4 ms·

I like it! I've seen just about every terminal implement its own version of tiling, and I just have to ask: Why? Doesn't this just increase the line count and

by TkTech 10y ago

I like it! I've seen just about every terminal implement its own version of tiling, and I just have to ask: Why? Doesn't this just increase the line count and surface area without offering anything that doesn't already work just fine as a tool maintained by someone else?

simcop2387 10y ago
I'm not sure if Kitty does this but with Konsole in KDE it enables a number of features that I've found useful in the past. With Konsole's split view I can have a different terminal setup in each view, i.e. different fonts, font sizes, color scheme, scrollback settings, etc. I've found that to be very useful at times where I've got a bunch of different things being tailed and some are either longer than others or more important and i want them to be up in my face when something goes badly.
- TkTech 10y ago
  Ah interesting, different fonts is something I didn't consider and something that could likely only be done by the terminal itself!
  - simcop2387 10y ago
    Yea it's not something I do commonly but sometimes my coding/terminal font of choice (FiraCode) just doesn't work if I'm say looking at a database dump or some other output and I've got to switch it.
wodenokoto 10y ago
that is kinda funny. The main complaint of the other OpenGL terminal on the frontpage right now is that it doesn't have support for things like tiling or tabs, arguing that it is because terminals don't have nice interface support that we have to use hacks such as multiplexers.
- vortico 10y ago
  This issue actually divides the terminal userbase. There are the ones with tabs like Gnome Terminal, and the ones that don't manage screens like Termite, st, xterm, and urxvt.
  - blux 10y ago
    urxvt supports tabs as well.
    - mos_basik 10y ago
      ...what? I guess I've not dug into the config options enough then. I use the i3 tiling window manager with some tweaks to add uniform gaps between windows and remove their borders/title bars - at first thought, I can't think where/how urxvt would put tabs and make them look good.
      - blux 10y ago
        See for example: https://awhan.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/urxvt-tabbed/ https://awhan.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/urxvt-tabbed/ Configuration is done through ~/.Xdefaults.
  - Fnoord 10y ago
    ..and all of them run Tmux/Screen.
gravypod 10y ago
Tiling is very useful for many workloads on one monitor (in a laptop enviroment). Need to run some long running process that needs intervention + do some editing + connect to IRC all in a 12" laptop formfactor? Well tiling is what you need.
- vortico 10y ago
  He's saying there are other better tools for the purpose. You can use a tiling window manager like i3 or dwm, or a manager within the shell like screen or tmux.
  - gravypod 10y ago
    I think of my computer as two half's of the same coin. One I don't need to think about and use my mouse to click though. The other is the one that needs to be respectful interacted with using my dark incantations of Alt/Cntrl + keys to summon features. I don't want these realms mixing. That's just my opinion but it's probably mirrored.
aumerle 10y ago
For me (I am the author of kitty) it is for two reasons: 1) Multiplexers are a hack -- there are various problems with them, such as passing control codes through safely, keyboard shortcuts, performance, etc 2) Tiling WMs -- these can work (in fact I use a tiling WM myself) however, the nice thing about having tiling (and tab management) built into the terminal is that you can manage terminal windows and other windows differently on the same screen. For example, on small screens I like to have most GUI windows such s browser, etc. maximized, but I like to have terminal windows side-by-side, this is hard to manage if you want to have them on the same screen. With tiling built into the terminal, managing terminal windows is in a separate "namespace" from all other types of windows
- hobarrera 10y ago
  You opinion tiling WMs makes me thing you haven't tried something dead-simple like i3wm. What you describe is a non-issue for us i3 users.
  - aumerle 10y ago
    Really? Tell me how you would do the following with i3 or whatever tiling WM floats your boat. Have four terminal windows arranged in a grid, run a random gui program by typing the name of the program in one of those terminals and have the program open maximized. Close the program by using a quit command inside the program and have the terminals laid out in the grid again. And all this without having to use any window management/layout commands, keyboard shortcuts, mouse gestures.
    - hobarrera 10y ago
      > And all this without having to use any window management/layout commands, keyboard shortcuts, mouse gestures. I need to interact with my computer for it to do stuff, I think you somehow exagerated here. Exluding that incoherent requirement, I'd have two choices: 1. Run the command in a terminal and hit super+f 2. Run the command in a terminal, super+right, super+w (I can switch back and for to <-> from the terminal). Bonus point of using i3 is that I can optionally have any external program become part of my grid or add/remove exiting terminals to/from different mixed layouts (or workspaces). With multiplexers you're screwed and can't do that. Note: I do use tmux on all my sessions, but it's mostly for "tab" support, or attaching/detaching (even from different workstations).

by TkTech 10y ago

simcop2387 10y ago

I'm not sure if Kitty does this but with Konsole in KDE it enables a number of features that I've found useful in the past. With Konsole's split view I can have a different terminal setup in each view, i.e. different fonts, font sizes, color scheme, scrollback settings, etc. I've found that to be very useful at times where I've got a bunch of different things being tailed and some are either longer than others or more important and i want them to be up in my face when something goes badly.

