8 ms·

Headmistress scuppered by red tape as she tried to use mobile phone jamming tech

14 points by atomical 10y ago

jacobush 10y ago
Jamming radio is frowned upon. She could create Faraday-cage classrooms though. Maybe start with a study room in the library? :)
- Cpoll 10y ago
  I imagine that would even be cheaper. I think aluminum foil wallpaper might be enough. You could probably force the kids to help you line the walls. Anti-static bags could fill the gaps where the windows are.
  - jacobush 10y ago
    Many modern 3 pane windows are already blocking cell phone radio.
aDevilInMe 10y ago
This is not a case of red tape. Preventing emergancy signals or signals from other users is illegal, get over it and recoup some of the money wasted on a jammer.
- libeclipse 10y ago
  Exactly. Something like this is so blatantly and obviously illegal that it's frankly surprising that anyone even proposed this plan. Also it's shocking that the article's headline seems to imply that the head is in the right here.
  - Cephlin 10y ago
    I agree. You try to stop my kid from being able to contact me or the emergency services and my kid won't be in your school.
    - celticninja 10y ago
      I went through 10+ years of schooling where I could not immediately contact my parents and I and many others survived just fine. I think that school aged children having mobile devices probably does more harm than good when you factor in cyber bullying. Has there been an occasion where your child has had to contact you in an emergency? For everyone who is misinterpreting this statement. I am not suggesting that jamming phone signals is acceptable. It isn't for the very reasons provided to the headteacher in the article. What I am suggesting is that children do not need access to their devices during lesson time, at which point the children are being supervised by a responsible adult (the teacher) who is able to contact emergency services or parents in the event of an emergency. Requiring students to hand in and retrieve their mobile phones from teachers at the start and end of a lesson is an entirely reasonable solution to the problem being faced by this (and probably many others) school.
      - libeclipse 10y ago
        That's anecdotal evidence. What's to say your experience reflects the experience of all children in school today?
        celticninja 10y ago
        please see my edit.
      - wlesieutre 10y ago
        Me too! Now that you mention it, I've never even had to call 911 once in my life. I guess we can just start putting cell phone jammers up everywhere and it'll be fine.
        celticninja 10y ago
        Perhaps you misunderstood me, at no point did i say jamming phone signals was acceptable. 24/7 access to a mobile device is what i was suggesting was unnecssary.
      - 10y ago
- scotty79 10y ago
  Would be turning a room into big Faraday's cage with the sole purpose of preventing radio communication also illegal? Let's assume people are free to leave the room if they need.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - wiredfool 10y ago
    No, but you'd need a better Faraday cage than a microwave.
- bkor 10y ago
  It also nicely ignores that you're not blocking it at school. You're causing interference for an entire area. The article is weird though; "think of the children", "red tape", etc. Too much intended to trigger a response.
sgift 10y ago
Well, now she will have to use alternatives like .. more interesting lessons. Or taking smartphones at the start of class, that could work too.
DanBC 10y ago
She should make use of the draconian UK laws under the Education Act 2010 around mobile phones in schools and just start seizing the phones. https://wiki.openrightsgroup.org/wiki/Education_Act_2011 https://wiki.openrightsgroup.org/wiki/Education_Act_2011 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2011/21/section/2/enacted#p00105 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2011/21/section/2/enacte... (We haven't heard much about these laws. I don't think most people on HN, even the privacy conscious people in UK have heard much about them.)
- Symbiote 10y ago
  What teacher would want to use those powers? If, as suggested, they're intended for looking at 'sexting' images, then the teacher would be looking at child pornography. If they delete an image, the evidence is destroyed¹. "Mr Brown took my phone to look at the pictures I'd sent to <boyfriend>. He's creepy, he stares at me in class" — no thanks! ¹ Ignoring recovery methods
6stringmerc 10y ago
Why all this tech effort when simple authority and transparency will do? Build a multi-compartment lucite / acrylic (clear) box, where each slot can hold 1 phone. Students enter and turn off phone notifications, put in a cubby, then take their seat. Retrieve phone at end of class. In certain circumstances - pending family news perhaps - a student might ask and be permitted to keep their phone on their person. If there's other unexpected family emergencies, contact the school, not the student directly. The expectation of being able to bypass the school isn't a fair one to me. As an occasional educator, I'm quite fond of the "beacuse I said so and I'm paid to tell you what to do" philosophy of having a little leeway with maintaining authority for a group of 10-30 pupils. Behavior doesn't always improve with age. Certain strategies exist for a reason.
