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With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the world burn in peace
- ygaf 10y agoIt's disturbing that HNers are lapping up the author's implication (Thiel has NZ citizenship as an 'escape plan') without any support being needed.
- st3v3r 10y agoBecause it's pretty clear that's why it is? Otherwise why get it, and why not renounce his US Citizenship after getting it?
- ygaf 10y ago>Because it's pretty clear that's why it is? It really isn't. The onus is on you to explain why it's so clearly an escape plan, when even the article acknowledges both that NZ is a tax haven and that Thiel gained citizenship before the election. Why should he throw US citizenship away? Dual citizenship is cool.
- neilk 10y agoSam Altman said that Thiel's estate in NZ is his escape plan, in the event of biowarfare or some other disaster. So it seems likely that Thiel has the place prepared in some way for long-term survival. We don't know what disasters Thiel thinks are likely, though. http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/01/why-does-peter-thiel-have-new-zealand-citizenship http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/01/why-does-peter-thiel-...
- anigbrowl 10y agoI have to say I find it both incongruous and disturbing that one of the architect's of the new administration's transition is simultaneously buying himself an escape pod in case things don't work out at the day job. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence, in either him or his erstwhile employer.
- hourislate 10y agoThey all have escape pods. Larry Ellison, Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates and every other wealthy person. It's us that will walk the fire...
- joyeuse6701 10y agoIt's insurance, do you live a life without insurance? Which would bother you more, meeting a man who lived entirely without insurance or one who bought insurance for what he could afford? Does it bother you that the government has bomb shelters (escape pods for nuclear holocaust) while the citizenry don't? I'd prefer someone with a modicum of common sense over an optimistic fool.
- ssalazar 10y agoI'll stick with the captain who sinks with his ship over the one with a private life raft.
- batmanthehorse 10y agoYou need to be an optimistic fool to support Trump in the first place.
- TheSpiceIsLife 10y agoWe keep reading comments like this about Trump. But consider the alternatives. You have to admit to having the wool pulled over your eyes to vote for Hillary. And there's nothing good to be said about any politicians. They're all self-serving lying scum. Some of them are only slightly less ugly.
- SandersAK 10y agoA role model for us all.
- newyankee 10y ago/s not needed
- hourislate 10y agoand how do you know he is not being honest? Shouldn't everyone have a plan these days?
- SandersAK 10y agonaw i was being sarcastic. peter thiel is a man-child.
- hippich 10y agoFrom what I read so far it looks like while you can obtain US citizenship while holding another one already, it is strictly prohibited to get new citizenship without renouncing US one. If this is correct, does it mean Peter is not US citizen anymore? Edit: just one link i found right away - https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerations/us-citizenship-laws-policies/citizenship-and-dual-nationality.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerati...: Potentially Expatriating Acts: 1. obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon one's own application after the age of 18 (Sec. 349 (a) (1) INA);
- taocoyote 10y agoI am a US citizen who has immigrated to New Zealand and hold citizenship here. It is my understanding that I have to apply (and pay) to relinquish my US citizenship, which might be declined.
- shalmanese 10y agoUS simply doesn't recognize any other citizenships but it doesn't care what other passports you hold.
- davidw 10y agoThis is correct. I know several people that have US + Italian, and I've been considering it myself, although Italy doesn't seem like much of an "escape pod" (per another comment) at the moment, the way things are going there.
- kobeya 10y agoWhat do you mean "doesn't recognize other citizenships"? Dual citizenship is legal.
- Thieum22 10y agoYou still have to bring your US passport to pass the customs. That is not the case for other counties that would recognize any valid passport.
- rm_-rf_slash 10y agoSo he helps sets up the scenario for role-reversal Atlas Shrugged and then goes off to his own Galt's Gulch anyway? What a hero.
