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The "impulse issues" are reinforced by the phone. I've very often noticed when I've set aside my phone for a few hours (the rest of the evening until bed or wha

by iak8god 10y ago

The "impulse issues" are reinforced by the phone. I've very often noticed when I've set aside my phone for a few hours (the rest of the evening until bed or whatever) that I have to literally set it aside at some distance from myself because otherwise it ends up in my hand without my even consciously deciding to check it. It's like a reflex. And then once it's safely at a distance, I repeatedly experience the urge to check it whenever I don't happen to be very focused on something else. The frequency of that urge diminishes over the course of a few hours and is accompanied by an increase in my ability to focus on something else for stretches of time. Sometimes I've even taken a weekend offline completely, and the effects are even more pronounced, and they last beyond the offline time. This is what the author means by "attention is a muscle". It's not that there's some baseline impulse issue and the device is merely an outlet. The device is causing the issue, or at least exacerbating it.

vorotato 10y ago
The device aggravates this issue only because the author is unconscious enough that they aren't even aware they are making a decision to use or not use the phone. While it may be a necessary step to take a break from something that captures your attention, it's important to be able to be aware of your behavior and your desires independent of the context. A person should be mindful when they choose to spend time on the phone of what they are deciding to consume. The phone is not a magical device, it just has a lower effort barrier and so unconscious behavior is easier. It doesn't mean one can't be aware of what they're doing while using it. It also doesn't mean that one can't use the device while developing awareness.
- iak8god 10y ago
  I think we pretty much agree here. For me the best way to remain aware is to periodically abstain, and the effects on my awareness persist after the abstinence.
  - vorotato 10y ago
    I turned of notifications of all kinds 99% of them were not worth clicking. I do periodically abstain, but I when I do use I try to stay self-aware. I mentally keep track of how long I've spent, and what I spent my time doing. I then periodically ask if I thought the previous 15 minutes was spent doing something I was interested in or if I was just on autopilot / guided by clickbait. I still use my phone a LOT, but I definitely am doing more of what I enjoy, and reading things that are more meaningful to me.
    - iak8god 10y ago
      All good tips. I've been using QualityTime (Android only, I think: http://www.qualitytimeapp.com/ http://www.qualitytimeapp.com/) to measure and track usage daily. Seeing it quantified was a bit of a shock even though I thought I was doing a good job of mentally monitoring myself.
      - kentt 10y ago
        Thanks for the recommendation. I'm going to try that out. On the Desktop I use RescueTime which has helped a bit.
- ivm 10y ago
  There are natural "goldfish" states during the day plus procrastination peaks when the current task is very unpleasant. Because of them I keep my phone in 3 meters from my workplace and leisure sites like HN - on a laptop in another room.
mkesper 10y ago
One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.
sverige 10y ago
Early next week I'm switching to a 2G feature phone with no camera. I'm sure I'll be visiting HN (and a handful of other sites) much less, I'm sure there will be some withdrawal, but I'm also sure that I won't miss anything and that I'll be much calmer and more focused. I've thought about this for a few years, really since i first got a smartphone, and I'm persuaded that they are a problem, not a solution.
- iak8god 10y ago
  I've been seriously considering this lately. The camera and a location-based game that gets me out walking around periodically throughout the day are the two things I'm not sure I can give up at this point.
  - sverige 10y ago
    There are lots of feature phones with cameras. In fact, it's hard to find phones without them. No GPS was a difficult feature to find as well, but desirable for reducing the data footprint available to third parties. I go walking without a phone now.
    - iak8god 10y ago
      > There are lots of feature phones with cameras. I'd love to find one with a decent camera. I have a fairly nice and compact point-and-shoot that I bought a couple of years ago, but it doesn't have a lot of the software-assisted processing that makes it so easy to take good pics with my (midrange) smartphone.
- SuperPaintMan 10y ago
  If you're using a iOS device, take a look at Apple Configurator. I blocked Safari and a few other time-sink apps with it and noticed a extreme reduction in habitual phone usage. It's mainly a texting/messaging device with a few critical apps (Mint, Messenger, RBC, Notes) installed. It's a happy medium between a full on feature phone. As far as calm goes, I started writing again instead of consuming HN all day. https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apple-configurator-2/id1037126344?mt=12 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apple-configurator-2/id10371...
JamilD 10y ago
As I was reading this comment, I realized that I had picked up my phone and gone on Hacker News almost subconsciously, while in a lecture at school. I don't think I'd have as strong of an outlet for constant distraction without my phone.
- iak8god 10y ago
  In a meeting today someone noted with amusement that I was both the youngest person in the room and the only one taking notes on paper instead of a laptop. This is why: I can't always trust myself to stay focused when I'm on the laptop. As soon as I'm bored or uninterested for a moment, my damned fingers will - seemingly of their own volition - flip to a browser, open a new tab, and take me to HN or worse.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

