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> I had used peace to beat the thugs around the head. Oh no, you did not. You used the full power and latent savagery of a crowd. It might have turned out very

> I had used peace to beat the thugs around the head. Oh no, you did not. You used the full power and latent savagery of a crowd. It might have turned out very differently (but made a better story to tell much later on). And the girlfriend is not a peace seeker. She did not help defuse the situation at all.

lolc 10y ago
In what other more peaceful ways could she have defused the situation?
- johnchristopher 10y ago
  By leaving the party and/or leaving things at that (and getting support from security/police/etc if things escalate). She shouldn't get back to her friend/boyfriend asking him to `fix` things caveman style. That's a very bad line of thinking and will usually get anyone close to her into troubles. It's like dating a walking grenade. Try not to.
  - danharaj 10y ago
    Your ethics make public spaces hostile to vulnerable people.
    - literallycancer 10y ago
      Your ethics make public spaces hostile to everyone. What if she mistook the guy for someone else? Then what, crowd beats a random guy to death?
    - johnchristopher 10y ago
      No, the thugs in the aforementioned story do that. The incident was already over. The girlfriend was asking for revenge (not justice) and the guy described in the article how he had to react « as a man ». That's escalation. Now if you are caught in the middle of such situations there a number of methods you can try to defuse the situation: http://lifehacker.com/ive-worked-bar-security-heres-how-to-talk-your-way-out-1789998817 http://lifehacker.com/ive-worked-bar-security-heres-how-to-t... (I know it's from lifehacker but the article has really good tips. Ignore the pictures).
- extra88 10y ago
  He didn't do anything that should couldn't have done herself. Not everyone would think to try what he did but if she had done it, it would have been more likely to have turned out okay.
  - lolc 10y ago
    Yes, that would have been even better. It would be nice if every person had the resolve to react like this. "She didn't do anything to defuse the situation" implies that she could have handled the situation better. As per the story she was shocked, intimidated, and looking for somebody to help her. It's not her duty to "defuse the situation". She was not the one escalating it in the first place.
    - johnchristopher 10y ago
      No, no. I don't think or know if she could have reacted differently when the aggression happened. That's another part of the story. The 'not defusing the situation' is about how she came back to someone asking to 'fix it'. That's when escalation happened. That someone being under the influence of drugs at that moment made another bad move by 'trying something' which escalated the situation one more step. Don't play stupid in that kind of situation: a knife can be pulled out really fast and the thugs could have left the place the same way but with one seriously wounded person. And for what ? For seeking revenge by shaming of fighting the guys (that was a possibility on the mind of the author, he states getting beaten happened once and he turned out okay, whatever) for damage already done.
swift 10y ago
How would you have handled this situation? I think the author handled it extremely well and I'm proud of him for doing so.
- johnchristopher 10y ago
  I would have left the party and then see if my friend/girlfriend was okay and if she needed support (professional or not). I would certainly not try to get strangers into a bigger brawl.
  - tehwalrus 10y ago
    But what he did was not get them into a brawl. He simply challenged them publicly. This is the very purpose of free speech! I also object to the characterisation of the crowd as a mob. Democracy and mob rule are the same words (etymologically), we simply pick which one we use based on whether we like the application. This was unquestionably mob rule for ethical purposes, aka democracy. I don't think the tyranny of the majority can be applied to the defense of attendees asked to leave a party for assaulting a guest.
    - LordWinstanley 10y ago
      >>I also object to the characterisation of the crowd as a mob What about the characterisation of the other group as "violent thugs"?
      - danharaj 10y ago
        They sexually harassed someone? That's violence.
        literallycancer 10y ago
        His girlfriend claimed it was sexual assault, doesn't mean it was.
        10y ago

lolc 10y ago

In what other more peaceful ways could she have defused the situation?

johnchristopher 10y ago
By leaving the party and/or leaving things at that (and getting support from security/police/etc if things escalate). She shouldn't get back to her friend/boyfriend asking him to `fix` things caveman style. That's a very bad line of thinking and will usually get anyone close to her into troubles. It's like dating a walking grenade. Try not to.
- danharaj 10y ago
  Your ethics make public spaces hostile to vulnerable people.
  - literallycancer 10y ago
    Your ethics make public spaces hostile to everyone. What if she mistook the guy for someone else? Then what, crowd beats a random guy to death?
  - johnchristopher 10y ago
    No, the thugs in the aforementioned story do that. The incident was already over. The girlfriend was asking for revenge (not justice) and the guy described in the article how he had to react « as a man ». That's escalation. Now if you are caught in the middle of such situations there a number of methods you can try to defuse the situation: http://lifehacker.com/ive-worked-bar-security-heres-how-to-talk-your-way-out-1789998817 http://lifehacker.com/ive-worked-bar-security-heres-how-to-t... (I know it's from lifehacker but the article has really good tips. Ignore the pictures).
extra88 10y ago
He didn't do anything that should couldn't have done herself. Not everyone would think to try what he did but if she had done it, it would have been more likely to have turned out okay.
- lolc 10y ago
  Yes, that would have been even better. It would be nice if every person had the resolve to react like this. "She didn't do anything to defuse the situation" implies that she could have handled the situation better. As per the story she was shocked, intimidated, and looking for somebody to help her. It's not her duty to "defuse the situation". She was not the one escalating it in the first place.
  - johnchristopher 10y ago
    No, no. I don't think or know if she could have reacted differently when the aggression happened. That's another part of the story. The 'not defusing the situation' is about how she came back to someone asking to 'fix it'. That's when escalation happened. That someone being under the influence of drugs at that moment made another bad move by 'trying something' which escalated the situation one more step. Don't play stupid in that kind of situation: a knife can be pulled out really fast and the thugs could have left the place the same way but with one seriously wounded person. And for what ? For seeking revenge by shaming of fighting the guys (that was a possibility on the mind of the author, he states getting beaten happened once and he turned out okay, whatever) for damage already done.

swift 10y ago

How would you have handled this situation? I think the author handled it extremely well and I'm proud of him for doing so.

johnchristopher 10y ago
I would have left the party and then see if my friend/girlfriend was okay and if she needed support (professional or not). I would certainly not try to get strangers into a bigger brawl.
- tehwalrus 10y ago
  But what he did was not get them into a brawl. He simply challenged them publicly. This is the very purpose of free speech! I also object to the characterisation of the crowd as a mob. Democracy and mob rule are the same words (etymologically), we simply pick which one we use based on whether we like the application. This was unquestionably mob rule for ethical purposes, aka democracy. I don't think the tyranny of the majority can be applied to the defense of attendees asked to leave a party for assaulting a guest.
  - LordWinstanley 10y ago
    >>I also object to the characterisation of the crowd as a mob What about the characterisation of the other group as "violent thugs"?
    - danharaj 10y ago
      They sexually harassed someone? That's violence.
      - literallycancer 10y ago
        His girlfriend claimed it was sexual assault, doesn't mean it was.
      - 10y ago