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My hope - perhaps naïvely so - is that President Trump will be the kick in our complacency that we so desperately need. Even if for all the wrong reasons. Bot

by Svip 10y ago

My hope - perhaps naïvely so - is that President Trump will be the kick in our complacency that we so desperately need. Even if for all the wrong reasons. Both in the US and the EU.

agumonkey 10y ago
I .. feel the same. Which conflicts me a lot because he's despicable in many dimensions. But he'll act as the wall(sic) we'll hit to react. He's driven and polarizing, even in the worst sense of the term.. that's still "coherent energy". ps: that said, I can't wait for the U.S to kick him out.. he seems unfit to do anything.
- reddytowns 10y ago
  I think he's awesome for those very same reasons
  - agumonkey 10y ago
    awesome ? you value selfish antagonism if it ends up as a (potentially) global positive outcome ?
    - ttrmw 10y ago
      I personally feel the risk in this instance is too high, but as a rule, yes.
      - agumonkey 10y ago
        As an engineer I've learned to appreciate counter intuitive strategies and laws but as you said... the desired outcomes seem unlikely here.
- raverbashing 10y ago
  Just a note, that's not how you use (sic) It's usually used when quoting an original statement that's doubtful or knowingly incorrect I don't know which term would be more appropriate to use, probably "pun intended"
  - agumonkey 10y ago
    True, but even Wikipedia lists irony as a usage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic#The_.22ironic_use.22_of_sic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic#The_.22ironic_use.22_of_si...
    - raverbashing 10y ago
      Good, I assume that was the writer's intention then
  - theandrewbailey 10y ago
    Isn't "(sic)" used to mark a misspelling in the original material? That's all I've ever seen it used for.
    - baq 10y ago
      it literally means 'so it was written' or something similar. wikipedia: "The Latin adverb sic ("thus"; "just as"; in full: sic erat scriptum, "thus was it written")[1] inserted after a quoted word or passage, indicates that the quoted matter has been transcribed exactly as found in the source text, complete with any erroneous or archaic spelling, surprising assertion, faulty reasoning, or other matter that might otherwise be taken as an error of transcription." (sic)
- vixen99 10y ago
  Rants are totally uninformative (whatever your political persuasion) and there's a channel for them on Reddit (I gather). How is your comment related to 'Trump order, could nix EU-US data flows'?
bad_user 10y ago
You're too much of an optimist. What you call "complacency" is actually years of progress in international trade and cooperation going down the drain. Yes, people eventually wake up, but sometimes it takes a war to do it. Indeed, everybody woke up after WWII.
- Svip 10y ago
  Hope is not the same has belief or prediction. Nothing wrong with hoping for the best. I still maintain it's part of the 'complacency' we endure, because a lot of things are 'good enough', and when people are satisfied, they feel little motivation to right the wrongs that remain. Like surveillance, skewed trade deals, privacy laws, the emerging of rivalling global powers (see China and Russia) and taking the internet and computers serious in general. Oh and, if we can lift the global standard of living, then we don't need big border protection budgets, because people will have less motivation to migrate. I sure hope we will be able to avoid a war. At least a war like the Second World War.
- patrec 10y ago
  Free trade is not an end in itself. If data-protection barriers improve EU citizen's privacy and digital rights and weaken the stranglehold of a handful of companies on the whole IT infrastructure by making EU companies more competitive that's not necessarily a bad thing, ultimately even for people outside the EU.
  - bad_user 10y ago
    I do not believe that "any-protection batteries" work, ever. You might get a boost, but it's only short term. What I believe instead is that nationalistic policies eventually lead to hunger and from my recollection, history seems to agree. Because we are all interdependent. More on-topic: If the EU doesn't have software companies to rival those of the US, that's not because those US companies exist. If the EU is bad at software innovation, what makes you think we'll be any good at making clones? Also, most companies that care about data security and are afraid of industrial espionage from the US have already switched after the Snowden revelations, especially given that the US government made it clear since then that non-citizens should not have an expectation for privacy. I doubt there are many companies left willing to make a switch to alternatives based on data security concerns. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see more EU companies on the rise. And we already have startups developing in Berlin, London, Paris, etc. But I don't see the existence of US companies as being the problem. Disclaimer: I am an EU citizen from Romania.
richmarr 10y ago
Well, scientists already seem about 1000% more motivated to innovate with new ways of publishing & sharing data.
godmodus 10y ago
Here here
AJ007 10y ago
I think you are partly correct. With a Clinton Presidency there would be no protests or opposition. The danger is that, just like Obama, the President after Trump will decry what their predecessor did and then as soon as entering office extend and expand it.

