6 ms·

This made me curious about the economics for a 3D printing on demand service. Looks like there are already some players in the space making it work: http://ww

by btucker 16y ago

This made me curious about the economics for a 3D printing on demand service. Looks like there are already some players in the space making it work: http://www.shapeways.com/ http://www.shapeways.com/ http://www.buildparts.com/ http://www.buildparts.com/ http://www.zoomrp.com/ http://www.zoomrp.com/

necrecious 16y ago
They probably have a willing audience in cosplayer community. If only they also automate the painting process.
steveklabnik 16y ago
This is actually what my startup does. http://cloudfab.com/ http://cloudfab.com/ We actually offer more processes and materials than anyone else on the web.
- jonhohle 16y ago
  It's interesting to see that Cubic is still supporting Helisys LOM machines (and that your startup offers that as a service). They always produced the most interesting parts, imho (though a pain to post process). I worked at an RP consortium nearly a decade ago and always figured that the LOM they had was a relic. It appears they still have it running (http://www.rpc.msoe.edu/machines_lom.php http://www.rpc.msoe.edu/machines_lom.php).
  - steveklabnik 16y ago
    I just talked to someone from the MSOE the other day ago, I think... Yeah, those old LOM machines are crazy. The new LOM hotness is coming out of a company called MCor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vow5XvHoFZc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vow5XvHoFZc I'm going to be excited to see these machines later this year. Printing with A4 paper means the parts should be so cheap! And they say the consistency is similar to wood...
    - FlorinAndrei 16y ago
      Hmm, printing paper is not exactly super-cheap per weight unit.
      - steveklabnik 16y ago
        Yes, but weight isn't what matters, it's volume.
- Flemlord 16y ago
  I don't see prices on the web site. Would you mind giving me a rough idea of what it costs to print/create various items? (Not a serious prospect, just curious.)
  - steveklabnik 16y ago
    The reason that there aren't prices is that just like the objects, they're all custom! The cost to make something depends entirely on the exact geometry of the object, the material it's made out of, and various other bits of overhead of the shop that makes it. Sometimes, the orientation of the part in the printer can matter! Generally, on average, something that an industrial designer would be making would end up costing between $200 and $500. But again, this is incredibly price sensitive. There's also a trend lately of people making knock-off materials that cost a tenth of the 'real' ones, and some people use those... I've literally seen orders of magnitude between sellers on the same part. Some people specialize in getting stuff done really quickly, and charge a premium!
- mhb 16y ago
  Looks interesting. As a potential member of your target audience, I consider a valuable/essential addition to be tolerances and minimum wall thickness for the various processes. Phrases like "moderate surface detail" and "rough surface finish" are pretty useless. Examples of models produced in the various technologies, what they cost and their characteristics and surface finish (photos) would be very helpful. I think you need to reduce the barrier between having an stl file and knowing the cost of a part with given tolerances, strength and surface finish. Perhaps this means offering at least one higher priced, longer lead time service with a fixed cost per volume of material. Shapeways does this very well.
  - steveklabnik 16y ago
    Did you see FabFacts? ( http://cloudfab.com/fab_facts/ http://cloudfab.com/fab_facts/ ) Your first paragraph sounds like a criticism of it, but your second implies you haven't seen it. In any case, yeah. With FabFacts, we were trying to strike an appropriate balance between too much and too little information, which is why we did the summary + full data sheets. If this is a bit too lopsided from one side to another, I'd love some more detailed suggestions, but it's a _really hard_ problem. > I think you need to reduce the barrier between having an stl file and knowing the cost of a part with given tolerances, strength and surface finish. Perhaps this means offering at least one higher priced, longer lead time service with a fixed cost per volume of material. Shapeways does this very well. We're currently (mostly) serving the industrial design/engineering market, which is already reasonably knowledgeable about the field, or at least parts of it. It's easier to start with an informed userbase, you know? But decreasing the expertise necessary is certainly in our plans, and where we want to go... but with only two people, you have to prioritize your time. Most of our current customers want _more_ options, not less.
    - mhb 16y ago
      You're right. I did see FabFacts, but did not see the "More details & datasheets" link within it. Thanks.
copperred 16y ago
Another http://www.redeyeondemand.com/ http://www.redeyeondemand.com/
hop 16y ago
Zoom RP is amazing. We upload and order parts by noon, they are delivered by Fedex at 10am the next day in Portland. And their Polyjet printers make the best quality small parts. Can't wait though until these printers get sub $5000 and it makes sense for every designer to have one next to their desk though. HP is getting into the mix, so prices will surely be driven down. http://develop3d.com/blog/2010/04/the-new-hp-designjet-3d-printing-solution-enables-design-professionals-to-a http://develop3d.com/blog/2010/04/the-new-hp-designjet-3d-pr...
merchantly 16y ago
How much does it cost to print something like a cup?
- steveklabnik 16y ago
  It's entirely dependent on the exact process and material. Cups are also a bad example, due to their geometry. You'd probably be looking at roughly $50-75ish+, if I had to guess.
- mhb 16y ago
  You can see the prices here: http://www.shapeways.com/gallery http://www.shapeways.com/gallery

by btucker 16y ago

necrecious 16y ago

They probably have a willing audience in cosplayer community. If only they also automate the painting process.

