5 ms·

There's no bombshell here. The section on "foreign influence" is still heavily redacted -- leaving literally just one and half sentences to read, in a sea of b

There's no bombshell here. The section on "foreign influence" is still heavily redacted -- leaving literally just one and half sentences to read, in a sea of black. And both of the assertions it makes in those 1.5 sentences are quite vague: "Snowden has had, and continues to have, contact with Russian intelligence services" (with no specifics). Yes, there are probably plants among the various Russian nationals he deals with. So what? (They make it sound like he's holding regular briefings with these people in a mahogany-paneled room somewhere). "And in June 2016, [a Russian PM] asserted that 'Snowden did share intelligence' with his government." (That's not what the Russian PM, Frantz Klintsevich said -- and it's dishonest of the IC to assert otherwise). Also, this non-revelation was already made when the initial version of this problematic report was first published over the summer. The overall weakness of these statements suggest that even now -- 3+ years after being stranded in Moscow, as a more or less direct result of the Obama administration's yanking his passport -- they still don't have anything to nail the guy with.

0xcde4c3db 10y ago
> Yes, there are probably plants among the various Russian nationals he deals with. That's not even claiming that the contact in question was initiated or is sustained by Snowden, rather than being a result of Russian intelligence investigating him.
dogma1138 10y ago
There is no chance that the Russians let him in without debriefing him. If and what information was handed over to them is another thing. Likely that they got the same package that the reporters got plus maybe some documents related specifically to Russia that weren't released.
- kafkaesq 10y ago
  You can speculate about what went on after his arrival in Moscow, all you want. The point is that the Committee's report (in its current version) provides precisely zero information about what happened.
  - _audakel 10y ago
    exactly. if something had actually happend, as in they had hard evidence of a specific incident, they would broadcast that all over to prove that he is a criminal. as far as i know, this has not happend yet.
    - Proof 10y ago
      Nor it will ever happen because he arrived in Russia without possession of any documents. They had had already been taken by Laura Poitres and Glenn Greenwald. As many of the commentators have already stated, they should either exonerate him(not likely) or figure out a way to brand him a peadofile. My guess is; if they were to label him outright then everybody would call the government out and they maybe put in a awkward position of vindicating him. Will be interesting to see what 2017 brings.
      - mSparks 10y ago
        Not sure where you're getting that from. certainly not an official source. http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/National/article1568673.ece http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/National/ar... ->RUSSIA and China have cracked the top-secret cache of files stolen by the fugitive US whistleblower Edward Snowden, forcing MI6 to pull agents out of live operations in hostile countries, according to senior officials in Downing Street, the Home Office and the security services.
        mSparks 10y ago
        and for those to young to remember. Rewson, SAFE, Waihopai, INFOSEC, ASPIC, MI6, Information Security, SAI, Information Warfare, IW, IS, Privacy, Information Terrorism, Terrorism Defensive Information, Defense Information Warfare, Offensive Information, Offensive Information Warfare, The Artful Dodger, NAIA, SAPM, ASU, ASTS, National Information Infrastructure, InfoSec, SAO, Reno, Compsec, JICS, Computer Terrorism, Firewalls, Secure Internet Connections, RSP, ISS, JDF, Ermes, Passwords, NAAP, DefCon V, RSO, Hackers, Encryption, ASWS, CUN, CISU, CUSI, M.A.R.E., MARE, UFO, IFO, Pacini, Angela, Espionage, USDOJ, NSA, CIA, S/Key, SSL, FBI, Secert Service, USSS, Defcon, Military, White House, Undercover, NCCS, Mayfly, PGP, SALDV, PEM, resta, RSA, Perl-RSA, MSNBC, bet, AOL, AOL TOS, CIS, CBOT, AIMSX, STARLAN, 3B2, BITNET, SAMU, COSMOS, DATTA, Furbys, E911, FCIC, HTCIA, IACIS, UT/RUS, JANET, ram, JICC, ReMOB, LEETAC, etc etc.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- UnoriginalGuy 10y ago
