from what arguments are acceptable. Or you could try to convince him that the idea of culture is too vague too be useful and we should only discuss policy with more concrete things. Edit/Clarification: I disagree with Bannon. More specifically, he would probably consider me "them" instead of "us". This seems to be one of my least popular comments. Care to explain why?

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]