7 ms·

On one talks about the actual issue with the H1B. I'm a H1B holder from India, living and working in USA for past 10 years. The actual incentive for companies

• suryacom 10y ago
  If TCS/Infosys brings in H1B folks to replace American workers; and those H1B folks leave TCS/Infosys the next day; then that business model will not work to begin with.
  • DashRattlesnake 10y ago
    Personally, I'd have no problem with that.
  • deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
• tn13 10y ago
  > Any time I change my job, green card process has to be restarted from square one..more cash to attorneys. That is not true. Visa can be transferred in mere 15 days. Why dont you change jobs?
  • suryacom 10y ago
    Visa can be transferred. But, Green Card process has to be restarted from the square one; that is +10k for attorney.
    • usernametbd 10y ago
      > Green Card process has to be restarted from the square one That's not fully true AFAIK. The green card (GC) is a 3-step process - PERM, I-140 and GC itself. If you already have your I-140, unless your previous employer cancels your I-140 (which cost them a few thousand dollars), your new employer can just start over the third step of the process. This is not optimal, sure, but it is not square one either.
      • suryacom 10y ago
        That is not correct. The second employer has to do all three: PERM, I-140 and GC.
      • woodrow 10y ago
        If you have an approved I-140 and your I-485 has been filed and pending for more than 180 days (or if you filed I-140 and I-485 concurrently and both have been pending for more than 180 days), you may switch to a same or similar job under the AC21 portability rule. Also, starting 17 January 2017, employer withdrawal of an I-140 pending for more than 180 days will no longer cancel the petition. So if you can get as far as the I-140/I-485 filing, you should be good to go, though IANAL (and you should retain your own to guide you through this process).
    • arjie 10y ago
      Yeah, but it's not like the employee is paying for the green card. I have loads of friends on H-1Bs (I'm on one as well) and no one I know has paid for the green card application. That's on the employer and they know what they're getting into when they hire a foreigner.
• Nrsolis 10y ago
  This is something that I've long suspected was going on with the H1B system. In essence, we have a limited "guest worker" program that allocates most of the economic benefits to the company (in terms of a compliant workforce that has little incentive or ability to take their skills to a competing company that might offer a better salary or career options) while allocating most of the costs to the actual H1B workers AND the US Citizens and permanent residents who have to compete with a pool of workers that will accept lower pay with little in the way of bargaining power. Great deal for companies. Terrible deal for individual workers (on both sides). I can sympathize with a company having trouble hiring talent. There is an acute shortage of capable, knowledgeable workers trained in the skills that industry needs. I just happen to think that the H1B program is a poor solution to it. The better option would be for us to offer a form of permanent legal residency to workers who have critical skills that make them attractive to industry. Once they are here, permanent residency along with all of the benefits that entails (freedom to travel, freedom to change jobs) should be part of the package. I know we do something like this using a scoring system but frankly I think it's administered very poorly based on what I've heard from others. We can do better. I don't like the idea of a permanent underclass with fewer rights than others. We should encourage emigration and settlement from cultures that integrate well with ours and have the best possible chance of success in our social and economic systems. Too little is written about the cadre of interests that benefit from illegal immigration of low-status individuals. It may seem cruel, but we do nobody a favor by allowing illegal immigrants to hide in the shadows and subject themselves to abuse at the hands of those that would profit from their lack of power or ability to go to the government for help.
  • davidw 10y ago
    > allocating most of the costs to the actual H1B workers If it were not a good option for them, they wouldn't sign up for it, so it has more benefits than costs for them. In terms of competition.... IT is a very globalized industry already. > permanent legal residency to workers who have critical skills that make them attractive to industry. Once they are here, permanent residency along with all of the benefits that entails (freedom to travel, freedom to change jobs) Yes!
    • 10y ago
• 79d697i6fdif 10y ago
  The root of the problem with H1B is that despite a bunch of laws meant to make sure that these workers are paid and treated the same as US citizens, that isn't happening at a lot of companies. This is creating a huge demand for visa workers as a kind of indentured servitude. This isn't a good situation for US citizens or visa workers. If the laws are fixed by, for instance, making it far easier to switch jobs on a visa, H1B workers will be treated a lot better. Demand for visa workers will probably drop somewhat but it will be more in line with what the visa program was made for: to hire talent not slaves.
