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They are an a lot quieter. But don't be fooled. Even with shitty long guns (not even riffles since they weren't riffled), the American Indians swapped bows for

They are an a lot quieter. But don't be fooled. Even with shitty long guns (not even riffles since they weren't riffled), the American Indians swapped bows for guns. They still used bows, but took to guns due to their power.

aaron-lebo 10y ago
Interestingly, in the American Southwest guns didn't really challenge bows until the introduction of the Colt revolver. Even Kentucky long rifles which were very effective against infantry were pretty much worthless against mounted natives who could fire dozens of arrows a minute. This was the case up until about the 1850s.
- big_youth 10y ago
  This article disagrees with you: https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-the-introduction-of-guns-change-native-america https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-the-introduction-of-guns-chan... "It is common to deride early modern firearms as slow to load, inaccurate and undependable in wet weather. Indians had a more favourable opinion of these weapons, particularly of the flintlock muskets that became available at the beginning of the 1630s. ... Flintlocks were still cumbersome. They required about 25 seconds to load, and were accurate only to about 100 yards. Yet Indians did not intend to use the weapon in open-field, pitched battles. Rather, they wanted flintlocks to fire on human or animal targets from ambush at close range. After firing, they would rush in with hand weapons. The manner in which Native peoples used guns is critical to understanding their demand for them."
qball 10y ago
>They still used bows, but took to guns due to their power. Not necessarily. Early guns were inefficient; one shot every minute is nothing compared to what a good bowman can do and you couldn't place an accurate shot outside of a few yards. The reason an army switches to guns is because they require very little strength (and consequentially, training time) to use. In fact, for a musket, the limiting factor would be the user's height (they're 5 feet tall; being much shorter than that would make reloading much more difficult). For American Indians, it would make sense to switch as their stocks of trained bowmen were depleted. Not before then.
- Apocryphon 10y ago
  For modern day preppers, why not use crossbows, as a compromise?
  - qball 10y ago
    Because military surplus exists, and it's cheap. You still need a significant amount of strength and time to ready a crossbow. Anyone can fire it, but not everyone can load it. Also the bolt is relatively slow (the shot travels in an arc that's more pronounced the slower the projectile), requiring you to be close to what you want to hit. And if you're hunting game, even firing a crossbow will likely spook your target. Or you could buy some 100-year-old military rifle and become proficient with it. Nearly all of them fire rounds that can be (and frequently are) successfully used for taking all North American game. And a bolt-action surplus rifle (or any other repeater) is still faster than any bow, and you can carry more rounds than you can arrows in a quiver for the same weight, and bullets don't snap in half or depend on delicate pieces on the shaft to fly straight.

aaron-lebo 10y ago

Interestingly, in the American Southwest guns didn't really challenge bows until the introduction of the Colt revolver. Even Kentucky long rifles which were very effective against infantry were pretty much worthless against mounted natives who could fire dozens of arrows a minute. This was the case up until about the 1850s.

big_youth 10y ago
This article disagrees with you: https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-the-introduction-of-guns-change-native-america https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-the-introduction-of-guns-chan... "It is common to deride early modern firearms as slow to load, inaccurate and undependable in wet weather. Indians had a more favourable opinion of these weapons, particularly of the flintlock muskets that became available at the beginning of the 1630s. ... Flintlocks were still cumbersome. They required about 25 seconds to load, and were accurate only to about 100 yards. Yet Indians did not intend to use the weapon in open-field, pitched battles. Rather, they wanted flintlocks to fire on human or animal targets from ambush at close range. After firing, they would rush in with hand weapons. The manner in which Native peoples used guns is critical to understanding their demand for them."

qball 10y ago

>They still used bows, but took to guns due to their power. Not necessarily. Early guns were inefficient; one shot every minute is nothing compared to what a good bowman can do and you couldn't place an accurate shot outside of a few yards. The reason an army switches to guns is because they require very little strength (and consequentially, training time) to use. In fact, for a musket, the limiting factor would be the user's height (they're 5 feet tall; being much shorter than that would make reloading much more difficult). For American Indians, it would make sense to switch as their stocks of trained bowmen were depleted. Not before then.

Apocryphon 10y ago
For modern day preppers, why not use crossbows, as a compromise?
- qball 10y ago
  Because military surplus exists, and it's cheap. You still need a significant amount of strength and time to ready a crossbow. Anyone can fire it, but not everyone can load it. Also the bolt is relatively slow (the shot travels in an arc that's more pronounced the slower the projectile), requiring you to be close to what you want to hit. And if you're hunting game, even firing a crossbow will likely spook your target. Or you could buy some 100-year-old military rifle and become proficient with it. Nearly all of them fire rounds that can be (and frequently are) successfully used for taking all North American game. And a bolt-action surplus rifle (or any other repeater) is still faster than any bow, and you can carry more rounds than you can arrows in a quiver for the same weight, and bullets don't snap in half or depend on delicate pieces on the shaft to fly straight.