5 ms·

You know, a lot of CS people in the US seem to really love the US and say stuff like "it sucks not to be in the US." They usually mention how they can afford ev

You know, a lot of CS people in the US seem to really love the US and say stuff like "it sucks not to be in the US." They usually mention how they can afford everything since they make so much money and how they prefer to work 600 hours a week instead of having forced days off and that health care through Employer is so much better than through government. Admittedly, this was on Reddit, which is just a huge echo chamber, which led me to stop using it. However, I wonder how your point of view on this subject is?

intralizee 10y ago
I believe a lot of tech people are the type that prefer a computer as everything around them is madness in disguise. A lot of people I know over time build mental walls that resemble what the US culture respects and pushes on everyone. Work is #1 and money is everything. I see people that never use their vacation days and feel bad when they do! I believe if there was more focus on philosophy teachings in the US, things would be different and maybe more healthy individuals would exist. I think it's easier in the US to fall into a unhealthy pattern of life and not realize it. Some people are dumb founded by the notion or just don't think about it as they don't see alternative options available. I've had luck of working with many older engineers that advise if they had done things differently in life...
- chrisper 10y ago
  >don't see alternative options available Yes. This is how I feel when reading those comments as well. I am from Europe, but living in the US at the moment, but will be moving back soon again. Obviously, people who never experienced an alternative cannot really see how what they have now might be bad. Having been in both Europe and the US I can easily compare both lifestyles and conclude that Europe is more suited for me, even if it means that I will not own a 5 bedroom house with 6 TVs.
- CalRobert 10y ago
  When I worked in tech in the US, I got three or four weeks off. This was considered an incredible degree of largess on the part of my employers. Unfortunately, though, my partner generally got only a week off per year (she works in museums, a tough industry). In Europe we both get a month off every year by law, which means we can both enjoy it. My salary is lower, but hers is higher. In general, we find we have more fun this way.
friedman23 10y ago
> how they prefer to work 600 hours a week instead of having forced days off Your idea of jobs in the US is wrong. I work 40 hrs a week and sometimes that goes up to 45 or 50 but not often. I get breakfast and lunch provided to me (also dinner but I don't stay for it because I would go insane) and I make 150k + 80k a year in equity. You could also however work at amazon and get paid the same but also work 60 hours a week (Amazon is the exception and has a very bad reputation). > health care through Employer is so much better than through government Health care through the employer can be significantly better than through the government. It can also be worse. If you are a high performer in the US, it is perfect.
- umanwizard 10y ago
  The Amazon thing is not necessarily true, I worked there for two years and nearly consistently did 40/h weeks. There is a lot of variance between teams.
- chrisper 10y ago
  I think you misunderstood what I meant with that. I was trying to make the point that whenever people say the US is great, they mention that they would rather work 60 hours a week than maybe 40 and being forced to take every other Friday off or whatever. I am not saying all jobs are like this, but people who say that everything else than the US sucks use this argument. And why do you think that getting insurance through the employer is better than government? Maybe it is only great for people who know they won't get laid off. In Europe if you get laid off you are still insured. If you are working and wish to have better insurance, you can always go with a private insurance company. I am just not fond of the idea that basic social services are tied to your employment status, since getting laid off could put you in a negative cycle.
renaudg 10y ago
To me (working in London), the biggest difference in France is the attitude towards healthcare : it's not a business, rather a right. I first heard the words "Preexisting condition" when I moved to London and researched private insurance there.
- manarth 10y ago
  "the attitude towards healthcare : it's not a business, rather a right" "I first heard the words "Preexisting condition" when I moved to London and researched private insurance there." Might that be a reflection that it's private healthcare in a country which already provides free healthcare? The human right to healthcare is already catered for in the UK, through the NHS, so private healthcare doesn't have to accommodate the right, it's simply a business.
  - user5994461 10y ago
    There are both in France. You have the official national healthcare that you're forced to pay "la securite sociale" and a wide range of private healthcare that you're forced to pay as well "une mutuelle".
    - gcp 10y ago
      private healthcare that you're forced to pay as well "une mutuelle" You're not actually forced to pay them, are you?
      - user5994461 10y ago
        You are definitely forced to pay. Noawadays, it's even picked and forced by your employer (but taken on your pay). You may not be able choose or deny the plan you're offered. It's messy.
        emmanuel_1234 10y ago
        It's forced from your employer. This is, in fact, a benefit most of the time (as your employer also contributes to it).