  • hibikir 10y ago
    It's not that hard to switch jobs once you have an H1B: The hard part is to do so while trying to get a green card. Ultimately, the tremendous wait times for everyone in the 00s, and now the tremendous lines only for a few countries, come down to the maximum number of green card numbers being vastly inferior to the number of people that qualify for said visas and are already living and working in the US. Even in cases where your employer isn't trying to actively exploit you, the difficulty at changing jobs during the green card process depresses wages. I come from Europe, but I came in as an EB3 in 2000, so I had to wait a good 7 years. I was the highest paid engineer in our small department, and the only foreigner, but I was worth a lot more in the open market than what my employer paid. My salary tripled in the next three years afterwards, as I was paid an entry level salary while being qualified for being a principal engineer at a far bigger shop. But everyone talks about the H1B program, instead of just opening permanent residency to people that are, in practice, already permanent residents, just with less rights.
    • hatred 10y ago
      Curious, why can't you change jobs during the GC process while waiting for your priority date to become current? I thought it was easily do-able? Most companies already pay for the attorney expensed once you change employers i.e., PERM, I140 etc.
    • Synroc 10y ago
      As a fellow European I'm curious, why did you have to wait 7 years? Isn't the quota almost never hit for European countries?
• diogenescynic 10y ago
  >Immigration Attorneys are making a fortune of this broken system Those same law firms hire lobbyists to make sure the system remains complicated and inefficient. Also, all the law firms that service tech companies have almost 100% of the work done by recent college grads for very low pay. Ever wondered why your L-1/H-1/I-140 support letter has so many errors? It's because it was a generic template that some recent college grad spent an hour on and you paid $3000 for an attorney to sign the G-28 form. Oh, and many immigration lawyers haven't even passed the Bar exam for the state they practice in--they can practice having passed the Bar in any state. These are the bottom of the barrel law jobs, IMHO.
  • baloneyman 10y ago
    I guess it depends on your perspective. Is it the older workers who rake in enormous paychecks for incrementally far less work or is it younger workers who work for much less to make a name for themselves and establish their career?
  • yellow_viper 10y ago
    Green cards too. My family moved out of America a few months after my dads work had secured us greecards at a total of $350,000 (iirc - for the family of 7). These were voided as we didn't stay in the country long enough to validate them - what a waste.
    • winter_blue 10y ago
      How did it cost $350,000? That's an insane number.
      • yellow_viper 10y ago
        Not sure this was over 10 years ago. A quick search shows that you used to be able to get a greencard through an 'investment' of $50k to the US. It's now risen to $1m but that may very well be how they secured them.
    • ActsJuvenile 10y ago
• ashwinaj 10y ago
  > they cannot change job Correction: You can change jobs, but the green card process needs to start again but you keep your priority date. EDIT: You can change jobs to another "similar" position i.e. the job responsibilities should be similar. You can't move from an individual contributer to a manager position for example. In this case, the green card application will have to be done again. > That gives the employers full control of the employee Only if you let them. You are free to leave to another job, but many are risk averse. The employers expolit this; personally I am a risk taker so I don't see this as a hindrance. > So, hundreds of thousands highs killed immigrants Calling each and everyone highly skilled is questionable. A lot of H1B employees (and local employees for that matter) do not do highly skilled work, relatively speaking. I know this is controversial statement, but please be honest and avoid hyperbole.
  • suryacom 10y ago
    What you mean by you are a risk taker? You have no idea what you are comparing here. Will you risk your family getting deported due to a clerical error? Once H1B lose his job, he and his family has to leave the country in 15 days. Sell his house, pull kids out from school, etc. All this arises whenever H1B tries to change the job.
    • ashwinaj 10y ago
      About the risk taking, I spoke for myself and not for anyone else. Life is not a bed of roses, I've accepted that. When I got my H1B visa, I was aware of all the risks it involves. I've said this in previous posts as well, nobody forces you to take an H1B, you chose to take it. It's like buying an expensive car and complaining that you have to fill premium gas. Well, no one asked you to buy one, did they? Secondly, you are asserting that clerical errors are commonplace, where is the data for this? Anecdotal data doesn't count, since I don't know of anyone who was denied an H1B due to a clerical error. You might claim that you know a bunch who lost their visa. This discussion then degrades to a moot point without actual data.
      • Manishearth 10y ago
• findjashua 10y ago
  "Any time I change my job, green card process has to be restarted from square one" The most time-consuming part of the process is waiting for your priority date to be current. Once you have your priority date, restarting the process through another company shouldn't really make a difference, since you can just reuse the existing priority date instead of getting a new one. Theoretically, you can lose your priority date if the previous company cancels your I140. But since it costs thousands of dollars to do that, most companies don't bother.
