4 ms·

Know what would fix that? Universal, single payer health insurance.

by RyanMcGreal 17y ago

walkon 17y ago
Then move to the UK, where their debt is about to eclipse that of Greece.
- froo 17y ago
  Thats not a very constructive comment, but taking the trollbait - there are examples of other countries around the world (my own for example) that have public option health cares who's economies aren't in the tank.
  - RyanMcGreal 17y ago
    Just to clarify: all of the industrialized world (except for the US) has universal health care. As for the troll, a couple of points: 1. Britain has government-controlled health care, not just government-funded health care. In Canada, where I live, the government is the single payer but health care itself is provided by a wide variety of small and large businesses, including doctors' offices, walk-in clinics, testing labs, and so on. 2. Among industrialized countries, Britain is at the very low end of the spectrum for health care expenditures, either per capita or as a percent of GDP. Government-funded and -controlled health care in Britain has done a phenomenal job of containing costs.
  - tjmc 17y ago
    Indeed. US government debt is approaching something like 80% of GDP. Canada is ~30%. Australia is 6.1%.
- ojbyrne 17y ago
  If you actually think that the UK's financial problems have anything at all to do with NHS, well there's probably an extreme right wing party waiting for you.
- wooster 17y ago
  Greece public debt: 122.6% of GDP England public debt: 59.9% of GDP New Zealand public debt: 29.3% of GDP United States public debt: 86.3% of GDP
jquery 17y ago
So would high deductible health plans with HSAs.
- jrockway 17y ago
  The idea behind health insurance is spending other people's money. If health insurance provides no benefit over just putting money in your savings account, people will just do that instead. Then the system collapses. (Pooling the money is more beneficial than keeping it to yourself, because the insurance companies can invest it better than an individual can. Think of the interest you get on $1000 vs. what you get on $1,000,000. One buys you a cup of coffee, the other supports you for life. When the insurance companies leverage your premiums in this way, it means that the actual money the spend is nearly free. It's a pretty good deal.)
  - assemble 17y ago
    My high deductable plan doesn't cover anything until I spend $1.5k on health costs in a year. (Except preventive health stuff, that's all covered.) After you pay 1.5k they cover everything. My company and I pay a premium for this coverage (it's not nearly as high as the co-pay and HMO plans available). Really, when I got to the doctor once or twice a year, for a whopping grand total of about $70/visit, then spend MAYBE $100 on prescriptions/other medications with my prescription discount card, it's really not worth that extra $30 every two weeks. I don't want to pay for my hypochondriac neighbor's daily doctor visits, or for their kid's sniffles. The way I (and a lot of other Americans) see health insurance is that it should pay for things that would bankrupt you, I can handle the small stuff. The best part about HSAs is that they are pre-tax accounts, so they help with your income tax costs. This also has the effect of making medical things cheaper because you didn't lose 30%+ on that money before having to spend it. I'm just hoping Congress doesn't cut the usefulness of HSAs with their new health care garbage...
    - jrockway 17y ago
      It's only tax-free if your contribution is less than the standard deduction. I don't spend $7500 on healthcare per year, so I can't even deduct it. Maybe if I buy a house I can't afford, then I'll have some deductable interest to push me over... (If your employer handles the FSA/HSA, then it's pre-tax no matter what. I'm W2, but my employer simply doesn't offer that benefit because it costs them too much money.) I don't want to pay for my hypochondriac neighbor's daily doctor visits, or for their kid's sniffles. Well, that's what the co-pay is for. $20 every time you visit the doctor adds up if you visit unnecessarily -- the real cost that the doctor bills the insurance company isn't even much higher than that. Insurance companies aren't losing money on people who see the doctor every week. (Why do I like the current system? Because the premium I pay is almost exactly matched to my monthly health maintenance cost. And I have protection in the case of disaster, or generally expensive medical procedures.)

Know what would fix that? Universal, single payer health insurance.

walkon 17y ago

Then move to the UK, where their debt is about to eclipse that of Greece.

froo 17y ago
Thats not a very constructive comment, but taking the trollbait - there are examples of other countries around the world (my own for example) that have public option health cares who's economies aren't in the tank.
- RyanMcGreal 17y ago
  Just to clarify: all of the industrialized world (except for the US) has universal health care. As for the troll, a couple of points: 1. Britain has government-controlled health care, not just government-funded health care. In Canada, where I live, the government is the single payer but health care itself is provided by a wide variety of small and large businesses, including doctors' offices, walk-in clinics, testing labs, and so on. 2. Among industrialized countries, Britain is at the very low end of the spectrum for health care expenditures, either per capita or as a percent of GDP. Government-funded and -controlled health care in Britain has done a phenomenal job of containing costs.
- tjmc 17y ago
  Indeed. US government debt is approaching something like 80% of GDP. Canada is ~30%. Australia is 6.1%.
ojbyrne 17y ago
If you actually think that the UK's financial problems have anything at all to do with NHS, well there's probably an extreme right wing party waiting for you.
wooster 17y ago
Greece public debt: 122.6% of GDP England public debt: 59.9% of GDP New Zealand public debt: 29.3% of GDP United States public debt: 86.3% of GDP

jquery 17y ago

So would high deductible health plans with HSAs.

jrockway 17y ago
The idea behind health insurance is spending other people's money. If health insurance provides no benefit over just putting money in your savings account, people will just do that instead. Then the system collapses. (Pooling the money is more beneficial than keeping it to yourself, because the insurance companies can invest it better than an individual can. Think of the interest you get on $1000 vs. what you get on $1,000,000. One buys you a cup of coffee, the other supports you for life. When the insurance companies leverage your premiums in this way, it means that the actual money the spend is nearly free. It's a pretty good deal.)
- assemble 17y ago
  My high deductable plan doesn't cover anything until I spend $1.5k on health costs in a year. (Except preventive health stuff, that's all covered.) After you pay 1.5k they cover everything. My company and I pay a premium for this coverage (it's not nearly as high as the co-pay and HMO plans available). Really, when I got to the doctor once or twice a year, for a whopping grand total of about $70/visit, then spend MAYBE $100 on prescriptions/other medications with my prescription discount card, it's really not worth that extra $30 every two weeks. I don't want to pay for my hypochondriac neighbor's daily doctor visits, or for their kid's sniffles. The way I (and a lot of other Americans) see health insurance is that it should pay for things that would bankrupt you, I can handle the small stuff. The best part about HSAs is that they are pre-tax accounts, so they help with your income tax costs. This also has the effect of making medical things cheaper because you didn't lose 30%+ on that money before having to spend it. I'm just hoping Congress doesn't cut the usefulness of HSAs with their new health care garbage...
  - jrockway 17y ago
    It's only tax-free if your contribution is less than the standard deduction. I don't spend $7500 on healthcare per year, so I can't even deduct it. Maybe if I buy a house I can't afford, then I'll have some deductable interest to push me over... (If your employer handles the FSA/HSA, then it's pre-tax no matter what. I'm W2, but my employer simply doesn't offer that benefit because it costs them too much money.) I don't want to pay for my hypochondriac neighbor's daily doctor visits, or for their kid's sniffles. Well, that's what the co-pay is for. $20 every time you visit the doctor adds up if you visit unnecessarily -- the real cost that the doctor bills the insurance company isn't even much higher than that. Insurance companies aren't losing money on people who see the doctor every week. (Why do I like the current system? Because the premium I pay is almost exactly matched to my monthly health maintenance cost. And I have protection in the case of disaster, or generally expensive medical procedures.)