  According to Snowden he didn't even have access to the information and was travelling via Russia to a southern american country when the US mistakenly pulled his passport (their original plan was to let him leave Russia and then force his aircraft to land over a friendly nation, but disorganisation cause the passport to get pulled too soon leaving him stranded in Russia). To be honest I don't find your speculation particularly in line with the facts that we know. And it is definitely the least generous speculation you could make (i.e. makes Snowden look as bad as possible).
- imron 10y ago
  How? He specifically didn't have that information on him when he was stranded there.
- jccc 10y ago
  I don't know what page of the report Snowden is referring to, but he says the report itself "admits I purged and abandoned hard drives rather than risk bringing them through Russia. Glad it's settled." https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/811983058790445057 https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/811983058790445057
- nabla9 10y ago
  Snowen maintains and he brought nothing to Russia. He gave all the data for journalists in Hong Kong. He encrypted the documents in such a way that even he no longer has access to them, and that he did this before he became stranded in Russia.
- varjag 10y ago
  Exactly. One can say that FSB/FSK hasn't got any more in debriefing than they would just from reading the newspapers. You can argue that the political value of Snowden for Putin far exceeded direct intelligence gains. However saying that he wasn't debriefed is extremely naive. It's simply not how it works in Russia.
  - phicoh 10y ago
    The funny thing is, Snowden had no intention of going to Russia. So here you have a contractor who worked for the CIA and the NSA, and is clever enough to get a huge collection of documents out of the NSA and fly to Hong-Kong without anybody noticing. And then you force that guy to go to Russia and be debriefed there. Monumentally stupid doesn't even begin to describe that strategy.
wheelerwj 10y ago
> they still don't have anything to nail the guy with. And they have now resorted to an attempt at slander with a familiar story-line. "He was a disgruntled employee... He was a loner who didn't get along with his supervisors..." Blah, blah, blah. Just go for the hat trick, call him a pedophile, and let's all go home.
- kbart 10y ago
  "call him a pedophile, and let's all go home." You made my day sir. Back on serious side, I find it surprising, that so few (i.e. compared to Assange) shit is being poured over Snowden. It makes me wonder if he still has something hidden in a pocket that somebody back home afraids is going to be made public.
  - toyg 10y ago
    > so few (i.e. compared to Assange) Assange, for all his merits, is fundamentally a narcissist who loved the spotlight - he travelled a lot, attended conferences, socialized and so on. Nothing against that, I'm as guilty of self-centering as the next man, but inevitably that sort of behaviour will produce bad interactions with this or that person, which can then be used in personal attacks. Snowden is more level-headed. He was a regular joe who took his job more seriously than anyone else around him. I know a few guys like him, they are the sort of people you can't "nail" because they just don't do anything that is not well-thought-over in advance, so they have nothing to be ashamed of, ever.
    - Waterluvian 10y ago
      Snowden has always come off to me as a very what you see is what you get kind of person. Largely because he seems so dull (because he's not out drumming up attention, I suppose).
  - danieltillett 10y ago
    There is a big difference which is Assange is still dangerous in the future while Snowden is history. Snowden is revenge while Assange is damage control.
pulse7 10y ago
Not only did Showden "share intelligence with Russian government", he shared it with everyone on the planet... And this is a big difference!
- mSparks 10y ago
  In the good old days they just called them defectors. Rather than whistleblowers that didn't blow any whistles. Political Correctness gone mad i tell ya. As for "shared it with everyone on the planet." - really, where exactly can i download the 1.5 million highly classified US documents he has shared with the FSB?

