5 ms·

I hate "me too" posts, but when I saw what you wrote I really did want to give you more than one "upvote". I'm a mathematics (and computer science) major at a l

by jgg 16y ago

I hate "me too" posts, but when I saw what you wrote I really did want to give you more than one "upvote". I'm a mathematics (and computer science) major at a large, middle of the road university and I can say my experience has been exactly this. I gave my full rant in another comment ( http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1312043 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1312043 ). Basically, real mathematics takes a lot of mental resources, so in order to appeal to the masses universities have to make the material mind-numbingly stupid. Remember: it would be unacceptable to large corporations if only 1% of the current engineering graduates were graduating, regardless of how much smarter that smaller group would be. > Of course most smart people I knew would more or less blow off the homework and just ace the tests, and thus they would often end up getting a B- even though they probably understood the material better than anyone else. My Calculus II class graded mostly on the stupid homework (from James Stewart's book, no less) and attendance! Unless you care enough to work hard in highschool and have enough money to go to a school like MIT, "higher" education is a huge joke.

tokenadult 16y ago
How rapidly can you place upward into more advanced classes (presumably only for math majors) at your university?
- jgg 16y ago
  It depends on the classes, actually. They do "clepping out" on a per-professor basis. But trust me, I'm looking into that. EDIT: I even sat in on an upper-level programming languages course, and the most advanced thing you learned (from what I gathered) was a bit of Common Lisp. I hate to sound like an arrogant ass, but for the entire lecture I was thinking "Is there something wrong with me? I learned this in highschool!"
  - tokenadult 16y ago
    You mentioned getting a scholarship in the other post about your college. What dictated your college choice?
    - jgg 16y ago
      Short answer: money. Long answer: I had an ACT in the 30s and a GPA of 3.9 upon graduation from highschool, and I took a few AP courses (my school only offered 3, and in addition I took AP Physics over the internet (terrible idea)), got a 5 in the AP Calc test, etc. but past that I hadn't taken the SAT subject tests or anything, so I wasn't really competitive. My family and I don't have a lot of excess money just lying around, and basically my options were thus: get admitted to a couple upper-tier-but-not-Ivy-League schools and pay with money I didn't have, or go to a crappy state school with scholarships. I've had a job since 7th grade (but there are not a lot of tech companies in my area, so they haven't really been 'tech' jobs), but all of that was saved for buying my own vehicle, insurance, 'spare' money for college, etc. I remember getting excited when I received a ~$20K a year scholarship to a "Blah Blah Institute of Technology", only to find that it cost $50K a year to attend. Overall, I'm burnt on the education system. My goal now is to get out with a stupid degree before I completely crash, but I'm already coming dangerously close... EDIT: I was also in Duke's TIP program, which got me mail from Columbia and the like, but once again I couldn't really afford to go through with any of that. EDIT 2: Before this sounds like just a bunch of whining, a huge chunk of this was my fault. I could have had higher scores and grades and whatnot, but I really just didn't give a shit. I hated school, and wanted to do as little as possible. I've always loved learning though.
      - steveklabnik 16y ago
        You pretty much sound exactly like me. You're not alone at all.
        jgg 16y ago
        I know it sounds corny, but it does feel good to hear someone say that. (-:
        steveklabnik 16y ago
        Good. That's why I said it. :) I had a 4.7 GPA in high school. (Yay honors classes and my school being more interested in making themselves look good than math.) By my sophomore year of college, I was completely burned out. If I love learning so much, why did I hate college? It was supposed to be different... I ended up not finishing my degree to get into the startup game. I feel much, much better now. I don't think I'm going back, even though I only need one or two classes to be done. Yeah, a piece of paper might be nice in the general sense... but I don't want to give those bastards another dime. I had to take out loans to pay for all of school, so I'm a solid 70k in the hole. Fun times.
- djcapelis 16y ago
  It's not about placing more rapidly. If you don't know the material then you need to learn it somehow, but if the course goes at a snail's pace then who the hell wants to waste their time showing up? You need not just proper placement, but proper speed. Placing out of a boringly paced class into a different boringly paced class doesn't help.
  - tokenadult 16y ago
    Placing out of a boringly paced class into a different boringly paced class doesn't help. True, as I discovered after my grade skip from fifth grade to seventh grade. That's why my involvement in nonprofit organizations is all about finding better curricula for gifted learners, even if I have to write the curricula myself.
nostrademons 16y ago
MIT is free if your parents make less than $75k/year.
- jgg 16y ago
  If I had known that, I would have actually tried in highschool.
  - nostrademons 16y ago
    That's why I'm trying to spread the word. :-)
- cracki 16y ago
  and if you like to compete in something that lets less than 10% win (prize = admission).
  - sokoloff 16y ago
    Right, because if you happen to not get into MIT, all of your high school preparatory effort was entirely wasted. (MIT alum here, but there's nothing all that singularly unique about MIT in my book. I'm glad I was able to go, but I also realize (claim?) that most people who would be successful at MIT will be successful wherever they go, and that MIT is likely a rounding error in their success. MIT doesn't turn lead applicants into gold graduates.)

