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There have been quite a few downvotes for suggesting that illegalization may not be the best remedy. What are people's thoughts on something like: https://yout

There have been quite a few downvotes for suggesting that illegalization may not be the best remedy. What are people's thoughts on something like: https://youtu.be/YUA8i5S0YMU https://youtu.be/YUA8i5S0YMU tldw: Controlled trophy hunting big game is one of the most effective ways (sadly) of protecting the hunted animals.

TazeTSchnitzel 10y ago
And it's effective because 1) it brings in a lot of money which goes towards conservation, and 2) it economically incentivises conservation.
okreallywtf 10y ago
If you are interested in thoughtful debate on that topic, watch (listen?) to this debate that I heard on the radio a while back and was able to find [1]. My girlfriend and I were on the way back from a run and ended up sitting in the driveway for a good 30 minutes listening. I was leaning towards one side already but not so much that I wasn't open to the arguments of the other side, but I was really impressed overall with the format and the quality of the arguments on both side. I felt one side had a significantly better supported stance but it was really pleasing to hear a quality debate on the topic. Well worth the listen. [1] http://www.intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/hunters-conserve-wildlife http://www.intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/hunters-conserv...
- mistermann 10y ago
  Have you listened to many i2 debates? I've only ever heard one many years ago, can't remember the topic but it was absolutely fantastic, have always intended to check out some others.
  - okreallywtf 10y ago
    This was the first and only one but I couldn't tell you why I didn't immediately go and find more. I think I will now that I have tracked this one down, it feels even more important now given the level of discourse we typically see. I would love to see more people exposed to these kinds of debates, if I was a teacher or involved in schools I would love to play things like this for students.
acomjean 10y ago
Gernerally I think environmentalist and hunters have the same objective, conserve a species. When I was in Africa, it was pointed out that the "game hunters" get to bring back a trophy, and that trophy containing ivory often never makes it back, going into the black market. Keeping a steady lower bound on the supply for those making a living in smuggling, and enabling poaching elsewhere. I have no answers to this problem. One hopes it can be stopped on the demand side, and this move by China will help. Ivory is an odd substance to be considered so valuable.
- SpikeDad 10y ago
  Well of course for entirely different reasons. I personally am not in favor of facilitating the human blood lust to kill in order to save a species. Humans can easily facilitate good conservation without requiring it to be attached to the killing of animals for sport. I think it's valuable just for the reason that it's from a unique and special animal. And the market is supported by China via corrupt government officials and organized crime.
adamnemecek 10y ago
> Controlled trophy hunting big game is one of the most effective ways (sadly) of protecting the hunted animals. This is debatable at best. If you want to have an argument, point out research, not a college humor video.

TazeTSchnitzel 10y ago

And it's effective because 1) it brings in a lot of money which goes towards conservation, and 2) it economically incentivises conservation.

okreallywtf 10y ago

If you are interested in thoughtful debate on that topic, watch (listen?) to this debate that I heard on the radio a while back and was able to find [1]. My girlfriend and I were on the way back from a run and ended up sitting in the driveway for a good 30 minutes listening. I was leaning towards one side already but not so much that I wasn't open to the arguments of the other side, but I was really impressed overall with the format and the quality of the arguments on both side. I felt one side had a significantly better supported stance but it was really pleasing to hear a quality debate on the topic. Well worth the listen. [1] http://www.intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/hunters-conserve-wildlife http://www.intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/hunters-conserv...

mistermann 10y ago
Have you listened to many i2 debates? I've only ever heard one many years ago, can't remember the topic but it was absolutely fantastic, have always intended to check out some others.
- okreallywtf 10y ago
  This was the first and only one but I couldn't tell you why I didn't immediately go and find more. I think I will now that I have tracked this one down, it feels even more important now given the level of discourse we typically see. I would love to see more people exposed to these kinds of debates, if I was a teacher or involved in schools I would love to play things like this for students.

acomjean 10y ago

Gernerally I think environmentalist and hunters have the same objective, conserve a species. When I was in Africa, it was pointed out that the "game hunters" get to bring back a trophy, and that trophy containing ivory often never makes it back, going into the black market. Keeping a steady lower bound on the supply for those making a living in smuggling, and enabling poaching elsewhere. I have no answers to this problem. One hopes it can be stopped on the demand side, and this move by China will help. Ivory is an odd substance to be considered so valuable.

SpikeDad 10y ago
Well of course for entirely different reasons. I personally am not in favor of facilitating the human blood lust to kill in order to save a species. Humans can easily facilitate good conservation without requiring it to be attached to the killing of animals for sport. I think it's valuable just for the reason that it's from a unique and special animal. And the market is supported by China via corrupt government officials and organized crime.

adamnemecek 10y ago

> Controlled trophy hunting big game is one of the most effective ways (sadly) of protecting the hunted animals. This is debatable at best. If you want to have an argument, point out research, not a college humor video.