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> I do feel like shipping goods by container ship is bad for the environment and bad for consumers. How is it bad for consumers (beyond the environment)? Ship

> I do feel like shipping goods by container ship is bad for the environment and bad for consumers. How is it bad for consumers (beyond the environment)? Shipping goods does include an environmental cost which is not incorporated into the price of things - an unfortunate externality. We should have a carbon tax to properly reflect the true cost of items made and shipped so the market can choose between a locally made good and one made elsewhere. There seems to be a popular opinion that even if the environmental cost were accounted for (carbon neutral) that it is still somehow inherently superior to make things nearby rather then trade for them from another city, state or country (especially food).

amluto 10y ago
> We should have a carbon tax to properly reflect the true cost of items made and shipped so the market can choose between a locally made good and one made elsewhere. I agree, but the results may be a bit surprising. Shipping by container ship is extremely efficient [1]. On the West coast, for example, it might be cheaper (possibly far cheaper) to buy goods from Asia than from the Midwest. And wine drinkers in New York who care about energy consumption might be better of with French wine than "local" California wine. [1] http://business.tenntom.org/why-use-the-waterway/shipping-comparisons/ http://business.tenntom.org/why-use-the-waterway/shipping-co... for example
- mikeash 10y ago
  It's not so bad if your land transport uses the train. Although I'm really surprised at how unsafe trains are, according to that. Is that all from automobile/train collisions at level crossings?
  - amluto 10y ago
    I don't know, but I'd guess so. On the other hand, the N/A for nonfatal truck injuries is suspicious.
- ZeroGravitas 10y ago
  This probably also explains factories in the middle of the US closing, since they do not have easy transport links in and out of the country. They would have been built there in the past because of easy transport links within the country.

amluto 10y ago

> We should have a carbon tax to properly reflect the true cost of items made and shipped so the market can choose between a locally made good and one made elsewhere. I agree, but the results may be a bit surprising. Shipping by container ship is extremely efficient [1]. On the West coast, for example, it might be cheaper (possibly far cheaper) to buy goods from Asia than from the Midwest. And wine drinkers in New York who care about energy consumption might be better of with French wine than "local" California wine. [1] http://business.tenntom.org/why-use-the-waterway/shipping-comparisons/ http://business.tenntom.org/why-use-the-waterway/shipping-co... for example

mikeash 10y ago
It's not so bad if your land transport uses the train. Although I'm really surprised at how unsafe trains are, according to that. Is that all from automobile/train collisions at level crossings?
- amluto 10y ago
  I don't know, but I'd guess so. On the other hand, the N/A for nonfatal truck injuries is suspicious.
ZeroGravitas 10y ago
This probably also explains factories in the middle of the US closing, since they do not have easy transport links in and out of the country. They would have been built there in the past because of easy transport links within the country.