4 ms·

I'm so sick of the trope of the happy sexless marriage. It's unhealthy and it's the cause of a lot of unhappy marriages and delusions out there. This article do

I'm so sick of the trope of the happy sexless marriage. It's unhealthy and it's the cause of a lot of unhappy marriages and delusions out there. This article doesn't address the trope and instead reinforces it.

skrebbel 10y ago
Sexless? How is that implied in any way by the article?
- gayprogrammer 10y ago
  She describes sex as only happening in infatuation romance. She redefines sexy to something non-sexual. She details laying in bed together and being alone together in a way that most people would call boring (playing a phone game).
  - ZenoArrow 10y ago
    Intimacy is more than just fucking.
    - pluma 10y ago
      For a good take on this, here's the Sexplanations video on "foreplay": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TGOSu9YuFc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TGOSu9YuFc TL;DW: Just like sex doesn't have to be about penetration, foreplay isn't just about touching or dirty talk.
      - ZenoArrow 10y ago
        It goes beyond foreplay (I've seen that Sexplanations video before, I like the video and I'm subscribed to the channel, it's just not what I'm talking about). Intimacy is about sensuality and closeness. Those don't have to be anything to do with sex. For example, it's possible to experience intimacy in a completely non-sexual setting, such as a honest conversation about death. Intimacy is about the feeling of closeness to someone, not about what that closeness results in.
        pluma 10y ago
        I'm not disagreeing. I just think the video hits a similar note -- namely that even foreplay (which is by definition related to sex) doesn't have to be "sexual". I think aside from skewed attitudes towards sexuality the problem with the concept of intimacy in particular is that the word is often used as a euphemism for sex -- "being intimate" usually refers to having (had) sexual intercourse.
        ZenoArrow 10y ago
        I agree, intimacy covers a broad spectrum, of which sex is just one part.
  - viraptor 10y ago
    I think it's the other way around and it's a big difference. She describes the popculture romance as hesitation and suspense over sex. She doesn't describe the sex as the reverse. And the word sexy is already popular in many non-explicitly-sexual contexts. Like "intelligence is sexy", "sexy car", "sexy clothes". I'm pretty sure I've described code solutions as sexy a number of times. But unless you're into mechaphilia sexy cars are not sexually attractive.
    - skrebbel 10y ago
      Thanks for telling me about mechaphilia. That stuff is amazing!
biocomputation 10y ago
Gay man here. In a long term relationship. Also have lots of straight friends, so I've heard about that side of things as well. I think the trope of a happy marriage requiring sex is just as harmful. The truth is that a marriage needs as much sex as it needs, no more, no less. There are people who are perfectly happy in sexless marriages, and people who are miserable in marriages where sex isn't a problem. The most important ingredients for a happy marriage are two people who are well sorted ou. Everything else is negotiable.
- dclowd9901 10y ago
  I absolutely agree with you. But it's not addressed here and simply continues the trope that all marriages become sexless, joyless slogs where we're just supposed to be happy with living. You see it everywhere, and I think it gives people the idea that there's only one kind of marriage: one where you don't have sex but you love each other all the same. I think it would have been great for her to at least talk about their sexual frequency and how agreement of frequency is important, otherwise that lack of passion undermines everything.
PaulRobinson 10y ago
The only way a sexless marriage is unhealthy is if one of the partners wants sex. If neither is interested, it's not a problem. I have known couples who need sex every day, and I've known couples who have rarely have sex. Both happy. Mixed it up and swapped them around? Deep unhappiness. Stop projecting your preferences onto every other human: the amount of sex you prefer in a relationship is unlikely to be a perfect match for everybody. You especially need to be wary that if you are inclined to have a lot of sex and your partner is not, you may unwittingly be forcing them into something they are not comfortable with, and as a result making them deeply unhappy. It's not a trope. It's just basic human understanding.
facepalm 10y ago
As you get older, sex may become less appealing, or less realistic anyway. For example, men seem to be most attracted to women in their 20ties. While I acknowledge the (evolutionary) reasons for that, I also think it sucks, sometimes to the point of disavowing sex just to spite nature. It is of course possible to pursue young women even as an older man, but there really is a tradeoff between attraction, dignity and sheer waste of effort.