intralizee 10y ago

I believe a lot of tech people are the type that prefer a computer as everything around them is madness in disguise. A lot of people I know over time build mental walls that resemble what the US culture respects and pushes on everyone. Work is #1 and money is everything. I see people that never use their vacation days and feel bad when they do! I believe if there was more focus on philosophy teachings in the US, things would be different and maybe more healthy individuals would exist. I think it's easier in the US to fall into a unhealthy pattern of life and not realize it. Some people are dumb founded by the notion or just don't think about it as they don't see alternative options available. I've had luck of working with many older engineers that advise if they had done things differently in life...

chrisper 10y ago
>don't see alternative options available Yes. This is how I feel when reading those comments as well. I am from Europe, but living in the US at the moment, but will be moving back soon again. Obviously, people who never experienced an alternative cannot really see how what they have now might be bad. Having been in both Europe and the US I can easily compare both lifestyles and conclude that Europe is more suited for me, even if it means that I will not own a 5 bedroom house with 6 TVs.
CalRobert 10y ago
When I worked in tech in the US, I got three or four weeks off. This was considered an incredible degree of largess on the part of my employers. Unfortunately, though, my partner generally got only a week off per year (she works in museums, a tough industry). In Europe we both get a month off every year by law, which means we can both enjoy it. My salary is lower, but hers is higher. In general, we find we have more fun this way.

friedman23 10y ago

> how they prefer to work 600 hours a week instead of having forced days off Your idea of jobs in the US is wrong. I work 40 hrs a week and sometimes that goes up to 45 or 50 but not often. I get breakfast and lunch provided to me (also dinner but I don't stay for it because I would go insane) and I make 150k + 80k a year in equity. You could also however work at amazon and get paid the same but also work 60 hours a week (Amazon is the exception and has a very bad reputation). > health care through Employer is so much better than through government Health care through the employer can be significantly better than through the government. It can also be worse. If you are a high performer in the US, it is perfect.

umanwizard 10y ago
The Amazon thing is not necessarily true, I worked there for two years and nearly consistently did 40/h weeks. There is a lot of variance between teams.
chrisper 10y ago
I think you misunderstood what I meant with that. I was trying to make the point that whenever people say the US is great, they mention that they would rather work 60 hours a week than maybe 40 and being forced to take every other Friday off or whatever. I am not saying all jobs are like this, but people who say that everything else than the US sucks use this argument. And why do you think that getting insurance through the employer is better than government? Maybe it is only great for people who know they won't get laid off. In Europe if you get laid off you are still insured. If you are working and wish to have better insurance, you can always go with a private insurance company. I am just not fond of the idea that basic social services are tied to your employment status, since getting laid off could put you in a negative cycle.

renaudg 10y ago

To me (working in London), the biggest difference in France is the attitude towards healthcare : it's not a business, rather a right. I first heard the words "Preexisting condition" when I moved to London and researched private insurance there.

manarth 10y ago
"the attitude towards healthcare : it's not a business, rather a right" "I first heard the words "Preexisting condition" when I moved to London and researched private insurance there." Might that be a reflection that it's private healthcare in a country which already provides free healthcare? The human right to healthcare is already catered for in the UK, through the NHS, so private healthcare doesn't have to accommodate the right, it's simply a business.
- user5994461 10y ago
  There are both in France. You have the official national healthcare that you're forced to pay "la securite sociale" and a wide range of private healthcare that you're forced to pay as well "une mutuelle".
  - gcp 10y ago
    private healthcare that you're forced to pay as well "une mutuelle" You're not actually forced to pay them, are you?
    - user5994461 10y ago
      You are definitely forced to pay. Noawadays, it's even picked and forced by your employer (but taken on your pay). You may not be able choose or deny the plan you're offered. It's messy.
      - emmanuel_1234 10y ago
        It's forced from your employer. This is, in fact, a benefit most of the time (as your employer also contributes to it).