- joering2 10y agoIt seems this is getting enough traction that the Parliament has officially asked the Immigration Dept why Thiel got his citizenship even if he didn't spend enough time over there. It will be interesting to watch what precedence this situation's popularity will set - was this his money (not a bribe just the fact he is somewhat celebrity) or other requirements that me and you can fulfill.
- dahdum 10y agoThe requirements aren't firm, he didn't meet the guidelines but I'm sure he far exceed the investor visa requirements. Many countries court investment in these ways.
- frio 10y agoThe Minister in charge at the time is claiming (feigning?) complete ignorance; apparently he "doesn't recall the application" which, given it was granted under "special circumstances", is pretty rich. The Government are getting questioned about this closely. Even if it comes under the investor visa, I suspect the populace is going to want some evidence of investment, because we're full-steam into a housing unaffordability crisis, and I suspect many will take a dim view of a foreign investor owning $10m of property (even if it is a luxury estate and not really related).
- joering2 10y agoDid he get visa then, or citizenship?
- aaron-lebo 10y agoThis is just a thinly veiled partisan attack. I don't agree with all of Thiel's actions or beliefs but he's getting singled out for being different. Anyone with billions of dollars is gonna be able to pack up and sit high and tidy in case of disaster. Someone with homes spread across several states or countries and the money to buy their own security and healthcare has the same opportunities and and no reason to be loyal to any given state, anyway, but we are not forming online lynch mobs to get them. It's a horrific thing when Iranian PhD students might be banned from the country (yes) but fuck Thiel for being a citizen of the world. Huh?
- rybosome 10y agoWhat of the fact that he is serving as a member of the transition team for the current administration? Doesn't the idea that someone closely tied to the government has an escape hatch into another country disturb you?
- aaron-lebo 10y agoNot really. As I said, anyone with money has an escape hatch anyway. If the world goes to hell there's plenty of nations that will gladly invite money. The article suggests Thiel acquired the citizenship before Trump was elected - is it not possible given Thiel's political views that he was ready to leave the country given other events or another electee? It's only an "escape hatch" because people are calling it that.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- crystalmeph 10y agoThe Techcrunch article is framing it as an "escape hatch," but offers no evidence that Thiel actually purchased it for that reason. He may have purchased the NZ citizenship for tax purposes, or so he could buy this "sensitive land." Neither of which are going to win him a Humanitarian Of The Year award, but neither do they indicate that he foresees or is trying to bring about an economic catastrophe in the United States.
- st3v3r 10y agoThere was an interview on Fresh Air with the guy who wrote the story about the ultra-wealthy survivalists, and one guy he talked to. He was a VC, but I don't remember his name. He said, "With all the money you're spending on being prepared to run away, how much have you spent trying to prevent the collapse you fear? How much have you given to your local homeless shelter?" I feel that's very relevant. Peter Thiel clearly has more than enough money to help stop whatever he's afraid of happening in the US, and he has the connections to other people with money that can help as well. Yet, here he is, trying to run away instead of doing the right thing.
- wmf 10y agoPeter Thiel is trying to fix the US more directly than most techies although his approach is highly debatable. Max Levchin is the guy with the homeless shelters. http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/01/30/doomsday-prep-for-the-super-rich http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/01/30/doomsday-prep-f... Personally I'm sympathetic to both perspectives. I'd rather give up most of my money than be the king of the wasteland. But if you've already spent, say, 20% of your fortune on reducing poverty is it wrong to spend 1% on personal insurance?
- JumpCrisscross 10y ago> Peter Thiel clearly has more than enough money to help stop whatever he's afraid of happening in the US Peter Thiel is worth about $2.7bn [1]. That's a lot, but not enough to stop political momentum. It is enough to warrant the common practice of back-up citizenship. (I am curious how he procured New Zealand citizenship, though.) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Thiel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Thiel
- bflesch 10y agoThis manufactured outrage is ridiculous. Diversification in terms of citizenship is vital when you are a very high net worth individual, everybody does it. The only thing that Thiel does different from others is to actually take second citizenship in a civilized country instead of just going to some tax haven in the carribean or malta/cyprus where you can pay for citizenship.
