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> No one said nag. People seem to be be assuming the worst possible behaviour. Asking once with a "Don't ask again" and "Later" option is pretty standard. It i

> No one said nag. People seem to be be assuming the worst possible behaviour. Asking once with a "Don't ask again" and "Later" option is pretty standard. It is pretty standard, and it turns out that I have more than a hundred apps installed that all do it. I too routinely give one-star ratings to try and de-incentivise this kind of thing. I'm sorry that you don't seem to have an alternate way of going about getting balanced reviews but I don't have an alternate way of never seeing that popup again. Edit: Thinking about it further, it's remarkably arrogant to dismiss our complaints as effectively the wrong kind of complaint to put in reviews. That's not something you get to decide.

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scosman 10y ago
No one dismissed your complaint. I presented the developer point of view. If you honestly think that a single popup makes an app deserve of a 1 star rating regardless of anything else, I disagree. It's like being a single issue voter. It's also more damaging than you know to the app developers who's work you are using (in most cases for free) and I'd encourage you to reconsider. Apple could fix this issue. A few vigilantes can't
- jackvalentine 10y ago
  > I'd encourage you to reconsider. Apple could fix this issue. A few vigilantes can't Apple aren't going to fix the issue without it being a problem for them. I'm making it a problem by poisoning the review well in my own little way. I think this is a considered response - it's literally the only push-back that users have against the practice. My preferred outcome would be a complete ban on asking for reviews. Edit: my initial post was a bit abrasive, edited. But I'd like to end with a question: What's your preferred user response to the practice of seemingly every single app begging for reviews? An actual, actionable response. Two-star reviews? Three?
  - SomeCallMeTim 10y ago
    >What's your preferred user response to the practice of seemingly every single app begging for reviews? An actual, actionable response. Complain to Apple for having a broken system, but don't hurt the developers of the very apps you're F-ing using. As OP said above, Apple could fix this issue. Maybe weight recent reviews more, but don't just wipe the history for every upgrade. The profound sense of entitlement that users express is really frustrating to app developers. We can either never ask for reviews and watch as 1 in 100 people EVER review our app (and THOSE reviews are skewed to the people who have a complaint, so the review average is typically crap), meaning that we barely get any downloads and can't actually make a living selling apps, or we can ask for reviews and have people complain with 1-star reviews because the app they continue using for free annoyed them once. And entirely because of Apple it needs to annoy them more than once in order to stay relevant. Here's what I'd love to do: Make it so that, if you rate an app 1-star, or even 2-stars, you can't use it any more. If you rate it that low and you still use it, you're lying to other users and harming the creator of the app that you're using for free. Give me a developer API to know what users rated the app how, and I'd implement that in a minute. People could still rate it 1-star if it sucked. Because if it sucked they wouldn't want to use it. Drop the review to 4 stars if you're annoyed by it, but know that the developers really, really have no choice. You're basically telling them to commit economic suicide for your minor convenience.
    - jackvalentine 10y ago
      > that you're using for free Rude assumption. I always, as a matter of principle, buy the "remove ads" IAP if I use an app regularly. Even if I didn't it wasn't my choice to charge nothing for the app. That's on the developer. Apple doesn't owe you a living, I don't owe you a living. The state of the app store has been known for years now and you've had a long time to decline to participate. Your problems with Apple are not my problems as a user.
      - jclardy 10y ago
        They are user problems in a way, but indirectly. Without user reviews new apps are buried even when searched with exact names. So the exact app you need for a niche task will never be found in the first place. The only real solution is for Apple/Google to not wipe the slate every app update. You have to see the user benefit to that - apple right now literally has a direct disincentive to updating an app.
- Veen 10y ago
  I'm sympathetic to your argument, but the more you harp on about "free" the less sympathetic I get. Most apps aren't free: they ask me to pay with money or data, which I do, or attention, which I prefer not to. Ad supported apps are not literally free — there's an exchange of value from the user to the developer in all cases. I suspect what lies at the heart of this whole issue is that some developers think that attention is not a cost to the user.
