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Agreed. Anything remotely neutral about the new administration is met with a mob and pitch forks. Discussion is good. Saying you don't understand because you

Agreed. Anything remotely neutral about the new administration is met with a mob and pitch forks. Discussion is good. Saying you don't understand because you don't agree with answers is like saying you don't understand why a homosexaul is homosexual. Last time I checked, that's called "bigotry"

icanhackit 10y ago
> Saying you don't understand because you don't agree You can't make an assessment about whether you agree if you don't understand - the latter must must happen before the former can come to pass. It would either be the case that you don't understand because the explanation is complex or it contains logical fallacies...the latter applies to your statement above. > is like saying you don't understand why a homosexaul is homosexual. It's fine to say you don't understand why a homosexual is homosexual - however it's not fine to impose restrictions, punishment, violence or torment for what goes on between consenting adults. You're allowed to find it odd or not to your taste, but you're expected to live and let live. > Last time I checked, that's called "bigotry" Bigotry is intolerance stemming from a preconceived opinion that isn't based on reason or experience. And I'd agree that the liberal/progressive side can exhibit such intolerance - I've been on the receiving end despite considering myself progressive. But if we're going talk about the old classics like racism, homophobia, and sexism -- the conservative side knows the art better than any.
- wooter 10y ago
  > But if we're going talk about the old classics like racism, homophobia, and sexism -- the conservative side knows the art better than any. Lincoln, a Republican, abolished slavery. And Roosevelt, a Democrat, interned Japanese Americans.
  - learc83 10y ago
    He said "conservative". You think Lincoln was a conservative? The Democrat's decision to support civil rights and the Republican southern strategy shift to appeal to voters who opposed civil rights radically altered both parties. The Republican party shares a name with the Party of Lincoln, but that's about it.
    - michaelbuddy 10y ago
      giving some alternative facts again are we?
    - talmand 10y ago
      If you look at the vote totals you'll see that far more Republicans voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964 than Democrats and that far more Democrats voted against it than Republicans. The Democrats did not suddenly decide to support civil rights since the majority of the opponents of such policies were Democrats. Much of the violence against blacks you see from that era were committed by Democrats. I seriously doubt there were Democrats out beating blacks for demanding civil rights one day and literally the next day they were voting for civil rights. That situation was far more nuanced than the idea that millions of people with opposing viewpoints across the entirety of the country suddenly agreed with each other to switch parties. As for the southern strategy, there is the viewpoint that getting people to vote for you doesn't automatically mean you accept and enforce their ideologies. They just become "useful idiots" for your cause. Although, I disagree with the premise of the strategy because it would have the side effect of fostering racial divide. But I have the advantage of hindsight in that matter.
      - justinlaster 10y ago
        He literally just explained this. Democrats then are not the same Democrats now. The people (southern whites) that committed violence against blacks who were democrats back then, are very, very likely to be Republican these days.
        talmand 10y ago
        So, the rest of the Republicans across the country outside of the South that voted for Civil Rights just went along with this change and accepted the role of being the "racist" party? Because that's the claim.
        justinlaster 10y ago
        Except it's not.
  - jjaredsimpson 10y ago
    Because political labels from 150 and 80 years ago are clearly relevant.

icanhackit 10y ago

> Saying you don't understand because you don't agree You can't make an assessment about whether you agree if you don't understand - the latter must must happen before the former can come to pass. It would either be the case that you don't understand because the explanation is complex or it contains logical fallacies...the latter applies to your statement above. > is like saying you don't understand why a homosexaul is homosexual. It's fine to say you don't understand why a homosexual is homosexual - however it's not fine to impose restrictions, punishment, violence or torment for what goes on between consenting adults. You're allowed to find it odd or not to your taste, but you're expected to live and let live. > Last time I checked, that's called "bigotry" Bigotry is intolerance stemming from a preconceived opinion that isn't based on reason or experience. And I'd agree that the liberal/progressive side can exhibit such intolerance - I've been on the receiving end despite considering myself progressive. But if we're going talk about the old classics like racism, homophobia, and sexism -- the conservative side knows the art better than any.

wooter 10y ago
> But if we're going talk about the old classics like racism, homophobia, and sexism -- the conservative side knows the art better than any. Lincoln, a Republican, abolished slavery. And Roosevelt, a Democrat, interned Japanese Americans.
- learc83 10y ago
  He said "conservative". You think Lincoln was a conservative? The Democrat's decision to support civil rights and the Republican southern strategy shift to appeal to voters who opposed civil rights radically altered both parties. The Republican party shares a name with the Party of Lincoln, but that's about it.
  - michaelbuddy 10y ago
    giving some alternative facts again are we?
  - talmand 10y ago
    If you look at the vote totals you'll see that far more Republicans voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964 than Democrats and that far more Democrats voted against it than Republicans. The Democrats did not suddenly decide to support civil rights since the majority of the opponents of such policies were Democrats. Much of the violence against blacks you see from that era were committed by Democrats. I seriously doubt there were Democrats out beating blacks for demanding civil rights one day and literally the next day they were voting for civil rights. That situation was far more nuanced than the idea that millions of people with opposing viewpoints across the entirety of the country suddenly agreed with each other to switch parties. As for the southern strategy, there is the viewpoint that getting people to vote for you doesn't automatically mean you accept and enforce their ideologies. They just become "useful idiots" for your cause. Although, I disagree with the premise of the strategy because it would have the side effect of fostering racial divide. But I have the advantage of hindsight in that matter.
    - justinlaster 10y ago
      He literally just explained this. Democrats then are not the same Democrats now. The people (southern whites) that committed violence against blacks who were democrats back then, are very, very likely to be Republican these days.
      - talmand 10y ago
        So, the rest of the Republicans across the country outside of the South that voted for Civil Rights just went along with this change and accepted the role of being the "racist" party? Because that's the claim.
        justinlaster 10y ago
        Except it's not.
- jjaredsimpson 10y ago
  Because political labels from 150 and 80 years ago are clearly relevant.