- DanBC 10y ago
  The head teacher is talking about bullying happening on social media which is interfering with student's school life. > Ms Poley said: “Ultimately, all students need to be able to come into school feeling supported and safe and be able to concentrate on the next 13 weeks of study and revision. > “I will take much stronger exclusion action on any further unnecessary ‘social’ fall-outs which impact on school life and ask you to support us by monitoring mobile phone usage at home. (Edit: I didn't downvote you.)
- aianus 10y ago
  Why shouldn't students be allowed to use their phones during class? In college we all had laptops in front of us in every lecture and it didn't stop us from learning.
  - celticninja 10y ago
    Because younger children are less disciplined and perhaps not as aware of the harm they are causing themselves by playing candy crush in their maths lesson. In college you are 18+, mature enough to make your own decisions, at 11 - 17 most (not all) are unable to do this. Why do you need a phone in school anyway? Why do you need twitter or facebook or candycrush so immediately? Yes in an emergency they would be useful, but lets be honest many people survived their schooldays with a mobile phone so I am not sure why you feel that a 12year old must have a mobile phone with them at all times.
mig39 10y ago
This is just nuts. Looking for a tech solution to a human problem. If a kid in my class was misusing their phone or laptop, I'd just take it away for a period of time. Simple. If they are repeat offenders, I'd throw their screen on the projector. Or read out their chat log :-) But I'd rather they have internet access than not. Even if it means they use social media.
- scotty79 10y ago
  Yup. It's as if they used technological solution to keep children in class - a door lock. Or to keep them seated and looking at the blackboard - restraints.
freedrock87 10y ago
"scuppered" New word I learned today.
- coldcode 10y ago
  You never hear that word in the US, its very British. I wonder if it is even rare there today.
edent 10y ago
Even if they did manage to block 3G, 4G, and WiFi - it's almost impossible to block Bluetooth. Hey-presto, P2P communication which is impossible to effectively monitor. Oh, and trust the The Telegraph go with the archaic term "headmistress" - the term preferred by most people in education is "headteacher". Take a look at the school's own website - http://www.wensleydale.n-yorks.sch.uk/Our-School/The-Governing-Body http://www.wensleydale.n-yorks.sch.uk/Our-School/The-Governi...
grecy 10y ago
I often day-dream of making a faraday-cage bar, or restaurant. I'd put a ton of signs up making it clear that phones won't work inside, and people enter know that , etc. etc. I think it would be nice to go out and actually talk to people, rather than just sit at a table of people playing with their phones.
libeclipse 10y ago
For sixth-form in my school they have a very relaxed approach to mobile phones. Don't blatantly be ignoring what the teacher is saying and just using your phone, and also don't disrupt other people in the class with your phone. It works very well. I can't remember the last time someone was abusing the privilege. I mean we all usually have our phones out in class anyways to open formulas, research quick things, make notes or check work. It's never been a problem.
gremlinsinc 10y ago
App idea for anyone w/ mobile dev: Required to bring into school, it gives each student 45 minutes of internet per day while in the school and between the hours of open/close set by the school. Presumably those will be used during lunch/recess/switching classes/emergencies - school can see a list of all students w/ the app installed who checked into the school, could even be used to take attendance... though I guess someone could take a friend's phone to school and fake their attendance... so maybe not..
adambrenecki 10y ago
> red tape ... > Such technology is illegal because jammers are likely to affect wider areas and other frequencies than those they are intended for. They can also result in the disruption of emergency and rescue radio services in the public area. Oh fuck off. This isn't red tape, this is the law doing exactly what it's supposed to: protecting public safety and people's access to an essential service. I'd love to see this principal bleating about "red tape" to the coroner after one of her students is hit by a car out the front of the school, and dies because nobody can call an ambulance. (Well, no, I'm glad that this nonsense is being nipped in the bud before something awful like that happens, but that's exactly the scenario this idiot is setting herself up for.)

