9 ms·

BitBucket is owned by Atlassian and a competitor (the biggest?) to Github in the enterprise.

by mcintyre1994 10y ago

lukasm 10y ago
and Github Project is a very basic Trello clone.
- beat 10y ago
  Github Project is to Trello as Bitbucket is to Github. Guess which two products I use every day, and which two I avoid like the plague.
  - lukasm 10y ago
    Trello, Bitbucket and Github are mature products. Github Projects is MVP.
zuck9 10y ago
Imo, GitLab is a more worthy competitor than BitBucket.
- akjainaj 10y ago
  I agree with you, to me it looks like BitBucket hasn't evolved at all in five years. The only change worth mentioning is that they made me transition to an "Atlassian account", which was as annoying as when Flickr made me create a Yahoo account.
  - pretzel 10y ago
    There are a few new features over the last 5 years... * Merge checks * Build status (finally...) * Audit logs * Inline editing From: https://bitbucket.org/whats-new https://bitbucket.org/whats-new Nothing that keeps it above Github, but they always seem to maintain feature parity. /not a bitbucket shill //just don't like inaccurate comments.
    - akjainaj 10y ago
      It's okay. It's just that I tried to use it a few months ago and saw they still don't even have syntax highlighting for diffs. It's pretty depressing and it makes it look like they have abandoned the service.
      - WayneBro 10y ago
        I've been using BitBucket for years and the lack of syntax highlighting for diffs has never even occurred to me. Why would you want to use such a limited diff tool at all? Personally, I use the best diff tool that I can find and so far that's BeyondCompare from Scooter Software.
        marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        it becomes more important when you use this for code-review. Then reach diffs makes more sense. Once you start using them you don't want to go back :)
        WayneBro 10y ago
        I do use diffs for code review. I simply use a much, much better native tool instead of a crappy web tool.
        marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        we need to make the web ones get the same experience level then. It's great to have it all there. Were you leave your inline notes, there's a live communication part, all feedback from automated code checkers etc.
        akjainaj 10y ago
        I'm sure guys who have paid for the enterprise version of BitBucket would rather not have to pay $60 for every developer for BeyondCompare on top of what they pay for BitBucket
  - rplnt 10y ago
    I very much doubt big enterprise clients use the services at bitbucket.com. Standalone is where it is at, and BitBucket (previously Stash) is a worthy competitor to GitLab (which was pain to setup just few years back). Big companies usually don't move at the speed of javascript frameworks.
    - cheerioty 10y ago
      "Big companies usually don't move at the speed of javascript frameworks" Well ;) https://twitter.com/sreuter/status/818614016801009664 https://twitter.com/sreuter/status/818614016801009664 ... Disclaimer: I work at Atlassian.
      - cookiecaper 10y ago
        Hate to be a crotchety old man, but seeing people recruit heavily for JS just makes me like the company less. Really sick of seeing the increasingly-silly bandwagon jumping that goes on in the tech community.
  - solatic 10y ago
    If you're only comparing Bitbucket by itself to Gitlab then you'd be correct. If you do a fair comparison and compare the entire Atlassian suite to Gitlab, then you see that the Atlassian suite is far more powerful for most enterprise use cases, which typically involve highly customized workflows and reporting in Jira. The integrations with Jira, making it incredibly easy for higher ups to follow overall progress on software projects that are tied to complicated business processes with long lifecycles, to help understand where the enterprise is in its lifecycle on any given issue and reprioritize resources to prioritized tasks as needed. Nobody has an issue tracker that really competes with Jira in this space, least of all Gitlab.
