5 ms·

It's not in Europe's interest to destroy nation states and replace ethnic Europeans with non-verified nationals from "risky" countries.

baq 10y ago
of course it's not.
- candiodari 10y ago
  You forget the circumstances. Once you take into consideration that these locals have had a fertility rate of 1.7 or so on average for 20 years you see the deal : Without mass immigration (I don't mean the last 2 years, I mean "normal" mass immigration) the EU would have lost slightly over 5% of it's population by now, and it would accelerate. The net numbers don't even tell the whole story, as lots of countries are now seeing net-negative growth even given mass immigration. Something like 10% of 20-30 year youths have left and have been replaced by these immigrants. Now the numbers matter less than the reality, yes population would drop, but ... without mass immigration, without these poor Africans with little language knowledge the minimum wage in countries like Germany would be 50% higher or more. If you walk through a city like Berlin and look at restaurant staff, street cleaners, ... what do you see ? France ? Same thing (despite the government rhetoric I might add). The Netherlands ? Even worse. Without mass immigration these countries would have gone into Japan-style stagnation and perma-recession over a decade ago. The funny thing is, of course this was only a delay. We are very close to the point where global numbers will start to drop, and frankly, population numbers are already dropping pretty much everywhere outside of sub-Saharan Africa (all sorts of fun facts come up. Do you know that the largest group of Christians will be all-black in less than a decade ? In two decades they will be easily double the next ethnicity (either white or Chinese). And "black" black, you know, with the massive lips, somewhat larger eyes, distinct difference in skin color on palms and soles, ... A black pope isn't nearly as far off as people think) Now keep in mind what this does and does not mean : first and foremost it means more pensioners, less savings, and much less people involved in actual economic activity (already very noticeable in Western Europe). Note that this is unfixable, for at least 30 years. If today every family suddenly decided to have seven kids, economic population would only start increasing in something like 20-30 years (because it takes a while to actually make 7 kids). We would still see all the effects of population decrease for a period that is probably half the remaining lifespan for most of us (in fact slightly more since kids are also dependents, also a drain on savings, ...) Even with the total disastrous immigration Europe is now seeing, actual population growth in the EU is still muted at best. Eastern Europe, especially, is bleeding dry of people at an astonishing rate.

baq 10y ago

of course it's not.

candiodari 10y ago
You forget the circumstances. Once you take into consideration that these locals have had a fertility rate of 1.7 or so on average for 20 years you see the deal : Without mass immigration (I don't mean the last 2 years, I mean "normal" mass immigration) the EU would have lost slightly over 5% of it's population by now, and it would accelerate. The net numbers don't even tell the whole story, as lots of countries are now seeing net-negative growth even given mass immigration. Something like 10% of 20-30 year youths have left and have been replaced by these immigrants. Now the numbers matter less than the reality, yes population would drop, but ... without mass immigration, without these poor Africans with little language knowledge the minimum wage in countries like Germany would be 50% higher or more. If you walk through a city like Berlin and look at restaurant staff, street cleaners, ... what do you see ? France ? Same thing (despite the government rhetoric I might add). The Netherlands ? Even worse. Without mass immigration these countries would have gone into Japan-style stagnation and perma-recession over a decade ago. The funny thing is, of course this was only a delay. We are very close to the point where global numbers will start to drop, and frankly, population numbers are already dropping pretty much everywhere outside of sub-Saharan Africa (all sorts of fun facts come up. Do you know that the largest group of Christians will be all-black in less than a decade ? In two decades they will be easily double the next ethnicity (either white or Chinese). And "black" black, you know, with the massive lips, somewhat larger eyes, distinct difference in skin color on palms and soles, ... A black pope isn't nearly as far off as people think) Now keep in mind what this does and does not mean : first and foremost it means more pensioners, less savings, and much less people involved in actual economic activity (already very noticeable in Western Europe). Note that this is unfixable, for at least 30 years. If today every family suddenly decided to have seven kids, economic population would only start increasing in something like 20-30 years (because it takes a while to actually make 7 kids). We would still see all the effects of population decrease for a period that is probably half the remaining lifespan for most of us (in fact slightly more since kids are also dependents, also a drain on savings, ...) Even with the total disastrous immigration Europe is now seeing, actual population growth in the EU is still muted at best. Eastern Europe, especially, is bleeding dry of people at an astonishing rate.