14 points by atomical 10y ago

Jamming radio is frowned upon. She could create Faraday-cage classrooms though. Maybe start with a study room in the library? :)

Cpoll 10y ago
I imagine that would even be cheaper. I think aluminum foil wallpaper might be enough. You could probably force the kids to help you line the walls. Anti-static bags could fill the gaps where the windows are.
- jacobush 10y ago
  Many modern 3 pane windows are already blocking cell phone radio.

aDevilInMe 10y ago

This is not a case of red tape. Preventing emergancy signals or signals from other users is illegal, get over it and recoup some of the money wasted on a jammer.

libeclipse 10y ago
Exactly. Something like this is so blatantly and obviously illegal that it's frankly surprising that anyone even proposed this plan. Also it's shocking that the article's headline seems to imply that the head is in the right here.
- Cephlin 10y ago
  I agree. You try to stop my kid from being able to contact me or the emergency services and my kid won't be in your school.
  - celticninja 10y ago
    I went through 10+ years of schooling where I could not immediately contact my parents and I and many others survived just fine. I think that school aged children having mobile devices probably does more harm than good when you factor in cyber bullying. Has there been an occasion where your child has had to contact you in an emergency? For everyone who is misinterpreting this statement. I am not suggesting that jamming phone signals is acceptable. It isn't for the very reasons provided to the headteacher in the article. What I am suggesting is that children do not need access to their devices during lesson time, at which point the children are being supervised by a responsible adult (the teacher) who is able to contact emergency services or parents in the event of an emergency. Requiring students to hand in and retrieve their mobile phones from teachers at the start and end of a lesson is an entirely reasonable solution to the problem being faced by this (and probably many others) school.
    - libeclipse 10y ago
      That's anecdotal evidence. What's to say your experience reflects the experience of all children in school today?
      - celticninja 10y ago
        please see my edit.
    - wlesieutre 10y ago
      Me too! Now that you mention it, I've never even had to call 911 once in my life. I guess we can just start putting cell phone jammers up everywhere and it'll be fine.
      - celticninja 10y ago
        Perhaps you misunderstood me, at no point did i say jamming phone signals was acceptable. 24/7 access to a mobile device is what i was suggesting was unnecssary.
    - 10y ago
scotty79 10y ago
Would be turning a room into big Faraday's cage with the sole purpose of preventing radio communication also illegal? Let's assume people are free to leave the room if they need.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- wiredfool 10y ago
  No, but you'd need a better Faraday cage than a microwave.
bkor 10y ago
It also nicely ignores that you're not blocking it at school. You're causing interference for an entire area. The article is weird though; "think of the children", "red tape", etc. Too much intended to trigger a response.

sgift 10y ago

Well, now she will have to use alternatives like .. more interesting lessons. Or taking smartphones at the start of class, that could work too.

DanBC 10y ago

She should make use of the draconian UK laws under the Education Act 2010 around mobile phones in schools and just start seizing the phones. https://wiki.openrightsgroup.org/wiki/Education_Act_2011 https://wiki.openrightsgroup.org/wiki/Education_Act_2011 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2011/21/section/2/enacted#p00105 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2011/21/section/2/enacte... (We haven't heard much about these laws. I don't think most people on HN, even the privacy conscious people in UK have heard much about them.)

Symbiote 10y ago
What teacher would want to use those powers? If, as suggested, they're intended for looking at 'sexting' images, then the teacher would be looking at child pornography. If they delete an image, the evidence is destroyed¹. "Mr Brown took my phone to look at the pictures I'd sent to <boyfriend>. He's creepy, he stares at me in class" — no thanks! ¹ Ignoring recovery methods

6stringmerc 10y ago

Why all this tech effort when simple authority and transparency will do? Build a multi-compartment lucite / acrylic (clear) box, where each slot can hold 1 phone. Students enter and turn off phone notifications, put in a cubby, then take their seat. Retrieve phone at end of class. In certain circumstances - pending family news perhaps - a student might ask and be permitted to keep their phone on their person. If there's other unexpected family emergencies, contact the school, not the student directly. The expectation of being able to bypass the school isn't a fair one to me. As an occasional educator, I'm quite fond of the "beacuse I said so and I'm paid to tell you what to do" philosophy of having a little leeway with maintaining authority for a group of 10-30 pupils. Behavior doesn't always improve with age. Certain strategies exist for a reason.

