4 ms·

I have been helping with the fork, that is the plan. First thing we have to stabilize it and fix the bugs. We are refactoring a paypal module right now that has

by aritali 10y ago

I have been helping with the fork, that is the plan. First thing we have to stabilize it and fix the bugs. We are refactoring a paypal module right now that has buttons that are not connecting to anything. It calls methods that do not exist. It was something that someone made to essentially try to get over on people. Once we get things stabilized we are going to figure out the best way to rewrite things. That is why we are trying to be very community focused. We need to see the pain points of merchants, what they want, what would make them succeed. We are scrubbing the whole platform for legacy code and updating what we can while maintaining compatibility with the current modules and themes. Then we are really going to break this down and develop something more awesome than awesome.

sandGorgon 10y ago
please please use an ORM. if yoy dont build database abstraction today... you will never be able to build it once the plugins take off. Just the fact that you can run postgresql will be a killer feature. i think the golden usecase would be running thirtybees on heroku (postgresql, composer, php 7) EDIT: there was a dead comment about how postgresql is not good. what im asking is different - im requesting for an ORM like Doctrine or Propel. This will let the end user choose the database that they want to use. But you have to take this stand pretty early in a project's life cycle or you will not be able to do it later. Exactly the issue with WordPress. http://www.doctrine-project.org http://www.doctrine-project.org http://propelorm.org http://propelorm.org
- aritali 10y ago
  To be totally honest these are the kind of decisions that kill a platform like this. Postgres is great and everything, but the low number of hosts that adopt it would sink something like this. You really have to look at the market. The main installation user will be using softaculous or a similar installer on cpanel. Which does not support Postgres out of the box. Sure, if you have root you can add it, but that will effectively kill our US shared hosting / managed VPS market. The goal is to make it where merchants can use the software easily and it has features they want. Picking a Postgres design effectively limits us in using compatible modules out of the box and it effectively limits our hosting choices. I don't think its anything we are going to do at the start, but I would not rule out a version of it in the future.
- themaveness 10y ago
  I get it, but honestly it is not in the immediate roadmap. Its really not something that people in the scale we are in are worried with.
  - sandGorgon 10y ago
    an ORM will help you write more maintainable code in general. Every framework right from rails to symfony uses an ORM for the abstraction it brings. Some of the security issues in wordpress - unescaped queries, SQL injection and everything - which plagued it for decades could have been avoided by using a well tested ORM. I would urge you to make this one of the highest priorities in your code cleanup. It is not going to take you a lot of effort, but the long term advantages are too many to enumerate here. For example, for your own development sake - I dont know how you plan to manage schema changes. If you use Propel, you will use "database migrations" - something that every framework from Rails to Django, etc mandates as best practice.
    - themaveness 10y ago
      I understand it, but look at it from this point of view. PrestaShop 1.7 requires everyone to purchase new themes and modules. The code base is extremely messed up. We are taking the PrestaShop 1.6 codebase that has 10k modules and 2k themes as a fork. If we go changing the database handling off the bat we are going to lose the compatibility that might make us successful. We aren't a project starting from scratch with unencumbered code. We need to maintain compatibility to be successful in the beginning. We are springboarding basically. You are wanting us to take the springboard away and just jump.
      - sandGorgon 10y ago
        hmm.. i wont say I'm not disappointed. i thought you guys were going to rewrite a lot of the core because everything is broken anyway. since 1.7 is already breaking backward compatibility.. maybe it was an opportunity to do it right.
        10y ago
benmarks 10y ago
I deal with the PayPal team regularly, and I'm sure they'd be interested in your success. Are you in/near Paris? We (Magento) have an event there in early February. Happy to meet up then or sometime / somewhere.
- themaveness 10y ago
  We are not. We are actually spread out all around the world. Right now we are not a company, we are just agencies / developers that mad, sick and tired, and want something better. We just started this project this week and we are pulling more and more agencies on board, it is exploding under us. About the Paypal. For me personally that is a reason we are forking. Last year the company that develops the Paypal module for PrestaShop got into an affiliate fee dispute with Paypal. They released an "update" of the Paypal module that basically made every UK shop's module disappear on the checkout for customer. People in the UK had a shit fit. I mean who releases an updated module that is meant to punish users to prove a point to Paypal? Totally unacceptable.
  - benmarks 10y ago
    Okay, I've emailed their team so that they can look into the situation.

