21 ms·

What we actually lose when the USDA and EPA can’t talk to the public

119 points by beardog 10y ago

finid 10y ago
On Monday, news broke that the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is now barred from communicating with the public. That means no press releases, blogs, messages, or social media postings. And early this morning, Buzzfeed revealed that The US Department of Agriculture has banned scientists and other employees in its Agricultural Research Service division from sharing the results of its taxpayer-funded research with the broader public. Well, no surprise here, because they told us what they would do if elected. And this is just a continuation of what happened towards the end of the last Bush admin when govt scientists were required to clear any publicly-directed communication with political appointees.
- Xeoncross 10y ago
  Who is "they told us what they would do if elected"? The department heads?
  - finid 10y ago
    Well, assuming you just step out from a space ship, Trump himself has stated that he doesn't believe in climate change, that it's a Chinese hoax or something of that nature. We have a very good search engine called The Google. If you bother to use it, you'll find other crazy stuff that Trump, Rick Perry and others in his administration said during the campaign.
- rayiner 10y ago
  The Constitution commits the executive branch to the control of an elected official: the President. Direct communications with the public undermines the notion that agencies are simply bodies that exist to assist the President, and reinforces the notion that they are an unelected fourth branch of government with their own continuity and agendas. To use an analogy: Samsung should be forthright to the public about exploding Note 7's. But that doesn't mean that Samsung's engineering department should be issuing its own press releases.
  - elastic_church 10y ago
    I'm not exactly opposed to the idea of a more focused executive branch. The federal government has largely assumed many roles simply by finding itself as a logical resourceful intermediary.
  - msrpotus 10y ago
    Would you be arguing that if Hillary Clinton had won and ordered the FBI to stop communicating with the public? Somehow I doubt it.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - rayiner 10y ago
      The Constitution doesn't change depending on who is in power. I happen to agree with the folks that think the administrative state is basically unconstitutional: https://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv22n2/delegation.pdf https://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv22n2/delegation.pdf. But I'd also love for Congress to pass laws outright banning coal use, gasoline cars, and dumping pollutants into waterways.
      - yarou 10y ago
        > But I'd also love for Congress to pass laws outright banning coal use, gasoline cars, and dumping pollutants into waterways. The Constitution hasn't been respected in decades. There is an entrenched deep state in the US, controlled by powerful corporate and industrial interests that are accountable to no one.
    - baddox 10y ago
      I can't answer for that person, but I certainly would.
  - cmurf 10y ago
    Sure, but when the executive branch is also waging a disinformation campaign on undisputable facts, where merely saying things makes them true, is going to have consequences.
JumpCrisscross 10y ago
> On Monday, news broke that the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is now barred from communicating with the public No, an "an internal email sent to staff at [the USDA's] Agricultural Research Service unit this week calling for a suspension of 'public-facing documents, including news releases and photos, WAS FLAWED AND...NEW GUIDANCE WOULD BE ISSUED TO REPLACE IT" [1] (emphasis mine). From what I can tell, Popular Science got this drivel from this Buzzfeed article [2]. EDIT: Pardon me, got the EPA and USDA confused. [1] http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-usda-idUSKBN1582OB http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-usda-idUSKBN1582... [2] https://www.buzzfeed.com/dinograndoni/trump-usda?utm_term=.qlrNQBKNzX#.peZwEnawdB https://www.buzzfeed.com/dinograndoni/trump-usda?utm_term=.q...
- csours 10y ago
  1. After we got caught saying "no more public communications", we are going to find a nicer way to say "no more public communications". 2. Buzzfeed notes that in addition to the leaked (and therefore questionable) policy emails, in fact there have been no new social media posts from the agencies in question.
- burkaman 10y ago
  The EPA order is real, and separate from the USDA one: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/environmental-protection-grants-staff_us_5886825be4b0e3a7356b575f http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/environmental-protection... Edit: You can see the full list of gag order reports here: https://sunlightfoundation.com/list-of-federal-government-agencies-told-not-to-communicate-with-the-public/ https://sunlightfoundation.com/list-of-federal-government-ag...
  - JumpCrisscross 10y ago
    You're right--thank you. Sincere apologies to Buzzfeed :)
- stevenbedrick 10y ago
  No, similar things happened at multiple agencies. The EPA was one of them. http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2017/01/24/us/politics/ap-us-trump-agencies-crackdown.html http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2017/01/24/us/politics/ap-us... > WASHINGTON — The Trump administration has instituted a media blackout at the Environmental Protection Agency and barred staff from awarding any new contracts or grants, part of a broader communications clampdown within the executive branch.
funmi463 10y ago
Making America Great! Democrat and independent Trump voters should pat themselves on the back!
notadoc 10y ago
We're in a post reality era
User23 10y ago
These agencies currently have no top leadership. My understanding is that this is just temporary until new cabinet secretaries are confirmed and can set communications policies. They don't want a situation where they have to issue releases a week later saying "strike that, reverse that!" This site is where the sober-minded logical people go to discuss things, so let's save the anti-Trump panic for when the FEMA death camps open up or something.
- euyyn 10y ago
  So this has happened every time the presidency has changed from one party to the other?
  - dhfhduk 10y ago
    I heard a news report that what happened at DHHS was normal. What happened at the EPA was not. The USDA has since released some statement that there was some confusion, and the gag order email should not have gone out and was incorrect.