TkTech 10y ago
Ah interesting, different fonts is something I didn't consider and something that could likely only be done by the terminal itself!
- simcop2387 10y ago
  Yea it's not something I do commonly but sometimes my coding/terminal font of choice (FiraCode) just doesn't work if I'm say looking at a database dump or some other output and I've got to switch it.

wodenokoto 10y ago

that is kinda funny. The main complaint of the other OpenGL terminal on the frontpage right now is that it doesn't have support for things like tiling or tabs, arguing that it is because terminals don't have nice interface support that we have to use hacks such as multiplexers.

vortico 10y ago
This issue actually divides the terminal userbase. There are the ones with tabs like Gnome Terminal, and the ones that don't manage screens like Termite, st, xterm, and urxvt.
- blux 10y ago
  urxvt supports tabs as well.
  - mos_basik 10y ago
    ...what? I guess I've not dug into the config options enough then. I use the i3 tiling window manager with some tweaks to add uniform gaps between windows and remove their borders/title bars - at first thought, I can't think where/how urxvt would put tabs and make them look good.
    - blux 10y ago
      See for example: https://awhan.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/urxvt-tabbed/ https://awhan.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/urxvt-tabbed/ Configuration is done through ~/.Xdefaults.
- Fnoord 10y ago
  ..and all of them run Tmux/Screen.

gravypod 10y ago

Tiling is very useful for many workloads on one monitor (in a laptop enviroment). Need to run some long running process that needs intervention + do some editing + connect to IRC all in a 12" laptop formfactor? Well tiling is what you need.

vortico 10y ago
He's saying there are other better tools for the purpose. You can use a tiling window manager like i3 or dwm, or a manager within the shell like screen or tmux.
- gravypod 10y ago
  I think of my computer as two half's of the same coin. One I don't need to think about and use my mouse to click though. The other is the one that needs to be respectful interacted with using my dark incantations of Alt/Cntrl + keys to summon features. I don't want these realms mixing. That's just my opinion but it's probably mirrored.

aumerle 10y ago

For me (I am the author of kitty) it is for two reasons: 1) Multiplexers are a hack -- there are various problems with them, such as passing control codes through safely, keyboard shortcuts, performance, etc 2) Tiling WMs -- these can work (in fact I use a tiling WM myself) however, the nice thing about having tiling (and tab management) built into the terminal is that you can manage terminal windows and other windows differently on the same screen. For example, on small screens I like to have most GUI windows such s browser, etc. maximized, but I like to have terminal windows side-by-side, this is hard to manage if you want to have them on the same screen. With tiling built into the terminal, managing terminal windows is in a separate "namespace" from all other types of windows

hobarrera 10y ago
You opinion tiling WMs makes me thing you haven't tried something dead-simple like i3wm. What you describe is a non-issue for us i3 users.
- aumerle 10y ago
  Really? Tell me how you would do the following with i3 or whatever tiling WM floats your boat. Have four terminal windows arranged in a grid, run a random gui program by typing the name of the program in one of those terminals and have the program open maximized. Close the program by using a quit command inside the program and have the terminals laid out in the grid again. And all this without having to use any window management/layout commands, keyboard shortcuts, mouse gestures.
  - hobarrera 10y ago
    > And all this without having to use any window management/layout commands, keyboard shortcuts, mouse gestures. I need to interact with my computer for it to do stuff, I think you somehow exagerated here. Exluding that incoherent requirement, I'd have two choices: 1. Run the command in a terminal and hit super+f 2. Run the command in a terminal, super+right, super+w (I can switch back and for to <-> from the terminal). Bonus point of using i3 is that I can optionally have any external program become part of my grid or add/remove exiting terminals to/from different mixed layouts (or workspaces). With multiplexers you're screwed and can't do that. Note: I do use tmux on all my sessions, but it's mostly for "tab" support, or attaching/detaching (even from different workstations).