by aritali 10y ago

sandGorgon 10y ago

please please use an ORM. if yoy dont build database abstraction today... you will never be able to build it once the plugins take off. Just the fact that you can run postgresql will be a killer feature. i think the golden usecase would be running thirtybees on heroku (postgresql, composer, php 7) EDIT: there was a dead comment about how postgresql is not good. what im asking is different - im requesting for an ORM like Doctrine or Propel. This will let the end user choose the database that they want to use. But you have to take this stand pretty early in a project's life cycle or you will not be able to do it later. Exactly the issue with WordPress. http://www.doctrine-project.org http://www.doctrine-project.org http://propelorm.org http://propelorm.org

aritali 10y ago
To be totally honest these are the kind of decisions that kill a platform like this. Postgres is great and everything, but the low number of hosts that adopt it would sink something like this. You really have to look at the market. The main installation user will be using softaculous or a similar installer on cpanel. Which does not support Postgres out of the box. Sure, if you have root you can add it, but that will effectively kill our US shared hosting / managed VPS market. The goal is to make it where merchants can use the software easily and it has features they want. Picking a Postgres design effectively limits us in using compatible modules out of the box and it effectively limits our hosting choices. I don't think its anything we are going to do at the start, but I would not rule out a version of it in the future.
themaveness 10y ago
I get it, but honestly it is not in the immediate roadmap. Its really not something that people in the scale we are in are worried with.
- sandGorgon 10y ago
  an ORM will help you write more maintainable code in general. Every framework right from rails to symfony uses an ORM for the abstraction it brings. Some of the security issues in wordpress - unescaped queries, SQL injection and everything - which plagued it for decades could have been avoided by using a well tested ORM. I would urge you to make this one of the highest priorities in your code cleanup. It is not going to take you a lot of effort, but the long term advantages are too many to enumerate here. For example, for your own development sake - I dont know how you plan to manage schema changes. If you use Propel, you will use "database migrations" - something that every framework from Rails to Django, etc mandates as best practice.
  - themaveness 10y ago
    I understand it, but look at it from this point of view. PrestaShop 1.7 requires everyone to purchase new themes and modules. The code base is extremely messed up. We are taking the PrestaShop 1.6 codebase that has 10k modules and 2k themes as a fork. If we go changing the database handling off the bat we are going to lose the compatibility that might make us successful. We aren't a project starting from scratch with unencumbered code. We need to maintain compatibility to be successful in the beginning. We are springboarding basically. You are wanting us to take the springboard away and just jump.
    - sandGorgon 10y ago
      hmm.. i wont say I'm not disappointed. i thought you guys were going to rewrite a lot of the core because everything is broken anyway. since 1.7 is already breaking backward compatibility.. maybe it was an opportunity to do it right.
      - 10y ago

benmarks 10y ago

I deal with the PayPal team regularly, and I'm sure they'd be interested in your success. Are you in/near Paris? We (Magento) have an event there in early February. Happy to meet up then or sometime / somewhere.

themaveness 10y ago
We are not. We are actually spread out all around the world. Right now we are not a company, we are just agencies / developers that mad, sick and tired, and want something better. We just started this project this week and we are pulling more and more agencies on board, it is exploding under us. About the Paypal. For me personally that is a reason we are forking. Last year the company that develops the Paypal module for PrestaShop got into an affiliate fee dispute with Paypal. They released an "update" of the Paypal module that basically made every UK shop's module disappear on the checkout for customer. People in the UK had a shit fit. I mean who releases an updated module that is meant to punish users to prove a point to Paypal? Totally unacceptable.
- benmarks 10y ago
  Okay, I've emailed their team so that they can look into the situation.