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I know it's an old article but re-reading it is worthwhile; it is short and chilling - how have we ended up in a dystopian present where the ability to perform

I know it's an old article but re-reading it is worthwhile; it is short and chilling - how have we ended up in a dystopian present where the ability to perform bulk surveillance is demanded and ruled upon in secret court rooms (in the UK where I am based the situation is even worse!). I have never found myself in the situation that Ladar Levison describes but I wonder (and fear) whether I would have the courage to shut down my business on a matter of principle like that.

lmm 10y ago
The only reason he had to shut down or provide bulk access is because he had built it without a system to provide specific access. You might believe the government should never be able to access private communications at all, but that would be a quite extreme position. In this case they had a (presumably legitimate) warrant for access to a specific user's emails (and while it shouldn't affect the principles at issue, it focuses the mind to remember that this was a child porn case IIRC).
- delish 10y ago
  > it focuses the mind to remember that this was a child porn case IIRC Do you have a link? If you're referring to Lavabit's shutdown, according to this source [1], they were looking for Snowden. I've never heard Snowden associated with child porn. [1] https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed-snowden-target-lavabit-case/ https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed...
- waterphone 10y ago
  No, it was Ed Snowden's email account.
  - at-fates-hands 10y ago
    This was recently confirmed: https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed-snowden-target-lavabit-case/ https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed... But federal authorities recently screwed up and revealed the secret themselves when they published a cache of case documents but failed to redact one identifying piece of information about the target: his email address, Ed_Snowden@lavabit.com. With that, the very authorities holding the threat of jail time over Levison’s head if he said anything have confirmed what everyone had long ago presumed: that the target account was Snowden’s.
- JustSomeNobody 10y ago
  It always is and always will be either Child Porn or Terrorists. Because nobody has the political capital to say no to either of these.
- noxToken 10y ago
  Sexual exploitation of children is one of the most reprehensible things I can think of. Regardless eroding the privacy of everyone to maybe catch someone is not possible. Children are absolutely innocent, and they always deserve protection. Using child exploitation as a means to snoop isn't protecting; it's just a bullshit excuse at mass surveillance. There is, however, a balance to privacy.
- Daviey 10y ago
  I can only agree with your 'quite extreme' classification, if you also agree that a physical chat between you and I in the your house (especially if we are sat in the bath or bed) should also be freely evesdropped... otherwise we are talking about the same thing, just abstracted away to the ether.
  - lmm 10y ago
    Freely eavesdropped? No. Eavesdroppable after a suitable warrant has been issued (narrowly scoped, based on probable cause, with appropriate safeguards in place)? Yes.

lmm 10y ago

The only reason he had to shut down or provide bulk access is because he had built it without a system to provide specific access. You might believe the government should never be able to access private communications at all, but that would be a quite extreme position. In this case they had a (presumably legitimate) warrant for access to a specific user's emails (and while it shouldn't affect the principles at issue, it focuses the mind to remember that this was a child porn case IIRC).

delish 10y ago
> it focuses the mind to remember that this was a child porn case IIRC Do you have a link? If you're referring to Lavabit's shutdown, according to this source [1], they were looking for Snowden. I've never heard Snowden associated with child porn. [1] https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed-snowden-target-lavabit-case/ https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed...
waterphone 10y ago
No, it was Ed Snowden's email account.
- at-fates-hands 10y ago
  This was recently confirmed: https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed-snowden-target-lavabit-case/ https://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed... But federal authorities recently screwed up and revealed the secret themselves when they published a cache of case documents but failed to redact one identifying piece of information about the target: his email address, Ed_Snowden@lavabit.com. With that, the very authorities holding the threat of jail time over Levison’s head if he said anything have confirmed what everyone had long ago presumed: that the target account was Snowden’s.
JustSomeNobody 10y ago
It always is and always will be either Child Porn or Terrorists. Because nobody has the political capital to say no to either of these.
noxToken 10y ago
Sexual exploitation of children is one of the most reprehensible things I can think of. Regardless eroding the privacy of everyone to maybe catch someone is not possible. Children are absolutely innocent, and they always deserve protection. Using child exploitation as a means to snoop isn't protecting; it's just a bullshit excuse at mass surveillance. There is, however, a balance to privacy.
Daviey 10y ago
I can only agree with your 'quite extreme' classification, if you also agree that a physical chat between you and I in the your house (especially if we are sat in the bath or bed) should also be freely evesdropped... otherwise we are talking about the same thing, just abstracted away to the ether.
- lmm 10y ago
  Freely eavesdropped? No. Eavesdroppable after a suitable warrant has been issued (narrowly scoped, based on probable cause, with appropriate safeguards in place)? Yes.