    - sytse 10y ago
      What workflow or reporting would we need to add first to GitLab in your opinion?
      - solatic 10y ago
        I remember being in a pitch meeting with an engineer who sells to various other enterprises and he said that what's changed for traditional enterprises over the last few years is that, no matter what their industry, they've all kind of woken up and realized that they're software companies too. A large enterprise that's fully exploiting Jira will set it up for non-developers, indeed they'll set up Jira primarily for their non-developers. HR will have an HR project with the following issue types: New Hires, Employee Disputes, etc., each with workflows with statuses like resume received, contacted to set up a first interview, first interview set up, offer extended... etc. And then you can use all of Jira's existing reporting schemes to help management figure out, if I need to hire someone new for some type of position, how long does that take? Are there differences between different positions? How long does each stage in the process take? Why? Does the aggregate data show some kind of bias - gender or otherwise? How do I make this faster? And so on. The kinds of questions that you can ask when you're an enterprise with established process and not a start-up with the entire company fit into one room. Internally, even within our engineering division, we've been using issue linking to other projects to get better visibility into why various work items get stuck. If I'm dependent on some internal service for my work item, and that service becomes unavailable for some period of time, I can grab the Jira support issue tracking the unavailability, mark my work item as blocked by that issue, and then that's visible all the way up the enterprise hierarchy. Similarly, I don't have to ask the people responsible whether they've fixed their system yet, my own item updates automatically to show that my item isn't blocked anymore, and I can go back to work. The main difference between Jira and Gitlab is that Jira is a workflow management tool and Gitlab is a software management tool. Gitlab looks fantastic if I want to start a new software company and have everything be right there in one window for me. But if you put all the software parts in front of all your non-software teams, they'll balk. It's just not relevant to them. Microsoft has a tool much like Gitlab called TFS, which has been around for far longer than Gitlab has. TFS is also designed to have this one-stop-shop UI, and TFS also never became an enterprise workflow management tool, even though it too has issues and workflows and customizations up the wazoo. It's a product that's targeted to software developers and it knows it, and that's why hardly any large enterprises actually use it unless they have old .NET projects that have been on TFS forever. This is the benefit of Atlassian's multiple-product model. Jira is management-first. Bitbucket is software-first. Confluence is customer-first. In an all-in-one UI, you have to pick who's first. The real problem Gitlab faces is how to retain software projects in growing companies once those companies expand and become large enterprises, and need to start to track more generalized workflows. Because if you had to ask what's most important in the Gitlab UI, workflow and reporting is definitely not it.
- iamwil 10y ago
  Genuinely curious why you think it's true. Can you elaborate?
  - zuck9 10y ago
    I don't use it much, or rather at all so I don't have much to say. GitLab has a more appealing UI than BitBucket (likely more features too), they have a great team who hang out here on HN and respond to feedback very quickly, they are actually focused on just GitLab while Atlassian has a lot of projects to work on, and their rate of development is much faster.
    - iamwil 10y ago
      Oh, I meant between Gitlab and Github. I imagine it's for similar reasons?