DanBC 10y ago
The head teacher is talking about bullying happening on social media which is interfering with student's school life. > Ms Poley said: “Ultimately, all students need to be able to come into school feeling supported and safe and be able to concentrate on the next 13 weeks of study and revision. > “I will take much stronger exclusion action on any further unnecessary ‘social’ fall-outs which impact on school life and ask you to support us by monitoring mobile phone usage at home. (Edit: I didn't downvote you.)
aianus 10y ago
Why shouldn't students be allowed to use their phones during class? In college we all had laptops in front of us in every lecture and it didn't stop us from learning.
- celticninja 10y ago
  Because younger children are less disciplined and perhaps not as aware of the harm they are causing themselves by playing candy crush in their maths lesson. In college you are 18+, mature enough to make your own decisions, at 11 - 17 most (not all) are unable to do this. Why do you need a phone in school anyway? Why do you need twitter or facebook or candycrush so immediately? Yes in an emergency they would be useful, but lets be honest many people survived their schooldays with a mobile phone so I am not sure why you feel that a 12year old must have a mobile phone with them at all times.

mig39 10y ago

This is just nuts. Looking for a tech solution to a human problem. If a kid in my class was misusing their phone or laptop, I'd just take it away for a period of time. Simple. If they are repeat offenders, I'd throw their screen on the projector. Or read out their chat log :-) But I'd rather they have internet access than not. Even if it means they use social media.

scotty79 10y ago
Yup. It's as if they used technological solution to keep children in class - a door lock. Or to keep them seated and looking at the blackboard - restraints.

freedrock87 10y ago

"scuppered" New word I learned today.

coldcode 10y ago
You never hear that word in the US, its very British. I wonder if it is even rare there today.

edent 10y ago

Even if they did manage to block 3G, 4G, and WiFi - it's almost impossible to block Bluetooth. Hey-presto, P2P communication which is impossible to effectively monitor. Oh, and trust the The Telegraph go with the archaic term "headmistress" - the term preferred by most people in education is "headteacher". Take a look at the school's own website - http://www.wensleydale.n-yorks.sch.uk/Our-School/The-Governing-Body http://www.wensleydale.n-yorks.sch.uk/Our-School/The-Governi...

grecy 10y ago

I often day-dream of making a faraday-cage bar, or restaurant. I'd put a ton of signs up making it clear that phones won't work inside, and people enter know that , etc. etc. I think it would be nice to go out and actually talk to people, rather than just sit at a table of people playing with their phones.

libeclipse 10y ago

For sixth-form in my school they have a very relaxed approach to mobile phones. Don't blatantly be ignoring what the teacher is saying and just using your phone, and also don't disrupt other people in the class with your phone. It works very well. I can't remember the last time someone was abusing the privilege. I mean we all usually have our phones out in class anyways to open formulas, research quick things, make notes or check work. It's never been a problem.

gremlinsinc 10y ago

App idea for anyone w/ mobile dev: Required to bring into school, it gives each student 45 minutes of internet per day while in the school and between the hours of open/close set by the school. Presumably those will be used during lunch/recess/switching classes/emergencies - school can see a list of all students w/ the app installed who checked into the school, could even be used to take attendance... though I guess someone could take a friend's phone to school and fake their attendance... so maybe not..

adambrenecki 10y ago

> red tape ... > Such technology is illegal because jammers are likely to affect wider areas and other frequencies than those they are intended for. They can also result in the disruption of emergency and rescue radio services in the public area. Oh fuck off. This isn't red tape, this is the law doing exactly what it's supposed to: protecting public safety and people's access to an essential service. I'd love to see this principal bleating about "red tape" to the coroner after one of her students is hit by a car out the front of the school, and dies because nobody can call an ambulance. (Well, no, I'm glad that this nonsense is being nipped in the bud before something awful like that happens, but that's exactly the scenario this idiot is setting herself up for.)