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The sophistication cited by CrowdStrike was the actions taken on the DNC servers, not the initial penetration.
by heartbreak 10y ago
The sophistication cited by CrowdStrike was the actions taken on the DNC servers, not the initial penetration.
- randyrand 10y agoCould you elaborate? Once you have a password shouldn't it be as easy as just downloading all the emails? Any email client should have the functionality built in. edit: seeing some reports they used "sophisticated" SQL injection... okay...I mean for a lay person it seems sophisticated, sure. But for anyone in the industry it's one of the oldest and easiest tricks in the book. I really suspect news sources are knowingly exaggerating about the sophistication of this "hack" in order to make up-play Russia's role and downplay the DNC's culpability.
- cloakandswagger 10y agoYou can read about the backdoors they used here: https://www.crowdstrike.com/blog/bears-midst-intrusion-democratic-national-committee/ https://www.crowdstrike.com/blog/bears-midst-intrusion-democ... The summary: One used Powershell modules and Windows Scheduler to run scripts. Another used a combination of Twitter and public sites like Github/Dropbox for command and control. In my opinion, neither is impressively sophisticated, and a skilled application developer could whip up something similar in a week or two. Using popular sites like Twitter/Dropbox for C&C has been common for years, and you can purchase similar backdoors/RATs for less than $100. edit: Another interesting point from the link above: the two exploits stole exactly the same info once inside the DNC network. This would obviously be a big no-no for a sophisticated state actor as it doubles your chance of being compromised, but the author explains it away by claiming that Russia's intelligence agencies are disorganized and adversarial.
- cmdrfred 10y agoI have personally written that exact tool while learning Python. A RAT using Twitter for C & C. Uses PGP for encryption and verification. The twitter handles for the C & C change based on a hash of Googles lastest Doodle so you can access it without fear of account deletion. TIL I'm as good as a state level intelligence team. Hey CIA/NSA we know you are reading this, my contact info is in my profile. Hire me.
- politician 10y agoTomorrow: "Cyberhacker admits to Russian hacker tools" > Yesterday, an Internet cyber hacker using the alias "cmdrfred" claimed on "HackerNews", an elite underground hacker site, that he or she personally built the hacking tools used by Russia to breach the DNC email servers and change the outcome of the recent election. > "I have personally written that exact tool [it] uses ... encryption ... so you can access [the DNC] without fear." > "I'm as good as a state level intelligence team." > cmdrfred went on to taunt American intelligence agencies while admitting that he was aware that elite anti-cyberhacking teams from the NSA and CIA were monitoring his operations. > The owner of HackerNews Paul Graham -- venture capitalist, flamboyant playboy, and known Russian sympathizer -- could not be reached for comment.
- jocro 10y ago> TIL I'm as good as a state level intelligence team. Not to totally ignore the pithiness, but I feel like your comment touches on something I see a ton here (and elsewhere): an offhand dismissal of the 'state level' intelligence capacity. At the end of the day, the systems were exploited. That more sophisticated methods went unused should be a measure of efficiency and not necessarily execution. Why break out the trick play if your opponent can't keep from you running it up the middle?
- avn2109 10y agoTrue. But the absence of sophistication constitutes evidence neither in favor nor against the "State Actor" hypothesis.
- lern_too_spel 10y agoYour "summary" leaves out the key points. The SeaDaddy, X-Agent, and X-Tunnel tools used in these attacks have only been used by two groups, using the same control servers each time, on European, American, and World Anti-Doping Agency targets that the Russians had strong motive to attack, with some of the attacks being attributed to Russia by multiple other means. If it turned out that Russia was not behind these attacks, the scale of the bad publicity for Crowdstrike, Fidelis, Palo Alto Networks, etc. would nearly put them out of business. Unlike you, they have skin in the game and don't make these claims lightly.
- elif 10y agoThe problem with relying upon motive and established MO exclusively is that anyone is therefore capable of framing whomever they like. This is the next generation of warfare, attribution is simply impossible. Even if there existed actual forensic evidence it could not be relied upon. Reacting to purported attacks at face value will leave you like a 1-layer chess player, potentially acting on behalf of your adversary.
- lern_too_spel 10y agoAs I said above, the attribution does not rely solely on motive. All private security firms that analyzed the attack have attributed it to Russia, and they would not stake their reputations on such a flimsy argument.
- unclepresent 10y agoall private security firms ? name one, please
- lern_too_spel 10y agoI named three in my first comment above. There are also Mandiant (FireEye) and SecureWorks. Previous attacks with the same malware were attributed to Russia by Threatconnect and Microsoft, who calls the "Fancy Bear" group "Strontium."
- frozenport 10y agoRNC got hacked but nothing was leaked.
- leesalminen 10y agoSource?
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- c4mden 10y ago“We now have high confidence that they hacked the D.N.C. and the R.N.C., and conspicuously released no documents” from the Republican organization, one senior administration official said, referring to the Russians. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/09/us/obama-russia-election-hack.html http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/09/us/obama-russia-election-h...
- ericlavigne 10y agoThe article is very unclear. Here's another quote in the same article that says the hacks against the RNC failed. The NY Times is basically telling us that they received conflicting reports from different anonymous and similarly credible sources. "One senior government official, who had been briefed on an F.B.I. investigation into the matter, said that while there were attempts to penetrate the Republican committee’s systems, they were not successful."
- ethbro 10y agoExactly, why burn zero-days when you're targeting a technologically unsophisticated adversary with a huge organizational attack surface? Sure, HDD firmware hacks are cool, but in terms of R&D time far less efficient if you're willing to spam attempts to get in the front door. And I'd say they chose the appropriate level of sophistication given the success of the penetration. The DNC isn't exactly an air-gapped Iranian nuclear centrifuge.
- CountSessine 10y agoExactly, why burn zero-days when you're targeting a technologically unsophisticated adversary with a huge organizational attack surface? Then how is this evidence of a 'state-sponsored actor'? And how did the narrative of this story ever get derailed from what it should have been, which was, "The DNC, and John Podesta in particular who had both his gmail and his Twitter accounts hacked, are incompetent", to "this is Russian interference in a US election"?