0xcde4c3db 10y ago

> Yes, there are probably plants among the various Russian nationals he deals with. That's not even claiming that the contact in question was initiated or is sustained by Snowden, rather than being a result of Russian intelligence investigating him.

dogma1138 10y ago

There is no chance that the Russians let him in without debriefing him. If and what information was handed over to them is another thing. Likely that they got the same package that the reporters got plus maybe some documents related specifically to Russia that weren't released.

kafkaesq 10y ago
You can speculate about what went on after his arrival in Moscow, all you want. The point is that the Committee's report (in its current version) provides precisely zero information about what happened.
- _audakel 10y ago
  exactly. if something had actually happend, as in they had hard evidence of a specific incident, they would broadcast that all over to prove that he is a criminal. as far as i know, this has not happend yet.
  - Proof 10y ago
    Nor it will ever happen because he arrived in Russia without possession of any documents. They had had already been taken by Laura Poitres and Glenn Greenwald. As many of the commentators have already stated, they should either exonerate him(not likely) or figure out a way to brand him a peadofile. My guess is; if they were to label him outright then everybody would call the government out and they maybe put in a awkward position of vindicating him. Will be interesting to see what 2017 brings.
    - mSparks 10y ago
      Not sure where you're getting that from. certainly not an official source. http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/National/article1568673.ece http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/National/ar... ->RUSSIA and China have cracked the top-secret cache of files stolen by the fugitive US whistleblower Edward Snowden, forcing MI6 to pull agents out of live operations in hostile countries, according to senior officials in Downing Street, the Home Office and the security services.
      - mSparks 10y ago
        and for those to young to remember. Rewson, SAFE, Waihopai, INFOSEC, ASPIC, MI6, Information Security, SAI, Information Warfare, IW, IS, Privacy, Information Terrorism, Terrorism Defensive Information, Defense Information Warfare, Offensive Information, Offensive Information Warfare, The Artful Dodger, NAIA, SAPM, ASU, ASTS, National Information Infrastructure, InfoSec, SAO, Reno, Compsec, JICS, Computer Terrorism, Firewalls, Secure Internet Connections, RSP, ISS, JDF, Ermes, Passwords, NAAP, DefCon V, RSO, Hackers, Encryption, ASWS, CUN, CISU, CUSI, M.A.R.E., MARE, UFO, IFO, Pacini, Angela, Espionage, USDOJ, NSA, CIA, S/Key, SSL, FBI, Secert Service, USSS, Defcon, Military, White House, Undercover, NCCS, Mayfly, PGP, SALDV, PEM, resta, RSA, Perl-RSA, MSNBC, bet, AOL, AOL TOS, CIS, CBOT, AIMSX, STARLAN, 3B2, BITNET, SAMU, COSMOS, DATTA, Furbys, E911, FCIC, HTCIA, IACIS, UT/RUS, JANET, ram, JICC, ReMOB, LEETAC, etc etc.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
UnoriginalGuy 10y ago
According to Snowden he didn't even have access to the information and was travelling via Russia to a southern american country when the US mistakenly pulled his passport (their original plan was to let him leave Russia and then force his aircraft to land over a friendly nation, but disorganisation cause the passport to get pulled too soon leaving him stranded in Russia). To be honest I don't find your speculation particularly in line with the facts that we know. And it is definitely the least generous speculation you could make (i.e. makes Snowden look as bad as possible).
imron 10y ago
How? He specifically didn't have that information on him when he was stranded there.
jccc 10y ago
I don't know what page of the report Snowden is referring to, but he says the report itself "admits I purged and abandoned hard drives rather than risk bringing them through Russia. Glad it's settled." https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/811983058790445057 https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/811983058790445057
nabla9 10y ago
Snowen maintains and he brought nothing to Russia. He gave all the data for journalists in Hong Kong. He encrypted the documents in such a way that even he no longer has access to them, and that he did this before he became stranded in Russia.
varjag 10y ago
Exactly. One can say that FSB/FSK hasn't got any more in debriefing than they would just from reading the newspapers. You can argue that the political value of Snowden for Putin far exceeded direct intelligence gains. However saying that he wasn't debriefed is extremely naive. It's simply not how it works in Russia.
- phicoh 10y ago
  The funny thing is, Snowden had no intention of going to Russia. So here you have a contractor who worked for the CIA and the NSA, and is clever enough to get a huge collection of documents out of the NSA and fly to Hong-Kong without anybody noticing. And then you force that guy to go to Russia and be debriefed there. Monumentally stupid doesn't even begin to describe that strategy.

wheelerwj 10y ago

> they still don't have anything to nail the guy with. And they have now resorted to an attempt at slander with a familiar story-line. "He was a disgruntled employee... He was a loner who didn't get along with his supervisors..." Blah, blah, blah. Just go for the hat trick, call him a pedophile, and let's all go home.

kbart 10y ago
"call him a pedophile, and let's all go home." You made my day sir. Back on serious side, I find it surprising, that so few (i.e. compared to Assange) shit is being poured over Snowden. It makes me wonder if he still has something hidden in a pocket that somebody back home afraids is going to be made public.
- toyg 10y ago
  > so few (i.e. compared to Assange) Assange, for all his merits, is fundamentally a narcissist who loved the spotlight - he travelled a lot, attended conferences, socialized and so on. Nothing against that, I'm as guilty of self-centering as the next man, but inevitably that sort of behaviour will produce bad interactions with this or that person, which can then be used in personal attacks. Snowden is more level-headed. He was a regular joe who took his job more seriously than anyone else around him. I know a few guys like him, they are the sort of people you can't "nail" because they just don't do anything that is not well-thought-over in advance, so they have nothing to be ashamed of, ever.
  - Waterluvian 10y ago
    Snowden has always come off to me as a very what you see is what you get kind of person. Largely because he seems so dull (because he's not out drumming up attention, I suppose).
- danieltillett 10y ago
  There is a big difference which is Assange is still dangerous in the future while Snowden is history. Snowden is revenge while Assange is damage control.

pulse7 10y ago

Not only did Showden "share intelligence with Russian government", he shared it with everyone on the planet... And this is a big difference!

mSparks 10y ago
In the good old days they just called them defectors. Rather than whistleblowers that didn't blow any whistles. Political Correctness gone mad i tell ya. As for "shared it with everyone on the planet." - really, where exactly can i download the 1.5 million highly classified US documents he has shared with the FSB?