• joering2 10y ago
  Oh, and while you're on it.. don't lose that Green Card! It costs about $27 in Cali to get a dup of your lost DL [1]; while your Green Card replacement costs... $450! [2] [1] http://www.dmv.org/ca-california/replace-license.php http://www.dmv.org/ca-california/replace-license.php [2] https://www.bridge.us/articles/misplace-green-card/ https://www.bridge.us/articles/misplace-green-card/ Its very obvious USCIS prays on the fact that most immigrants do not make enough money to actually hire (expensive) lawyer and take them to the court and fight this outrageous fee down to something reasonable. Obviously US citizens have no standing in such lawsuit cause one thing USC can never get is a Green Card :)
  • ojbyrne 10y ago
    I'd say lots of immigrants have the money. What they don't have is a vote.
  • melvinmt 10y ago
    > take them to the court On the base of what, though? It's well known that the USCIS is mostly self sustained (e.g. minimal government funding) so that money has to come from somewhere. I believe the thought is that getting a visa/permanent residency is considered a privilege, not a right.
    • joering2 10y ago
      > On the base of what, though? If they were only the first to be taken to the court for outrages fees. > It's well known that the USCIS is mostly self sustained They are part of DHS; therefore founded through DHS that is government founded. > I believe the thought is that getting a visa/permanent residency is considered a privilege, not a right. What does this have to do with losing or getting your GC stolen? As long as they can prove it costs around $450 to product a piece of plastic, they are fine in my book.
  • smm2000 10y ago
    If you are poor, you can ask USCIS to waive the replacement fee - agency is actually quite accommodating. Obviously it won't work for 99.99% software engineer who actually has money to pay. Also suing for $450 is ridiculous whether you have money or not. It is a cost of average traffic ticket and most people just pay it without involving any lawyer.
• aianus 10y ago
  > Any guess why companies only recruit from India and China? There are loads of Canadians [0] on TNs and H1Bs in the US and most don't particularly care about ever getting a green card. How do you explain their presence if you believe companies only recruit foreigners from poor countries in order to exploit their desire for US residency? [0] https://techvibes.com/2012/02/24/there-are-350000-canadians-living-and-working-silicon-valley-right-now-2012-02-24 https://techvibes.com/2012/02/24/there-are-350000-canadians-...
  • suryacom 10y ago
    You missed my point. It is not about poor countries. Indian's and Chinese will not have job mobility for decades. That is the reason, last year, 80%+ of H1B visas went to Indian/Chinese nationals.
    • aianus 10y ago
      I didn't miss your point, I just don't agree with it. I suspect 80%+ of H1B visas go to Indian/Chinese nationals simply because they represent a similarly large proportion of STEM graduates interested in emigrating from their home countries.
  • arcseco 10y ago
    TN visa restrictions are much less onerous to an employer and employee than an H1B. Similar culture and less restrictive language barriers are also benefits that might lead an employer to hire a Canadian. I would suggest that the first point is the likely culprit for the number of Canadians employed in the US.
  • yardie 10y ago
    If you're Canadian why are you getting a H1B? Get a TN. It's simpler, faster, and way less onerous than a H1B.
    • serge2k 10y ago
      It's not dual intent for one thing. I have a TN but my company put in for H-1B for me so that I could switch and then have the option to get sponsored more easily if I decide I want a green card. TN you can do it, but it's messier.
• mavelikara 10y ago
  https://fromthelandofgandhifilm.com/ https://fromthelandofgandhifilm.com/ is a great documentary about the hardships faced by people on H-1B from India or China waiting for their Green Cards.
• saiya-jin 10y ago
  A bit different topic - for somebody who spent last 10 years in US, your English is pretty bad. If staying in US is such a high priority to you, I suggest working on that part
• eli_gottlieb 10y ago
  >[Edit]: In my opinion, a possible fix shall be to give H1B holder job mobility. I.e., if TCS/Infosys brings in H1B holders to replace American workers; and those H1B holders leave TCS/Infosys the next day; then that business model will not work to begin with. That, and to switch to a simple points system like most other Anglo countries use. If you have enough points, your residency clock starts ticking as soon as you start working and living in the USA, and doesn't reset or stop unless you commit a serious crime. If the clock counts all the way down, bam, Green Card.