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I think this is somewhat incorrect- The creators of AlphaGo made it clear that their system does not take the opponent into account at all, it just answers the
by drcode 10y ago
I think this is somewhat incorrect- The creators of AlphaGo made it clear that their system does not take the opponent into account at all, it just answers the question "What is the strongest move right now?" and plays that move, without taking the opponent into account. In other words, it does not have any mental model of the opponent.
However, you are correct insofar that it doesn't care about winning by large margins, it prefers winning by smaller margins if it can achieve this with a higher win probability.
- smallnamespace 10y agoA perhaps more accurate way to say it is that AlphaGo's models its opponents as a copy of itself.
- conanbatt 10y agoSo do human players, with rare exceptional ocassions
- iopq 10y agoPlaying trap moves is not that rare and it shows that you expect the opponent not to know a complicated variation.
- conanbatt 10y agoStrong players dont play "trap moves"
- iopq 10y agoWho said anything about strong players?
- smallnamespace 10y ago> AlphaGo
- iopq 10y agohuman players are not alphago
- smallnamespace 10y agoThe context of this thread is AlphaGo. Why would we bother discussing what bad human players do when the topic is clearly about play at the highest levels?
- iopq 10y agoThe highest level players play special variations against each other hoping that the other player doesn't know it. They CLEARLY play against what they think the other player knows, not what they know (since they have studied this variation on purpose to prepare)
- conanbatt 10y agoAs a semi-pro player I can assure you thats not how you play Go.
- nardi 10y agoAll competitive-game-playing AIs ask, "What will my opponent play in response to this move?" It's possible for an AI to evaluate a move based solely on the resulting board position, but it wouldn't be very good. Pretty much all AIs play many turns out to see if the move is any good. In the case of AlphaGo and Monte Carlo tree search, they actually play to the end of the game many times. To do this, they must of course play moves for each player.
- IanCal 10y agoAh but I think the key here is that it doesn't say "how will this player respond" but "how would a player respond". No matter how I've played against it to get to where we are, it'll play the same from that point on. It won't identify me as a risky player from my pattern, nor will it try and classify me as "unpredictable" in some way. It'll play each move as though it has sat down at an already in-progress game between two random opponents. > It's possible for an AI to evaluate a move based solely on the resulting board position, but it wouldn't be very good. Pretty much all AIs play many turns out to see if the move is any good. I would strongly argue that these are identical situations. Playing out scenarios in your head but taking into account no history is the same as "evaluating a move based solely on the board position".