by jgg 16y ago

tokenadult 16y ago

How rapidly can you place upward into more advanced classes (presumably only for math majors) at your university?

jgg 16y ago
It depends on the classes, actually. They do "clepping out" on a per-professor basis. But trust me, I'm looking into that. EDIT: I even sat in on an upper-level programming languages course, and the most advanced thing you learned (from what I gathered) was a bit of Common Lisp. I hate to sound like an arrogant ass, but for the entire lecture I was thinking "Is there something wrong with me? I learned this in highschool!"
- tokenadult 16y ago
  You mentioned getting a scholarship in the other post about your college. What dictated your college choice?
  - jgg 16y ago
    Short answer: money. Long answer: I had an ACT in the 30s and a GPA of 3.9 upon graduation from highschool, and I took a few AP courses (my school only offered 3, and in addition I took AP Physics over the internet (terrible idea)), got a 5 in the AP Calc test, etc. but past that I hadn't taken the SAT subject tests or anything, so I wasn't really competitive. My family and I don't have a lot of excess money just lying around, and basically my options were thus: get admitted to a couple upper-tier-but-not-Ivy-League schools and pay with money I didn't have, or go to a crappy state school with scholarships. I've had a job since 7th grade (but there are not a lot of tech companies in my area, so they haven't really been 'tech' jobs), but all of that was saved for buying my own vehicle, insurance, 'spare' money for college, etc. I remember getting excited when I received a ~$20K a year scholarship to a "Blah Blah Institute of Technology", only to find that it cost $50K a year to attend. Overall, I'm burnt on the education system. My goal now is to get out with a stupid degree before I completely crash, but I'm already coming dangerously close... EDIT: I was also in Duke's TIP program, which got me mail from Columbia and the like, but once again I couldn't really afford to go through with any of that. EDIT 2: Before this sounds like just a bunch of whining, a huge chunk of this was my fault. I could have had higher scores and grades and whatnot, but I really just didn't give a shit. I hated school, and wanted to do as little as possible. I've always loved learning though.
    - steveklabnik 16y ago
      You pretty much sound exactly like me. You're not alone at all.
      - jgg 16y ago
        I know it sounds corny, but it does feel good to hear someone say that. (-:
        steveklabnik 16y ago
        Good. That's why I said it. :) I had a 4.7 GPA in high school. (Yay honors classes and my school being more interested in making themselves look good than math.) By my sophomore year of college, I was completely burned out. If I love learning so much, why did I hate college? It was supposed to be different... I ended up not finishing my degree to get into the startup game. I feel much, much better now. I don't think I'm going back, even though I only need one or two classes to be done. Yeah, a piece of paper might be nice in the general sense... but I don't want to give those bastards another dime. I had to take out loans to pay for all of school, so I'm a solid 70k in the hole. Fun times.
djcapelis 16y ago
It's not about placing more rapidly. If you don't know the material then you need to learn it somehow, but if the course goes at a snail's pace then who the hell wants to waste their time showing up? You need not just proper placement, but proper speed. Placing out of a boringly paced class into a different boringly paced class doesn't help.
- tokenadult 16y ago
  Placing out of a boringly paced class into a different boringly paced class doesn't help. True, as I discovered after my grade skip from fifth grade to seventh grade. That's why my involvement in nonprofit organizations is all about finding better curricula for gifted learners, even if I have to write the curricula myself.

nostrademons 16y ago

MIT is free if your parents make less than $75k/year.

jgg 16y ago
If I had known that, I would have actually tried in highschool.
- nostrademons 16y ago
  That's why I'm trying to spread the word. :-)
cracki 16y ago
and if you like to compete in something that lets less than 10% win (prize = admission).
- sokoloff 16y ago
  Right, because if you happen to not get into MIT, all of your high school preparatory effort was entirely wasted. (MIT alum here, but there's nothing all that singularly unique about MIT in my book. I'm glad I was able to go, but I also realize (claim?) that most people who would be successful at MIT will be successful wherever they go, and that MIT is likely a rounding error in their success. MIT doesn't turn lead applicants into gold graduates.)