by iak8god 10y ago

vorotato 10y ago

The device aggravates this issue only because the author is unconscious enough that they aren't even aware they are making a decision to use or not use the phone. While it may be a necessary step to take a break from something that captures your attention, it's important to be able to be aware of your behavior and your desires independent of the context. A person should be mindful when they choose to spend time on the phone of what they are deciding to consume. The phone is not a magical device, it just has a lower effort barrier and so unconscious behavior is easier. It doesn't mean one can't be aware of what they're doing while using it. It also doesn't mean that one can't use the device while developing awareness.

iak8god 10y ago
I think we pretty much agree here. For me the best way to remain aware is to periodically abstain, and the effects on my awareness persist after the abstinence.
- vorotato 10y ago
  I turned of notifications of all kinds 99% of them were not worth clicking. I do periodically abstain, but I when I do use I try to stay self-aware. I mentally keep track of how long I've spent, and what I spent my time doing. I then periodically ask if I thought the previous 15 minutes was spent doing something I was interested in or if I was just on autopilot / guided by clickbait. I still use my phone a LOT, but I definitely am doing more of what I enjoy, and reading things that are more meaningful to me.
  - iak8god 10y ago
    All good tips. I've been using QualityTime (Android only, I think: http://www.qualitytimeapp.com/ http://www.qualitytimeapp.com/) to measure and track usage daily. Seeing it quantified was a bit of a shock even though I thought I was doing a good job of mentally monitoring myself.
    - kentt 10y ago
      Thanks for the recommendation. I'm going to try that out. On the Desktop I use RescueTime which has helped a bit.
ivm 10y ago
There are natural "goldfish" states during the day plus procrastination peaks when the current task is very unpleasant. Because of them I keep my phone in 3 meters from my workplace and leisure sites like HN - on a laptop in another room.

mkesper 10y ago

One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.

sverige 10y ago

Early next week I'm switching to a 2G feature phone with no camera. I'm sure I'll be visiting HN (and a handful of other sites) much less, I'm sure there will be some withdrawal, but I'm also sure that I won't miss anything and that I'll be much calmer and more focused. I've thought about this for a few years, really since i first got a smartphone, and I'm persuaded that they are a problem, not a solution.

iak8god 10y ago
I've been seriously considering this lately. The camera and a location-based game that gets me out walking around periodically throughout the day are the two things I'm not sure I can give up at this point.
- sverige 10y ago
  There are lots of feature phones with cameras. In fact, it's hard to find phones without them. No GPS was a difficult feature to find as well, but desirable for reducing the data footprint available to third parties. I go walking without a phone now.
  - iak8god 10y ago
    > There are lots of feature phones with cameras. I'd love to find one with a decent camera. I have a fairly nice and compact point-and-shoot that I bought a couple of years ago, but it doesn't have a lot of the software-assisted processing that makes it so easy to take good pics with my (midrange) smartphone.
SuperPaintMan 10y ago
If you're using a iOS device, take a look at Apple Configurator. I blocked Safari and a few other time-sink apps with it and noticed a extreme reduction in habitual phone usage. It's mainly a texting/messaging device with a few critical apps (Mint, Messenger, RBC, Notes) installed. It's a happy medium between a full on feature phone. As far as calm goes, I started writing again instead of consuming HN all day. https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apple-configurator-2/id1037126344?mt=12 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apple-configurator-2/id10371...

JamilD 10y ago

As I was reading this comment, I realized that I had picked up my phone and gone on Hacker News almost subconsciously, while in a lecture at school. I don't think I'd have as strong of an outlet for constant distraction without my phone.

iak8god 10y ago
In a meeting today someone noted with amusement that I was both the youngest person in the room and the only one taking notes on paper instead of a laptop. This is why: I can't always trust myself to stay focused when I'm on the laptop. As soon as I'm bored or uninterested for a moment, my damned fingers will - seemingly of their own volition - flip to a browser, open a new tab, and take me to HN or worse.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]