- MrZongle2 10y agoGiven the state of "journalism" these days, it seems more likely that this is a soft smear campaign. Thiel has aligned himself with a side that is not popular with the media and some elements of the tech community, thus the attempt to "Other" him.
- bflesch 10y agoYes. And I thought backstabbing was out.
- Applejinx 10y agoThat, and the consuming the blood of young children :) so, consuming the blood of young children AND second citizenship. Easy to get them mixed up, I know :)
- anigbrowl 10y agoThat's totally fine when you're in the private sector, do whatever you want. I'm all for people holding as many passports as they can acquire until the day when passports are no longer a necessity. If you're working for or directly influencing government, though, you potentially have a conflict of interest. That's why you can't become President if you were not born a US citizen, and why Ted Cruz resigned his Canadian citizenship even though he technically didn't have to.
- st3v3r 10y agoThen why hasn't he renounced his US citizenship?
- oxide 10y agomust be nice to get special government treatment when it comes to citizenship. A short phone call away, I'd imagine, when you have that much money. the pain in the ass it would have been for him to spend 240 days a year there for 5 years before being granted citizenship, sheesh. although if things go south here, he might want to trade his currency in for NZ bucks before the hyper inflation kicks in. the government probably won't want someone with monopoly money taking up that prime real estate, ya know?
- matthewbauer 10y agoIsn't there more important things to worry about? Trump has tons of executive actions to cover yet the media focuses on some gossip from one of his supporters.
- neilk 10y agoI think they were trying to make a joke, but Peter Thiel does love the Lord of the Rings. Just a few of the entities he has founded: - Palantir - Valar Ventures - Mithril Capital Management - Lembas LLC - Rivendell One LLC Apparently in internal Palantir communications he talks about how their software helps the good hobbits resist the evil orcs and stuff. (It does make one wonder how closely Thiel read the books, since the all-seeing Palantir corrupts its users). That said, Thiel's end-of-the-world scenario is almost certainly some fantasy about going Galt. He's not worried about the world under Trump the way many of us are.
- kafkaesq 10y agoApparently in internal Palantir communications he talks about how their software helps the good hobbits resist the evil orcs and stuff. It's amazing how easy nerds are to distract from the true implications of the work they do.
- ekianjo 10y agoits not because the movie was filmed there that it means anything for LOTR. Tolkien pretty much had a in mind Europe in terms of Inspiration for his book.
- s_m_t 10y agoThe Palantiri don't inherently corrupt their users, they were only dangerous because Sauron had captured one of them and was feeding bad info from the other end.
- wavefunction 10y agoI don't know, take this as you will but this wikia disagrees that Sauron could feed "bad information" via the Palantiri: http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Palant%C3%ADri http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Palant%C3%ADri At the end of Appearance and Properties, it is suggested that Gandalf himself claimed that false images or information could not be transmitted by the Palantiri, only suggestions via the selection of what information to show.
- cyberferret 10y agoYou know it is the end of days when absolute privilege needs an escape chute... Ah well, maybe those upper deck passengers on the Titanic were right - they paid so much for their tickets that they deserved their place on the lifeboats over everyone else...
- Ceezy 10y agoHi, I needed to share this because I always found difficult to swallow, that a libertarian would have Washington as his biggest customer. I wish it will help my libertarian friends to understand that Thiel is more about himself than freeing people. PS:Can some admin or anyone else why is this flagged?
- earthtolazlo 10y agoVery disappointing to see this flagged. I thought better of HN.
- mdotk 10y agoThis happened 6 years in 2011! Why is it an issue now? Should we block everyone that supports Trump from leaving the US??
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- tudorconstantin 10y agoHe got his NZ citizenship since 2015. Maybe even before Trump announcing his run and quite a bit before knowing that he'll serve in Trump's administration. Insinuating that he did it as a doomsday plan because of Trump is clearly manipulative.