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- Rex206 10y ago
  My landlord just raised my rent. I could use some money. Can I have your phone number so that I can text you and ask you to call my landlord, tell her what a good person I am, and lower my rent? My God, never in a million years would you agree to it. Why? Because you don’t care about my problems. But I’m supposed to care about yours. Why? Because you’re you. Look at your responses. “I don’t care about your problems, but you should care about mine.” Typical. Humans are born naricissists, and they stay that way for life mostly. Once upon a time, there was a saying. It was “the customer is always right.” My how things have changed. Now, it’s “the customer is always wrong.” Look at you. You care nothing about what the customers want. You don’t listen and adapt. If enough customers are giving you 1 star because they don’t like nags, and enough are doing it to effect you, those customers are telling you something. You’re a fool if you don’t listen. If not enough are doing it to effect you, then you don’t have a problem. If every dev that nags gets a one star, then it’s a wash for you. Why are you leaving all of these facts out? Nobody is suggesting ONLY 1-staring you. They’re suggesting 1-staring everyone. You don’t lose anything in such a scenario. Except, those who don’t nag will rise higher in the ratings, and you’ll be here screaming about how you “have to nag because that’s how the system is weighted.” Whether or not you use it as a competitive advantage or not is up to you, although let’s face it, you blame us regardless of what you do. Listen, you have problems. I have problems. We all have problems. My problems aren’t your problems, and yours aren’t mine. Grow up, handle your business, and do it without asking other grown adults to do things for you for free. We’re not your parents. We don’t do things because you’re our special little boy. You don’t do them for us either. You’re an adult now, and that’s the way it works. Or, do what you want, and accept the consequences, which you’ve already been appraised of. Sure, you can throw up a middle finger if you’d like, keep bombing the customers, then periodically cry “It’s sooooo unfaaaaair”. Maybe you’ll get sympathy. For my part, I’ve never given one-star for ratings nags, but I will now. In fact, I’m going to give 10 one-stars as soon as I leave this page. I’ve put money into every app that’s been on my device for more than a month, and I’ve been ripped off along the way … devs changing paid to freemium and throwing ads all over apps I’ve paid for, devs dropping support and releasing “new” versions the next day, dev taking the cash and keeping the ads in the product … you’re all barely better than swindlers these days, and some of you aren’t better at all. Let’s face it. You could not care less. You’re busy worrying about you. I’m supposed to put all of my experience aside, and think about you. Your wants. Your needs. Oh why won’t the customers think of you, the selfish bastids! Manipulating the ratings is nonesense too, and the way you justify your behavior to yourself is such a narcissitic endeavor that it’s humorous. At leats be honest with yourself. Yeah, like you admit, you manipulate things to your advantage, but we’re supposed to do the same. Manipulate things to your advantage. You You YOU. If it benefits you, you find a way to justify it, if it benefits someone else, eh, screw em and their wants. And now, I read that we’ve been stealing your apps, and using them for free, and gosh darnit, we’re so selfish that we don’t stop what we’re doing and rate your app 5 stars to make your lives better like your parents used to do for you whenever they were asked. Yeah, now I actually dislike the nag devs, because I got just a little bit of insight into what they’re thinking, and oh, wouldn’t you know it … it’s “me me me me me”. “But that’s what the customers do! Think about themselves!”, you’ll surely respond, without realizing that, YEAH, they’re supposed to. The customers are suppose to be the selfish people of the transaction. I can just imagine you being a waiter, standing around complaining “bring me some food, refill my drink, all the customers do is think of themselves!” You’re supposed to serve the customers, genius, not the other way around. The customer is there to serve themselves, and you’re there to serve them. If you don’t like it, then boy are you on the wrong side of the transaction. And hey, I’d still like that number if you don’t mind. You can never have to many people to ping when you have a problem, and if you wouldn’t mind me pinging you for some help every now and then, I’d certainly appreciate it. Come on, it’ll only take a few minutes of your time every other month. Me needing help is the way the world is designed. Don’t blame me, blame the system.