skrebbel 10y ago

Sexless? How is that implied in any way by the article?

gayprogrammer 10y ago
She describes sex as only happening in infatuation romance. She redefines sexy to something non-sexual. She details laying in bed together and being alone together in a way that most people would call boring (playing a phone game).
- ZenoArrow 10y ago
  Intimacy is more than just fucking.
  - pluma 10y ago
    For a good take on this, here's the Sexplanations video on "foreplay": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TGOSu9YuFc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TGOSu9YuFc TL;DW: Just like sex doesn't have to be about penetration, foreplay isn't just about touching or dirty talk.
    - ZenoArrow 10y ago
      It goes beyond foreplay (I've seen that Sexplanations video before, I like the video and I'm subscribed to the channel, it's just not what I'm talking about). Intimacy is about sensuality and closeness. Those don't have to be anything to do with sex. For example, it's possible to experience intimacy in a completely non-sexual setting, such as a honest conversation about death. Intimacy is about the feeling of closeness to someone, not about what that closeness results in.
      - pluma 10y ago
        I'm not disagreeing. I just think the video hits a similar note -- namely that even foreplay (which is by definition related to sex) doesn't have to be "sexual". I think aside from skewed attitudes towards sexuality the problem with the concept of intimacy in particular is that the word is often used as a euphemism for sex -- "being intimate" usually refers to having (had) sexual intercourse.
        ZenoArrow 10y ago
        I agree, intimacy covers a broad spectrum, of which sex is just one part.
- viraptor 10y ago
  I think it's the other way around and it's a big difference. She describes the popculture romance as hesitation and suspense over sex. She doesn't describe the sex as the reverse. And the word sexy is already popular in many non-explicitly-sexual contexts. Like "intelligence is sexy", "sexy car", "sexy clothes". I'm pretty sure I've described code solutions as sexy a number of times. But unless you're into mechaphilia sexy cars are not sexually attractive.
  - skrebbel 10y ago
    Thanks for telling me about mechaphilia. That stuff is amazing!

biocomputation 10y ago

Gay man here. In a long term relationship. Also have lots of straight friends, so I've heard about that side of things as well. I think the trope of a happy marriage requiring sex is just as harmful. The truth is that a marriage needs as much sex as it needs, no more, no less. There are people who are perfectly happy in sexless marriages, and people who are miserable in marriages where sex isn't a problem. The most important ingredients for a happy marriage are two people who are well sorted ou. Everything else is negotiable.

dclowd9901 10y ago
I absolutely agree with you. But it's not addressed here and simply continues the trope that all marriages become sexless, joyless slogs where we're just supposed to be happy with living. You see it everywhere, and I think it gives people the idea that there's only one kind of marriage: one where you don't have sex but you love each other all the same. I think it would have been great for her to at least talk about their sexual frequency and how agreement of frequency is important, otherwise that lack of passion undermines everything.

PaulRobinson 10y ago

The only way a sexless marriage is unhealthy is if one of the partners wants sex. If neither is interested, it's not a problem. I have known couples who need sex every day, and I've known couples who have rarely have sex. Both happy. Mixed it up and swapped them around? Deep unhappiness. Stop projecting your preferences onto every other human: the amount of sex you prefer in a relationship is unlikely to be a perfect match for everybody. You especially need to be wary that if you are inclined to have a lot of sex and your partner is not, you may unwittingly be forcing them into something they are not comfortable with, and as a result making them deeply unhappy. It's not a trope. It's just basic human understanding.

facepalm 10y ago

As you get older, sex may become less appealing, or less realistic anyway. For example, men seem to be most attracted to women in their 20ties. While I acknowledge the (evolutionary) reasons for that, I also think it sucks, sometimes to the point of disavowing sex just to spite nature. It is of course possible to pursue young women even as an older man, but there really is a tradeoff between attraction, dignity and sheer waste of effort.