steveklabnik 16y ago

This is actually what my startup does. http://cloudfab.com/ http://cloudfab.com/ We actually offer more processes and materials than anyone else on the web.

jonhohle 16y ago
It's interesting to see that Cubic is still supporting Helisys LOM machines (and that your startup offers that as a service). They always produced the most interesting parts, imho (though a pain to post process). I worked at an RP consortium nearly a decade ago and always figured that the LOM they had was a relic. It appears they still have it running (http://www.rpc.msoe.edu/machines_lom.php http://www.rpc.msoe.edu/machines_lom.php).
- steveklabnik 16y ago
  I just talked to someone from the MSOE the other day ago, I think... Yeah, those old LOM machines are crazy. The new LOM hotness is coming out of a company called MCor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vow5XvHoFZc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vow5XvHoFZc I'm going to be excited to see these machines later this year. Printing with A4 paper means the parts should be so cheap! And they say the consistency is similar to wood...
  - FlorinAndrei 16y ago
    Hmm, printing paper is not exactly super-cheap per weight unit.
    - steveklabnik 16y ago
      Yes, but weight isn't what matters, it's volume.
Flemlord 16y ago
I don't see prices on the web site. Would you mind giving me a rough idea of what it costs to print/create various items? (Not a serious prospect, just curious.)
- steveklabnik 16y ago
  The reason that there aren't prices is that just like the objects, they're all custom! The cost to make something depends entirely on the exact geometry of the object, the material it's made out of, and various other bits of overhead of the shop that makes it. Sometimes, the orientation of the part in the printer can matter! Generally, on average, something that an industrial designer would be making would end up costing between $200 and $500. But again, this is incredibly price sensitive. There's also a trend lately of people making knock-off materials that cost a tenth of the 'real' ones, and some people use those... I've literally seen orders of magnitude between sellers on the same part. Some people specialize in getting stuff done really quickly, and charge a premium!
mhb 16y ago
Looks interesting. As a potential member of your target audience, I consider a valuable/essential addition to be tolerances and minimum wall thickness for the various processes. Phrases like "moderate surface detail" and "rough surface finish" are pretty useless. Examples of models produced in the various technologies, what they cost and their characteristics and surface finish (photos) would be very helpful. I think you need to reduce the barrier between having an stl file and knowing the cost of a part with given tolerances, strength and surface finish. Perhaps this means offering at least one higher priced, longer lead time service with a fixed cost per volume of material. Shapeways does this very well.
- steveklabnik 16y ago
  Did you see FabFacts? ( http://cloudfab.com/fab_facts/ http://cloudfab.com/fab_facts/ ) Your first paragraph sounds like a criticism of it, but your second implies you haven't seen it. In any case, yeah. With FabFacts, we were trying to strike an appropriate balance between too much and too little information, which is why we did the summary + full data sheets. If this is a bit too lopsided from one side to another, I'd love some more detailed suggestions, but it's a _really hard_ problem. > I think you need to reduce the barrier between having an stl file and knowing the cost of a part with given tolerances, strength and surface finish. Perhaps this means offering at least one higher priced, longer lead time service with a fixed cost per volume of material. Shapeways does this very well. We're currently (mostly) serving the industrial design/engineering market, which is already reasonably knowledgeable about the field, or at least parts of it. It's easier to start with an informed userbase, you know? But decreasing the expertise necessary is certainly in our plans, and where we want to go... but with only two people, you have to prioritize your time. Most of our current customers want _more_ options, not less.
  - mhb 16y ago
    You're right. I did see FabFacts, but did not see the "More details & datasheets" link within it. Thanks.

copperred 16y ago

Another http://www.redeyeondemand.com/ http://www.redeyeondemand.com/

hop 16y ago

Zoom RP is amazing. We upload and order parts by noon, they are delivered by Fedex at 10am the next day in Portland. And their Polyjet printers make the best quality small parts. Can't wait though until these printers get sub $5000 and it makes sense for every designer to have one next to their desk though. HP is getting into the mix, so prices will surely be driven down. http://develop3d.com/blog/2010/04/the-new-hp-designjet-3d-printing-solution-enables-design-professionals-to-a http://develop3d.com/blog/2010/04/the-new-hp-designjet-3d-pr...

merchantly 16y ago

How much does it cost to print something like a cup?

steveklabnik 16y ago
It's entirely dependent on the exact process and material. Cups are also a bad example, due to their geometry. You'd probably be looking at roughly $50-75ish+, if I had to guess.
mhb 16y ago
You can see the prices here: http://www.shapeways.com/gallery http://www.shapeways.com/gallery