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scosman 10y ago

No one dismissed your complaint. I presented the developer point of view. If you honestly think that a single popup makes an app deserve of a 1 star rating regardless of anything else, I disagree. It's like being a single issue voter. It's also more damaging than you know to the app developers who's work you are using (in most cases for free) and I'd encourage you to reconsider. Apple could fix this issue. A few vigilantes can't

jackvalentine 10y ago
> I'd encourage you to reconsider. Apple could fix this issue. A few vigilantes can't Apple aren't going to fix the issue without it being a problem for them. I'm making it a problem by poisoning the review well in my own little way. I think this is a considered response - it's literally the only push-back that users have against the practice. My preferred outcome would be a complete ban on asking for reviews. Edit: my initial post was a bit abrasive, edited. But I'd like to end with a question: What's your preferred user response to the practice of seemingly every single app begging for reviews? An actual, actionable response. Two-star reviews? Three?
- SomeCallMeTim 10y ago
  >What's your preferred user response to the practice of seemingly every single app begging for reviews? An actual, actionable response. Complain to Apple for having a broken system, but don't hurt the developers of the very apps you're F-ing using. As OP said above, Apple could fix this issue. Maybe weight recent reviews more, but don't just wipe the history for every upgrade. The profound sense of entitlement that users express is really frustrating to app developers. We can either never ask for reviews and watch as 1 in 100 people EVER review our app (and THOSE reviews are skewed to the people who have a complaint, so the review average is typically crap), meaning that we barely get any downloads and can't actually make a living selling apps, or we can ask for reviews and have people complain with 1-star reviews because the app they continue using for free annoyed them once. And entirely because of Apple it needs to annoy them more than once in order to stay relevant. Here's what I'd love to do: Make it so that, if you rate an app 1-star, or even 2-stars, you can't use it any more. If you rate it that low and you still use it, you're lying to other users and harming the creator of the app that you're using for free. Give me a developer API to know what users rated the app how, and I'd implement that in a minute. People could still rate it 1-star if it sucked. Because if it sucked they wouldn't want to use it. Drop the review to 4 stars if you're annoyed by it, but know that the developers really, really have no choice. You're basically telling them to commit economic suicide for your minor convenience.
  - jackvalentine 10y ago
    > that you're using for free Rude assumption. I always, as a matter of principle, buy the "remove ads" IAP if I use an app regularly. Even if I didn't it wasn't my choice to charge nothing for the app. That's on the developer. Apple doesn't owe you a living, I don't owe you a living. The state of the app store has been known for years now and you've had a long time to decline to participate. Your problems with Apple are not my problems as a user.
    - jclardy 10y ago
      They are user problems in a way, but indirectly. Without user reviews new apps are buried even when searched with exact names. So the exact app you need for a niche task will never be found in the first place. The only real solution is for Apple/Google to not wipe the slate every app update. You have to see the user benefit to that - apple right now literally has a direct disincentive to updating an app.
Veen 10y ago
I'm sympathetic to your argument, but the more you harp on about "free" the less sympathetic I get. Most apps aren't free: they ask me to pay with money or data, which I do, or attention, which I prefer not to. Ad supported apps are not literally free — there's an exchange of value from the user to the developer in all cases. I suspect what lies at the heart of this whole issue is that some developers think that attention is not a cost to the user.
deleted 10y ago
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Rex206 10y ago
My landlord just raised my rent. I could use some money. Can I have your phone number so that I can text you and ask you to call my landlord, tell her what a good person I am, and lower my rent? My God, never in a million years would you agree to it. Why? Because you don’t care about my problems. But I’m supposed to care about yours. Why? Because you’re you. Look at your responses. “I don’t care about your problems, but you should care about mine.” Typical. Humans are born naricissists, and they stay that way for life mostly. Once upon a time, there was a saying. It was “the customer is always right.” My how things have changed. Now, it’s “the customer is always wrong.” Look at you. You care nothing about what the customers want. You don’t listen and adapt. If enough customers are giving you 1 star because they don’t like nags, and enough are doing it to effect you, those customers are telling you something. You’re a fool if you don’t listen. If not enough are doing it to effect you, then you don’t have a problem. If every dev that nags gets a one star, then it’s a wash for you. Why are you leaving all of these facts out? Nobody is suggesting ONLY 1-staring you. They’re suggesting 1-staring everyone. You don’t lose anything in such a scenario. Except, those who don’t nag will rise higher in the ratings, and you’ll be here screaming about how you “have to nag because that’s how the system is weighted.” Whether or not you use it as a competitive advantage or not is up to you, although let’s face it, you blame us regardless of what you do. Listen, you have problems. I have problems. We all have problems. My problems aren’t your problems, and yours aren’t mine. Grow up, handle your business, and do it without asking other grown adults to do things for you for free. We’re not your parents. We don’t do things because you’re our special little boy. You don’t do them for us either. You’re an adult now, and that’s the way it works. Or, do what you want, and accept the consequences, which you’ve already been appraised of. Sure, you can throw up a middle finger if you’d like, keep bombing the customers, then periodically cry “It’s sooooo unfaaaaair”. Maybe you’ll get sympathy. For my part, I’ve never given one-star for ratings nags, but I will now. In fact, I’m going to give 10 one-stars as soon as I leave this page. I’ve put money into every app that’s been on my device for more than a month, and I’ve been ripped off along the way … devs changing paid to freemium and throwing ads all over apps I’ve paid for, devs dropping support and releasing “new” versions the next day, dev taking the cash and keeping the ads in the product … you’re all barely better than swindlers these days, and some of you aren’t better at all. Let’s face it. You could not care less. You’re busy worrying about you. I’m supposed to put all of my experience aside, and think about you. Your wants. Your needs. Oh why won’t the customers think of you, the selfish bastids! Manipulating the ratings is nonesense too, and the way you justify your behavior to yourself is such a narcissitic endeavor that it’s humorous. At leats be honest with yourself. Yeah, like you admit, you manipulate things to your advantage, but we’re supposed to do the same. Manipulate things to your advantage. You You YOU. If it benefits you, you find a way to justify it, if it benefits someone else, eh, screw em and their wants. And now, I read that we’ve been stealing your apps, and using them for free, and gosh darnit, we’re so selfish that we don’t stop what we’re doing and rate your app 5 stars to make your lives better like your parents used to do for you whenever they were asked. Yeah, now I actually dislike the nag devs, because I got just a little bit of insight into what they’re thinking, and oh, wouldn’t you know it … it’s “me me me me me”. “But that’s what the customers do! Think about themselves!”, you’ll surely respond, without realizing that, YEAH, they’re supposed to. The customers are suppose to be the selfish people of the transaction. I can just imagine you being a waiter, standing around complaining “bring me some food, refill my drink, all the customers do is think of themselves!” You’re supposed to serve the customers, genius, not the other way around. The customer is there to serve themselves, and you’re there to serve them. If you don’t like it, then boy are you on the wrong side of the transaction. And hey, I’d still like that number if you don’t mind. You can never have to many people to ping when you have a problem, and if you wouldn’t mind me pinging you for some help every now and then, I’d certainly appreciate it. Come on, it’ll only take a few minutes of your time every other month. Me needing help is the way the world is designed. Don’t blame me, blame the system.