5 ms·

> One is the idea of a percentage I've always found this odd too. Say for a special occasion I decide to go to a high end steakhouse... mid-range bottle of win

by throwaway2016a 10y ago

> One is the idea of a percentage I've always found this odd too. Say for a special occasion I decide to go to a high end steakhouse... mid-range bottle of wine, two nice steaks, a'la cart sides, appetizer, and desert we're at $500. That's $100 at 20%. Did that person really do more work than the person I tipped $10 at Chili's (an american casual family restaurant)? > Another inconsistency is where to tip I usually end up spending 20 minutes Googling "what to tip _______" before going anywhere or getting an deliveries.

ydt 10y ago
Here's the thing. I worked in the restaurant business in various capacities all through college. As a cash transaction, it will come as no surprise that a lot of tips go unreported as income. From time to time the IRS will decide the reported income from a restaurant seems low and audit the staff. It was generally understood that if you had reported 10% of your sales as a server/bartender as tip income you'd be ok. If not you were in trouble (and this happened to people I know). So if you tip $20 on a $500 dollar tab because it's the same amount of work as $100 dollar tab. your server will most likely still claim $50 in income and be at about break even once the taxes are paid on it.
- bkor 10y ago
  This still doesn't explain why it should be a percentage other than that everyone assumes a percentage.
  - ydt 10y ago
    You're right. I didn't say it did. I was just trying to give some insight into how it works for people that have maybe never worked for tips. I am of two minds about tipping. As a customer it would be nice if these jobs provided a decent base pay + benefits and everything was just priced into the meal. On the other hand I would have hated this when I worked for tips, as I hustled and provided good service which allowed me to make a lot more than co-workers who didn't.
    - nommm-nommm 10y ago
      >hustled This word is telling. If I go out to dinner I'd really prefer to not be hustled. hus·tle ˈhəsəl/ verb 1. force (someone) to move hurriedly or unceremoniously in a specified direction. 2. North Americaninformal obtain by forceful action or persuasion. 3. North Americaninformal engage in prostitution.
- ensignavenger 10y ago
  How would they be "in trouble"? You mean the IRS is going to ask them scary questions? Or does the IRS really go around fining people with no more evidence than "Well, we think that maybe you earned more in tips than you reported, because someone else reported that they earned more..." Any CPAs or tax attorneys care to share their experiences? I can't see how the latter could be legal.
jackptfh 10y ago
Yes, on average the server at the high end restaurant did substantially more work, and they performed it more expertly. they were better able to answer questions and offer suggestions (including off-menu changes that might help you). They timed your meal for your enjoyment rather than for turnover. They made sure you had fresh silverware, a clean table, and a full glass. They coordinated your bar, wine, and food orders so appropriate items were presented at the appropriate time. They verified the kitchen gave them correct dishes before they brought them to you. They devoted a lot of energy into ensuring that a small number of guests have a great experience. They're able to earn decent livings because they are at the top of their field. The folks at chili's are granted no autonomy. Their goal is to turn the table quickly, with the least effort; and to do this with the least skilled staff. They work hard, but their goal is to serve a large number of guests with a tolerable experience, not a great one. Yes, they bring food and drink, but the focus is on throughput, not on quality. It's similar to the difference between code written by a low bid contractor versus a talented on-site team. If you want anything unusual or if you care about quality and the experience, you'll greatly prefer the on site staff. Even if some execs might not understand why you can't offshore 100% of the work.
- nolite 10y ago
  All of these things you describe, fall under what I consider "their job"
  - rlanday 10y ago
    Your point being?
  - jghn 10y ago
    and part of the compensation package associated with "their job" is tipping.
  - anamoulous 10y ago
    So assume that if they (and the back of the house, in the event of tip pooling) were paid a meaningful base wage it would have cost 20% more for the experience of dining at the restaurant. Do a calculation and add that to the check, because that's what you would be paying if we didn't have tip culture.
saint_fiasco 10y ago
It could be an incentive. Some customers are more valuable than others and using percentages means the employees will be extra nice to high-value customers and not waste too much time on the low-value customers. Of course they should be nice to everyone, but if it is a busy day and they have to choose, the restaurant owners would prefer that they prioritize the ones who spend more.

