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Exactly, and I think it's worth noting that they likely only apply this level of security because of state actors. Which then shows that they are trying to prev

by dx034 10y ago

Exactly, and I think it's worth noting that they likely only apply this level of security because of state actors. Which then shows that they are trying to prevent eavesdropping by NSA & Co., they probably just realized too late how far advanced they were.

DannyB2 10y ago
. . . how far advanced, and the lengths they would go to.
nickik 10y ago
Eric Grosse from Google says as much here, ... Edit, it seems I have copied the wrong video, please us the link in the child comment
- prattmic 10y ago
  This talk is also discusses the adversaries: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knR6vXba7g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knR6vXba7g
a_imho 10y ago
Which then shows that they are trying to prevent eavesdropping by NSA & Co. Why would the NSA eavesdrop on Google, they are in bed with them, aren't they?
- kakarot 10y ago
  Got links?
  - a_imho 10y ago
    For me, the whole takeaway of the Snowden leaks was that the NSA can legally force Google (or anyone) to hand over basically anything, am I mistaken? Articles like [1] seems to underline they are indeed working together. [1] http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/06/nsa-google_n_5273437.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/06/nsa-google_n_527343...
    - kakarot 10y ago
      An abusive, rapey relationship is not the same thing as being "in bed".
      - a_imho 10y ago
        That link is anything but an abusive relationship. Still, I fail to see how silicone is a countermeasure to a court order.
        rl3 10y ago
        When Google has its networks compromised and is routinely compelled to comply with NSLs, I'd say that counts as abusive.
    - Pyxl101 10y ago
      The Snowden disclosures did not suggest that Internet companies like Google were coordinating with NSA. The disclosures suggested that NSA was wiretapping all traffic across the Internet, and then parsing it, storing it, and indexing it so as to be able to make sense of what traffic represented e.g. a Google web search, and then search that semantically later. Because at the time Google did not use encryption in their network links between data centers, NSA was able to siphon up a whole lot of information that way - maybe more than just interaction between users and Google services, potentially as much as interaction between internal components of Google. Anyway, Google and other companies responded by employing encryption in these links, and promoting the use of encryption across a number of other protocols. The Snowden disclosures were in my perspective a catalyst for Google's promotion of HTTPS in the Chrome browser, and TLS in Gmail, and probably Certificate Transparency. The fact that these initiatives such as encryption between data centers started after the disclosures suggests that they were a response from Google to thwart this kind of surveillance.
      - a_imho 10y ago
        Google was requested large amounts of data by the NSA since ~2007 [1]. They were might or might not ordered to keep silent about it. They only started to address it as a reaction to the Snowden revelations. Additionally, there are letters such as linked above that show they are in fact very friendly with the NSA. One can argue they were caught red handed with little to nothing like an email here and there, but circumstantial evidence shows otherwise. Personally I would go further, those multi billion dollar companies should have found a way to speak up if a contractor was able to, not just after the fact. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_%28surveillance_program%29 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_%28surveillance_program%...
- euyyn 10y ago
  Snowden revealed the opposite: https://cdn.grahamcluley.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/nsa-postit.jpeg https://cdn.grahamcluley.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/nsa-... NSA actively tries to eavesdrop on Google.
  - dx034 10y ago
    And the chips are probably the reaction to exactly that slide. Not only enabling SSL between datacentres, but verifying all code that servers run, to avoid that the NSA can download private keys from Google servers just because they handed an ESL to the datacentre operator. Of course they can still use courts to get data directly from Google, but that way they can always only target individuals or small groups, not whole nations.

by dx034 10y ago

DannyB2 10y ago

. . . how far advanced, and the lengths they would go to.

nickik 10y ago

Eric Grosse from Google says as much here, ... Edit, it seems I have copied the wrong video, please us the link in the child comment

prattmic 10y ago
This talk is also discusses the adversaries: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knR6vXba7g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knR6vXba7g

a_imho 10y ago

Which then shows that they are trying to prevent eavesdropping by NSA & Co. Why would the NSA eavesdrop on Google, they are in bed with them, aren't they?

kakarot 10y ago
Got links?
- a_imho 10y ago
  For me, the whole takeaway of the Snowden leaks was that the NSA can legally force Google (or anyone) to hand over basically anything, am I mistaken? Articles like [1] seems to underline they are indeed working together. [1] http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/06/nsa-google_n_5273437.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/06/nsa-google_n_527343...
  - kakarot 10y ago
    An abusive, rapey relationship is not the same thing as being "in bed".
    - a_imho 10y ago
      That link is anything but an abusive relationship. Still, I fail to see how silicone is a countermeasure to a court order.
      - rl3 10y ago
        When Google has its networks compromised and is routinely compelled to comply with NSLs, I'd say that counts as abusive.
  - Pyxl101 10y ago
    The Snowden disclosures did not suggest that Internet companies like Google were coordinating with NSA. The disclosures suggested that NSA was wiretapping all traffic across the Internet, and then parsing it, storing it, and indexing it so as to be able to make sense of what traffic represented e.g. a Google web search, and then search that semantically later. Because at the time Google did not use encryption in their network links between data centers, NSA was able to siphon up a whole lot of information that way - maybe more than just interaction between users and Google services, potentially as much as interaction between internal components of Google. Anyway, Google and other companies responded by employing encryption in these links, and promoting the use of encryption across a number of other protocols. The Snowden disclosures were in my perspective a catalyst for Google's promotion of HTTPS in the Chrome browser, and TLS in Gmail, and probably Certificate Transparency. The fact that these initiatives such as encryption between data centers started after the disclosures suggests that they were a response from Google to thwart this kind of surveillance.
    - a_imho 10y ago
      Google was requested large amounts of data by the NSA since ~2007 [1]. They were might or might not ordered to keep silent about it. They only started to address it as a reaction to the Snowden revelations. Additionally, there are letters such as linked above that show they are in fact very friendly with the NSA. One can argue they were caught red handed with little to nothing like an email here and there, but circumstantial evidence shows otherwise. Personally I would go further, those multi billion dollar companies should have found a way to speak up if a contractor was able to, not just after the fact. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_%28surveillance_program%29 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_%28surveillance_program%...
euyyn 10y ago
Snowden revealed the opposite: https://cdn.grahamcluley.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/nsa-postit.jpeg https://cdn.grahamcluley.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/nsa-... NSA actively tries to eavesdrop on Google.
- dx034 10y ago
  And the chips are probably the reaction to exactly that slide. Not only enabling SSL between datacentres, but verifying all code that servers run, to avoid that the NSA can download private keys from Google servers just because they handed an ESL to the datacentre operator. Of course they can still use courts to get data directly from Google, but that way they can always only target individuals or small groups, not whole nations.