BitBucket is owned by Atlassian and a competitor (the biggest?) to Github in the enterprise.

lukasm 10y ago

and Github Project is a very basic Trello clone.

beat 10y ago
Github Project is to Trello as Bitbucket is to Github. Guess which two products I use every day, and which two I avoid like the plague.
- lukasm 10y ago
  Trello, Bitbucket and Github are mature products. Github Projects is MVP.

zuck9 10y ago

Imo, GitLab is a more worthy competitor than BitBucket.

akjainaj 10y ago
I agree with you, to me it looks like BitBucket hasn't evolved at all in five years. The only change worth mentioning is that they made me transition to an "Atlassian account", which was as annoying as when Flickr made me create a Yahoo account.
- pretzel 10y ago
  There are a few new features over the last 5 years... * Merge checks * Build status (finally...) * Audit logs * Inline editing From: https://bitbucket.org/whats-new https://bitbucket.org/whats-new Nothing that keeps it above Github, but they always seem to maintain feature parity. /not a bitbucket shill //just don't like inaccurate comments.
  - akjainaj 10y ago
    It's okay. It's just that I tried to use it a few months ago and saw they still don't even have syntax highlighting for diffs. It's pretty depressing and it makes it look like they have abandoned the service.
    - WayneBro 10y ago
      I've been using BitBucket for years and the lack of syntax highlighting for diffs has never even occurred to me. Why would you want to use such a limited diff tool at all? Personally, I use the best diff tool that I can find and so far that's BeyondCompare from Scooter Software.
      - marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        it becomes more important when you use this for code-review. Then reach diffs makes more sense. Once you start using them you don't want to go back :)
        WayneBro 10y ago
        I do use diffs for code review. I simply use a much, much better native tool instead of a crappy web tool.
        marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        we need to make the web ones get the same experience level then. It's great to have it all there. Were you leave your inline notes, there's a live communication part, all feedback from automated code checkers etc.
        akjainaj 10y ago
        I'm sure guys who have paid for the enterprise version of BitBucket would rather not have to pay $60 for every developer for BeyondCompare on top of what they pay for BitBucket
- rplnt 10y ago
  I very much doubt big enterprise clients use the services at bitbucket.com. Standalone is where it is at, and BitBucket (previously Stash) is a worthy competitor to GitLab (which was pain to setup just few years back). Big companies usually don't move at the speed of javascript frameworks.
  - cheerioty 10y ago
    "Big companies usually don't move at the speed of javascript frameworks" Well ;) https://twitter.com/sreuter/status/818614016801009664 https://twitter.com/sreuter/status/818614016801009664 ... Disclaimer: I work at Atlassian.
    - cookiecaper 10y ago
      Hate to be a crotchety old man, but seeing people recruit heavily for JS just makes me like the company less. Really sick of seeing the increasingly-silly bandwagon jumping that goes on in the tech community.
- solatic 10y ago
  If you're only comparing Bitbucket by itself to Gitlab then you'd be correct. If you do a fair comparison and compare the entire Atlassian suite to Gitlab, then you see that the Atlassian suite is far more powerful for most enterprise use cases, which typically involve highly customized workflows and reporting in Jira. The integrations with Jira, making it incredibly easy for higher ups to follow overall progress on software projects that are tied to complicated business processes with long lifecycles, to help understand where the enterprise is in its lifecycle on any given issue and reprioritize resources to prioritized tasks as needed. Nobody has an issue tracker that really competes with Jira in this space, least of all Gitlab.
  - sytse 10y ago
    What workflow or reporting would we need to add first to GitLab in your opinion?
    - solatic 10y ago
      I remember being in a pitch meeting with an engineer who sells to various other enterprises and he said that what's changed for traditional enterprises over the last few years is that, no matter what their industry, they've all kind of woken up and realized that they're software companies too. A large enterprise that's fully exploiting Jira will set it up for non-developers, indeed they'll set up Jira primarily for their non-developers. HR will have an HR project with the following issue types: New Hires, Employee Disputes, etc., each with workflows with statuses like resume received, contacted to set up a first interview, first interview set up, offer extended... etc. And then you can use all of Jira's existing reporting schemes to help management figure out, if I need to hire someone new for some type of position, how long does that take? Are there differences between different positions? How long does each stage in the process take? Why? Does the aggregate data show some kind of bias - gender or otherwise? How do I make this faster? And so on. The kinds of questions that you can ask when you're an enterprise with established process and not a start-up with the entire company fit into one room. Internally, even within our engineering division, we've been using issue linking to other projects to get better visibility into why various work items get stuck. If I'm dependent on some internal service for my work item, and that service becomes unavailable for some period of time, I can grab the Jira support issue tracking the unavailability, mark my work item as blocked by that issue, and then that's visible all the way up the enterprise hierarchy. Similarly, I don't have to ask the people responsible whether they've fixed their system yet, my own item updates automatically to show that my item isn't blocked anymore, and I can go back to work. The main difference between Jira and Gitlab is that Jira is a workflow management tool and Gitlab is a software management tool. Gitlab looks fantastic if I want to start a new software company and have everything be right there in one window for me. But if you put all the software parts in front of all your non-software teams, they'll balk. It's just not relevant to them. Microsoft has a tool much like Gitlab called TFS, which has been around for far longer than Gitlab has. TFS is also designed to have this one-stop-shop UI, and TFS also never became an enterprise workflow management tool, even though it too has issues and workflows and customizations up the wazoo. It's a product that's targeted to software developers and it knows it, and that's why hardly any large enterprises actually use it unless they have old .NET projects that have been on TFS forever. This is the benefit of Atlassian's multiple-product model. Jira is management-first. Bitbucket is software-first. Confluence is customer-first. In an all-in-one UI, you have to pick who's first. The real problem Gitlab faces is how to retain software projects in growing companies once those companies expand and become large enterprises, and need to start to track more generalized workflows. Because if you had to ask what's most important in the Gitlab UI, workflow and reporting is definitely not it.
iamwil 10y ago
Genuinely curious why you think it's true. Can you elaborate?
- zuck9 10y ago
  I don't use it much, or rather at all so I don't have much to say. GitLab has a more appealing UI than BitBucket (likely more features too), they have a great team who hang out here on HN and respond to feedback very quickly, they are actually focused on just GitLab while Atlassian has a lot of projects to work on, and their rate of development is much faster.
  - iamwil 10y ago
    Oh, I meant between Gitlab and Github. I imagine it's for similar reasons?