by Svip 10y ago

My hope - perhaps naïvely so - is that President Trump will be the kick in our complacency that we so desperately need. Even if for all the wrong reasons. Both in the US and the EU.

agumonkey 10y ago

I .. feel the same. Which conflicts me a lot because he's despicable in many dimensions. But he'll act as the wall(sic) we'll hit to react. He's driven and polarizing, even in the worst sense of the term.. that's still "coherent energy". ps: that said, I can't wait for the U.S to kick him out.. he seems unfit to do anything.

reddytowns 10y ago
I think he's awesome for those very same reasons
- agumonkey 10y ago
  awesome ? you value selfish antagonism if it ends up as a (potentially) global positive outcome ?
  - ttrmw 10y ago
    I personally feel the risk in this instance is too high, but as a rule, yes.
    - agumonkey 10y ago
      As an engineer I've learned to appreciate counter intuitive strategies and laws but as you said... the desired outcomes seem unlikely here.
raverbashing 10y ago
Just a note, that's not how you use (sic) It's usually used when quoting an original statement that's doubtful or knowingly incorrect I don't know which term would be more appropriate to use, probably "pun intended"
- agumonkey 10y ago
  True, but even Wikipedia lists irony as a usage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic#The_.22ironic_use.22_of_sic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic#The_.22ironic_use.22_of_si...
  - raverbashing 10y ago
    Good, I assume that was the writer's intention then
- theandrewbailey 10y ago
  Isn't "(sic)" used to mark a misspelling in the original material? That's all I've ever seen it used for.
  - baq 10y ago
    it literally means 'so it was written' or something similar. wikipedia: "The Latin adverb sic ("thus"; "just as"; in full: sic erat scriptum, "thus was it written")[1] inserted after a quoted word or passage, indicates that the quoted matter has been transcribed exactly as found in the source text, complete with any erroneous or archaic spelling, surprising assertion, faulty reasoning, or other matter that might otherwise be taken as an error of transcription." (sic)
vixen99 10y ago
Rants are totally uninformative (whatever your political persuasion) and there's a channel for them on Reddit (I gather). How is your comment related to 'Trump order, could nix EU-US data flows'?

bad_user 10y ago

You're too much of an optimist. What you call "complacency" is actually years of progress in international trade and cooperation going down the drain. Yes, people eventually wake up, but sometimes it takes a war to do it. Indeed, everybody woke up after WWII.

Svip 10y ago
Hope is not the same has belief or prediction. Nothing wrong with hoping for the best. I still maintain it's part of the 'complacency' we endure, because a lot of things are 'good enough', and when people are satisfied, they feel little motivation to right the wrongs that remain. Like surveillance, skewed trade deals, privacy laws, the emerging of rivalling global powers (see China and Russia) and taking the internet and computers serious in general. Oh and, if we can lift the global standard of living, then we don't need big border protection budgets, because people will have less motivation to migrate. I sure hope we will be able to avoid a war. At least a war like the Second World War.
patrec 10y ago
Free trade is not an end in itself. If data-protection barriers improve EU citizen's privacy and digital rights and weaken the stranglehold of a handful of companies on the whole IT infrastructure by making EU companies more competitive that's not necessarily a bad thing, ultimately even for people outside the EU.
- bad_user 10y ago
  I do not believe that "any-protection batteries" work, ever. You might get a boost, but it's only short term. What I believe instead is that nationalistic policies eventually lead to hunger and from my recollection, history seems to agree. Because we are all interdependent. More on-topic: If the EU doesn't have software companies to rival those of the US, that's not because those US companies exist. If the EU is bad at software innovation, what makes you think we'll be any good at making clones? Also, most companies that care about data security and are afraid of industrial espionage from the US have already switched after the Snowden revelations, especially given that the US government made it clear since then that non-citizens should not have an expectation for privacy. I doubt there are many companies left willing to make a switch to alternatives based on data security concerns. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see more EU companies on the rise. And we already have startups developing in Berlin, London, Paris, etc. But I don't see the existence of US companies as being the problem. Disclaimer: I am an EU citizen from Romania.

richmarr 10y ago

Well, scientists already seem about 1000% more motivated to innovate with new ways of publishing & sharing data.

godmodus 10y ago

Here here

AJ007 10y ago

I think you are partly correct. With a Clinton Presidency there would be no protests or opposition. The danger is that, just like Obama, the President after Trump will decry what their predecessor did and then as soon as entering office extend and expand it.