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> but it also wiped out a large percentage of the wealth of the poorest people. This is a blatantly incorrect statement (that shows the bias of the author). Ol

> but it also wiped out a large percentage of the wealth of the poorest people. This is a blatantly incorrect statement (that shows the bias of the author). Old currency could be turned into bank accounts, and then out to new currency. The inconvenience was around the logistics of getting new notes into circulation (which was indeed managed badly in many parts), but no way can this be conflated with 'wiped out a large percentage of wealth'. The author's bias is making that leap.

sleepychu 10y ago
You're right but the author isn't totally incorrect.[0] >But with the note shortage in India, cash is precious and the queue-jumping jugaad has a dark side. As banks quickly run out of cash, many have to go hungry if they cannot make it to the front of the line. Others have to take days off work to wait in line. One man, standing in the queue at the bank, who does odd jobs for a launderette, says he will phone his boss when he reaches the front, so that he can come and make a cash deposit. “Every man, whether he’s rich or poor, has a mouth to feed. But somehow, only ordinary folks like us end up standing in line,” he says. [0] - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/28/india-bank-lines-controversy-cash-for-queuing https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/28/india-bank-lin...
- notahacker 10y ago
  However counterproductive India's change might have been, I don't think you can call statements like "it also wiped out a large percentage of the wealth of the poorest people" and "One could argue that the Indian government recalling bank notes had a positive impact on citizens (more tax revenue for education, roads, etc). Yet it also harmed millions by eroding their wealth" anything other than a misrepresentation of what the Indian government actually did. I don't think it serves the Bitcoin ecosystem well when CEOs of some of its most trustworthy platforms make such flatly wrong statements on basic finanical issues. More generally, it's a counterproductive line of rhetoric to take when the average person in the developed world is several orders of magnitude more likely to suffer significant wealth loss through BTC volatility, platform malfeasance or government crackdown on domestic bitcoin use than hyperinflation or generalised currency seizures by Western goverments.
denzil_correa 10y ago
> The inconvenience was around the logistics of getting new news into circulation (which was indeed managed badly in many parts) 86% of the currency in the market was wiped out to target 6% of unaccounted income in cash. There is no way to even justify such a policy forget manage it.
- anilgulecha 10y ago
  > wiped out. Another example of misrepresentation. (The value was not wiped out.)
  - addicted 10y ago
    And it's also absolutely incorrect. The reality is that the vast majority of the bank notes were actually deposited and did not get wasted. Actually, some who have a slightly darker view of the actual reasoniwho behind why this was done contend that one of the biggest reasons behind "demonetizabehind was that the govt expected a significant chunk of money to NOT be deposited into banks, thereby helping the govt's finances (cash is essentially a loan owed by the govt. Cash that was not converted and therefore made valueless meant the govt owed less money). If this view is correct, one of the biggest failures of demonetization was that such a large percentage of cash was converted that the govt didn't benefit from this avenue. Furthermore, all the articles about how day laborers go without food ignore the fact that day laborers routinely went without food even before demonetization. The question should have been how much worse it made things for day laborers, something which few articles even attempt to answer. Finally, it's hard for Westerners to recognize how much more integrated digital services through cellphones are in the daily lives of poor people in Asia and Africa compared to NA and Europe.
    - scott_s 10y ago
      Are you aware of stats for how many of the cancelled currency was deposited? I heard stories of families losing significant fractions of their savings, but of course that's anecdote, not data.
solatic 10y ago
It is a statement which is de jure incorrect but de facto correct. The timelines were completely unrealistic from a logistical standpoint. India is not yet at a stage where poor people can make their day-to-day transactions with debit cards instead of cash. Being able to deposit their savings in time by the deadline is a pointless irrelevancy if the bank cannot give them enough valid currency in return for their daily needs. One needs only look at the downturn in India's recent economic figures to see the macro results.

sleepychu 10y ago

You're right but the author isn't totally incorrect.[0] >But with the note shortage in India, cash is precious and the queue-jumping jugaad has a dark side. As banks quickly run out of cash, many have to go hungry if they cannot make it to the front of the line. Others have to take days off work to wait in line. One man, standing in the queue at the bank, who does odd jobs for a launderette, says he will phone his boss when he reaches the front, so that he can come and make a cash deposit. “Every man, whether he’s rich or poor, has a mouth to feed. But somehow, only ordinary folks like us end up standing in line,” he says. [0] - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/28/india-bank-lines-controversy-cash-for-queuing https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/28/india-bank-lin...

notahacker 10y ago
However counterproductive India's change might have been, I don't think you can call statements like "it also wiped out a large percentage of the wealth of the poorest people" and "One could argue that the Indian government recalling bank notes had a positive impact on citizens (more tax revenue for education, roads, etc). Yet it also harmed millions by eroding their wealth" anything other than a misrepresentation of what the Indian government actually did. I don't think it serves the Bitcoin ecosystem well when CEOs of some of its most trustworthy platforms make such flatly wrong statements on basic finanical issues. More generally, it's a counterproductive line of rhetoric to take when the average person in the developed world is several orders of magnitude more likely to suffer significant wealth loss through BTC volatility, platform malfeasance or government crackdown on domestic bitcoin use than hyperinflation or generalised currency seizures by Western goverments.

denzil_correa 10y ago

> The inconvenience was around the logistics of getting new news into circulation (which was indeed managed badly in many parts) 86% of the currency in the market was wiped out to target 6% of unaccounted income in cash. There is no way to even justify such a policy forget manage it.

anilgulecha 10y ago
> wiped out. Another example of misrepresentation. (The value was not wiped out.)
- addicted 10y ago
  And it's also absolutely incorrect. The reality is that the vast majority of the bank notes were actually deposited and did not get wasted. Actually, some who have a slightly darker view of the actual reasoniwho behind why this was done contend that one of the biggest reasons behind "demonetizabehind was that the govt expected a significant chunk of money to NOT be deposited into banks, thereby helping the govt's finances (cash is essentially a loan owed by the govt. Cash that was not converted and therefore made valueless meant the govt owed less money). If this view is correct, one of the biggest failures of demonetization was that such a large percentage of cash was converted that the govt didn't benefit from this avenue. Furthermore, all the articles about how day laborers go without food ignore the fact that day laborers routinely went without food even before demonetization. The question should have been how much worse it made things for day laborers, something which few articles even attempt to answer. Finally, it's hard for Westerners to recognize how much more integrated digital services through cellphones are in the daily lives of poor people in Asia and Africa compared to NA and Europe.
  - scott_s 10y ago
    Are you aware of stats for how many of the cancelled currency was deposited? I heard stories of families losing significant fractions of their savings, but of course that's anecdote, not data.

solatic 10y ago

It is a statement which is de jure incorrect but de facto correct. The timelines were completely unrealistic from a logistical standpoint. India is not yet at a stage where poor people can make their day-to-day transactions with debit cards instead of cash. Being able to deposit their savings in time by the deadline is a pointless irrelevancy if the bank cannot give them enough valid currency in return for their daily needs. One needs only look at the downturn in India's recent economic figures to see the macro results.