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Hi Steve, We've met at Rails conf, in Tel Aviv many years ago. You seemed nice, so I'm motivated to try to give you my 2c. I believe Rust can be more than saf

by jondot 10y ago

Hi Steve, We've met at Rails conf, in Tel Aviv many years ago. You seemed nice, so I'm motivated to try to give you my 2c. I believe Rust can be more than safety but right now it isn't as you are imagining it. I've started off in the demoscene in the early 90's, and so I've had my share of assembly, C, and C++ as a kid. I've built demos, games, generative 3D art with 8-64kb executables, without access to Internet or any form of proper knowledge, and it's funny how scared I am of attempting this again today when I'm much older, and much, much more experienced. I think one of the scary factors are the time-to-value ratio: I'm used to several orders of magnitude more productivity, and have much less time. I think the most important take away from my background story that you can adopt is - make Rust playful. Fun is a a base element for curiosity, it what drives us where we're the most receptive - when we're kids - to learn, to experience, and to understand what will in be our toolbelt for the next dozen years. Make rust playful. Make a game framework. Make it build on a mobile device. Make it build on a Pi (without docker, and the entire diarrhea of toolchain you have to use). Make it build for the Arduino. Cross compile it to Javascript (for fun!). Often I try my hands at C and C++ again. When I do that, I'm not disappointed. I see a comforting place where I've spent my childhood at (and with C++ - some of my professional life). I'm happy with how C++ evolved and how CMake works. I'm not happy because productivity didn't change for the better that much. It still requires around the same amount of time to build things in C and C++ as it did years ago. Where I do see a change is with Go. It gives me the same comfort, with an insane productivity factor. It also had fun baked in from the start - it can run on mobile, it can run games, and it can compile to what ever I want without a fuss. I hope my thoughts will make a real change. I really do think this is the missing part with the Rust story.

kibwen 10y ago
Since you mentioned the demoscene, I think you may enjoy this fantastic 56kb demo written in Rust: https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/597hhv/logicoma_elysian_1st_place_trsac_2016_pc_64kb/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/597hhv/logicoma_elysi... :)
- jondot 10y ago
  Wow! fantastic!
steveklabnik 10y ago
Hey there! That was a fun conf :) I've said "Rust has a lack of whimsy" several times recently, we'll see what we can do :)
jamesmunns 10y ago
Hey Jon, Not Steve here, but I was wondering if you were being sarcastic here: > Make rust playful. Why am I asking if you're being sarcastic? > Make a game framework http://www.piston.rs/ http://www.piston.rs/ > Make it build on a mobile device https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/building-an-ios-app-in-rust-part-1/ https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/building-an-ios-app-in-rus... > Make it build on a Pi... without diarrhea curl https://sh.rustup.rs -sSf | sh > Make it build for the Arduino (An ARM based Arduino, AVR [which powers the original Arduinos] support is being worked on now) https://github.com/jamesmunns/teensy3-rs https://github.com/jamesmunns/teensy3-rs > Cross compile it to Javascript https://blog.rust-lang.org/2016/12/22/Rust-1.14.html https://blog.rust-lang.org/2016/12/22/Rust-1.14.html
- jondot 10y ago
  I'm not being sarcastic at all, and after reading my post again I can't see how it can be read that way. My apologies if my english isn't that good. I'm familiar with piston, and by "making it build on a Pi" - my mistake, I meant make it cross-compile for a Pi. The rest of your examples are quite "it can be done" and not it "should be done". The only thing I can say is - why not organize a game competition around piston? I'm sure Mozilla has the funds. This is what I mean by make it fun and make a game framework. I'm sure that other than piston you could find other Rust game frameworks but i'm sure you can't find one that's as accepted as PyGame or LOVE, and then, Cocos2d-x C++ port is being pitched "for performance", and why can't that be Rust?

by jondot 10y ago

kibwen 10y ago

Since you mentioned the demoscene, I think you may enjoy this fantastic 56kb demo written in Rust: https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/597hhv/logicoma_elysian_1st_place_trsac_2016_pc_64kb/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/597hhv/logicoma_elysi... :)

jondot 10y ago
Wow! fantastic!

steveklabnik 10y ago

Hey there! That was a fun conf :) I've said "Rust has a lack of whimsy" several times recently, we'll see what we can do :)

jamesmunns 10y ago

Hey Jon, Not Steve here, but I was wondering if you were being sarcastic here: > Make rust playful. Why am I asking if you're being sarcastic? > Make a game framework http://www.piston.rs/ http://www.piston.rs/ > Make it build on a mobile device https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/building-an-ios-app-in-rust-part-1/ https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/building-an-ios-app-in-rus... > Make it build on a Pi... without diarrhea curl https://sh.rustup.rs -sSf | sh > Make it build for the Arduino (An ARM based Arduino, AVR [which powers the original Arduinos] support is being worked on now) https://github.com/jamesmunns/teensy3-rs https://github.com/jamesmunns/teensy3-rs > Cross compile it to Javascript https://blog.rust-lang.org/2016/12/22/Rust-1.14.html https://blog.rust-lang.org/2016/12/22/Rust-1.14.html

jondot 10y ago
I'm not being sarcastic at all, and after reading my post again I can't see how it can be read that way. My apologies if my english isn't that good. I'm familiar with piston, and by "making it build on a Pi" - my mistake, I meant make it cross-compile for a Pi. The rest of your examples are quite "it can be done" and not it "should be done". The only thing I can say is - why not organize a game competition around piston? I'm sure Mozilla has the funds. This is what I mean by make it fun and make a game framework. I'm sure that other than piston you could find other Rust game frameworks but i'm sure you can't find one that's as accepted as PyGame or LOVE, and then, Cocos2d-x C++ port is being pitched "for performance", and why can't that be Rust?