ydt 10y ago

Here's the thing. I worked in the restaurant business in various capacities all through college. As a cash transaction, it will come as no surprise that a lot of tips go unreported as income. From time to time the IRS will decide the reported income from a restaurant seems low and audit the staff. It was generally understood that if you had reported 10% of your sales as a server/bartender as tip income you'd be ok. If not you were in trouble (and this happened to people I know). So if you tip $20 on a $500 dollar tab because it's the same amount of work as $100 dollar tab. your server will most likely still claim $50 in income and be at about break even once the taxes are paid on it.

bkor 10y ago
This still doesn't explain why it should be a percentage other than that everyone assumes a percentage.
- ydt 10y ago
  You're right. I didn't say it did. I was just trying to give some insight into how it works for people that have maybe never worked for tips. I am of two minds about tipping. As a customer it would be nice if these jobs provided a decent base pay + benefits and everything was just priced into the meal. On the other hand I would have hated this when I worked for tips, as I hustled and provided good service which allowed me to make a lot more than co-workers who didn't.
  - nommm-nommm 10y ago
    >hustled This word is telling. If I go out to dinner I'd really prefer to not be hustled. hus·tle ˈhəsəl/ verb 1. force (someone) to move hurriedly or unceremoniously in a specified direction. 2. North Americaninformal obtain by forceful action or persuasion. 3. North Americaninformal engage in prostitution.
ensignavenger 10y ago
How would they be "in trouble"? You mean the IRS is going to ask them scary questions? Or does the IRS really go around fining people with no more evidence than "Well, we think that maybe you earned more in tips than you reported, because someone else reported that they earned more..." Any CPAs or tax attorneys care to share their experiences? I can't see how the latter could be legal.

jackptfh 10y ago

Yes, on average the server at the high end restaurant did substantially more work, and they performed it more expertly. they were better able to answer questions and offer suggestions (including off-menu changes that might help you). They timed your meal for your enjoyment rather than for turnover. They made sure you had fresh silverware, a clean table, and a full glass. They coordinated your bar, wine, and food orders so appropriate items were presented at the appropriate time. They verified the kitchen gave them correct dishes before they brought them to you. They devoted a lot of energy into ensuring that a small number of guests have a great experience. They're able to earn decent livings because they are at the top of their field. The folks at chili's are granted no autonomy. Their goal is to turn the table quickly, with the least effort; and to do this with the least skilled staff. They work hard, but their goal is to serve a large number of guests with a tolerable experience, not a great one. Yes, they bring food and drink, but the focus is on throughput, not on quality. It's similar to the difference between code written by a low bid contractor versus a talented on-site team. If you want anything unusual or if you care about quality and the experience, you'll greatly prefer the on site staff. Even if some execs might not understand why you can't offshore 100% of the work.

nolite 10y ago
All of these things you describe, fall under what I consider "their job"
- rlanday 10y ago
  Your point being?
- jghn 10y ago
  and part of the compensation package associated with "their job" is tipping.
- anamoulous 10y ago
  So assume that if they (and the back of the house, in the event of tip pooling) were paid a meaningful base wage it would have cost 20% more for the experience of dining at the restaurant. Do a calculation and add that to the check, because that's what you would be paying if we didn't have tip culture.

saint_fiasco 10y ago

It could be an incentive. Some customers are more valuable than others and using percentages means the employees will be extra nice to high-value customers and not waste too much time on the low-value customers. Of course they should be nice to everyone, but if it is a busy day and they have to choose, the restaurant owners would prefer that they prioritize the ones who spend more.