119 points by beardog 10y ago

finid 10y ago

On Monday, news broke that the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is now barred from communicating with the public. That means no press releases, blogs, messages, or social media postings. And early this morning, Buzzfeed revealed that The US Department of Agriculture has banned scientists and other employees in its Agricultural Research Service division from sharing the results of its taxpayer-funded research with the broader public. Well, no surprise here, because they told us what they would do if elected. And this is just a continuation of what happened towards the end of the last Bush admin when govt scientists were required to clear any publicly-directed communication with political appointees.

Xeoncross 10y ago
Who is "they told us what they would do if elected"? The department heads?
- finid 10y ago
  Well, assuming you just step out from a space ship, Trump himself has stated that he doesn't believe in climate change, that it's a Chinese hoax or something of that nature. We have a very good search engine called The Google. If you bother to use it, you'll find other crazy stuff that Trump, Rick Perry and others in his administration said during the campaign.
rayiner 10y ago
The Constitution commits the executive branch to the control of an elected official: the President. Direct communications with the public undermines the notion that agencies are simply bodies that exist to assist the President, and reinforces the notion that they are an unelected fourth branch of government with their own continuity and agendas. To use an analogy: Samsung should be forthright to the public about exploding Note 7's. But that doesn't mean that Samsung's engineering department should be issuing its own press releases.
- elastic_church 10y ago
  I'm not exactly opposed to the idea of a more focused executive branch. The federal government has largely assumed many roles simply by finding itself as a logical resourceful intermediary.
- msrpotus 10y ago
  Would you be arguing that if Hillary Clinton had won and ordered the FBI to stop communicating with the public? Somehow I doubt it.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - rayiner 10y ago
    The Constitution doesn't change depending on who is in power. I happen to agree with the folks that think the administrative state is basically unconstitutional: https://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv22n2/delegation.pdf https://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv22n2/delegation.pdf. But I'd also love for Congress to pass laws outright banning coal use, gasoline cars, and dumping pollutants into waterways.
    - yarou 10y ago
      > But I'd also love for Congress to pass laws outright banning coal use, gasoline cars, and dumping pollutants into waterways. The Constitution hasn't been respected in decades. There is an entrenched deep state in the US, controlled by powerful corporate and industrial interests that are accountable to no one.
  - baddox 10y ago
    I can't answer for that person, but I certainly would.
- cmurf 10y ago
  Sure, but when the executive branch is also waging a disinformation campaign on undisputable facts, where merely saying things makes them true, is going to have consequences.

JumpCrisscross 10y ago

> On Monday, news broke that the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is now barred from communicating with the public No, an "an internal email sent to staff at [the USDA's] Agricultural Research Service unit this week calling for a suspension of 'public-facing documents, including news releases and photos, WAS FLAWED AND...NEW GUIDANCE WOULD BE ISSUED TO REPLACE IT" [1] (emphasis mine). From what I can tell, Popular Science got this drivel from this Buzzfeed article [2]. EDIT: Pardon me, got the EPA and USDA confused. [1] http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-usda-idUSKBN1582OB http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-usda-idUSKBN1582... [2] https://www.buzzfeed.com/dinograndoni/trump-usda?utm_term=.qlrNQBKNzX#.peZwEnawdB https://www.buzzfeed.com/dinograndoni/trump-usda?utm_term=.q...

csours 10y ago
1. After we got caught saying "no more public communications", we are going to find a nicer way to say "no more public communications". 2. Buzzfeed notes that in addition to the leaked (and therefore questionable) policy emails, in fact there have been no new social media posts from the agencies in question.
burkaman 10y ago
The EPA order is real, and separate from the USDA one: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/environmental-protection-grants-staff_us_5886825be4b0e3a7356b575f http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/environmental-protection... Edit: You can see the full list of gag order reports here: https://sunlightfoundation.com/list-of-federal-government-agencies-told-not-to-communicate-with-the-public/ https://sunlightfoundation.com/list-of-federal-government-ag...
- JumpCrisscross 10y ago
  You're right--thank you. Sincere apologies to Buzzfeed :)
stevenbedrick 10y ago
No, similar things happened at multiple agencies. The EPA was one of them. http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2017/01/24/us/politics/ap-us-trump-agencies-crackdown.html http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2017/01/24/us/politics/ap-us... > WASHINGTON — The Trump administration has instituted a media blackout at the Environmental Protection Agency and barred staff from awarding any new contracts or grants, part of a broader communications clampdown within the executive branch.

funmi463 10y ago

Making America Great! Democrat and independent Trump voters should pat themselves on the back!

notadoc 10y ago

We're in a post reality era

User23 10y ago

These agencies currently have no top leadership. My understanding is that this is just temporary until new cabinet secretaries are confirmed and can set communications policies. They don't want a situation where they have to issue releases a week later saying "strike that, reverse that!" This site is where the sober-minded logical people go to discuss things, so let's save the anti-Trump panic for when the FEMA death camps open up or something.

euyyn 10y ago
So this has happened every time the presidency has changed from one party to the other?
- dhfhduk 10y ago
  I heard a news report that what happened at DHHS was normal. What happened at the EPA was not. The USDA has since released some statement that there was some confusion, and the gag order email should not have gone out and was incorrect.