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Interesting, it seems like they're trying to protect Amazon. I can understand people moving from Amazon to Aliexpress though. When I'm looking for stuff on Ama

Interesting, it seems like they're trying to protect Amazon. I can understand people moving from Amazon to Aliexpress though. When I'm looking for stuff on Amazon, it is often difficult to find out whether they ship to my country and if so, how much the delivery costs. Often, great deals from the US don't ship to Europe. On Aliexpress, everything ships everywhere. You type in you country and currency and have full information.

tyingq 10y ago
The article says it's only the Taobao site.
pen2l 10y ago
Huh, is Alibaba really very comparable to Amazon for the everyday consumer? I was under the impression that they weren't exactly targeting the same consumers. I thought Alibaba was moreso for resellers, folks who buy in large quantities and such to sell it themselves later. Would you recommend that I, an American, start looking at Alibaba as an Amazon alternative for everyday things?
- tyingq 10y ago
  Their aliexpress.com site is targeted at end consumers, lower quantities, etc.
- CapitalistCartr 10y ago
  I do. My wife buys fabric there literally 1/5 to 1/10 the price at the local store. Its only practical for some things, though.
  - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
    A friend of mine has started buying cotton swabs (Q-tips) from AliExpress, because it's 1/10th the price at local grocery stores. I also recently learned that we have no cheap generic paracetamol over here, because the pharma guys did a consumer study and found people preferred the $8/packet ones to the $1/packet ones, even though they contain the exact same ingredients, as the latter were perceived as low quality/dodgy.
- robert_foss 10y ago
  AliExpress is for consumers. Taobao and Alibaba sell more things in bulk.
- the_duke 10y ago
  Alibaba.com is for retailers. taobao is only targeting China. aliexpress.com is an international and consumer facing. Expect considerably cheaper prices, and delivery times from 2-6 weeks.
  - rconti 10y ago
    Or, as I call it, AliEventually.
    - umanwizard 10y ago
      Well yeah, the stuff is probably being sent over on a container ship. Have you ever tried shipping something by airmail from a faraway country to the US? It would cost way more than the value of the actual product.
      - kogepathic 10y ago
        > It would cost way more than the value of the actual product. Shipping from China is already subsidized by postal rates from the rest of the developed world[0]. Shipping in a container on a boat isn't free, and probably costs more than you pay now when buying something from China: "As part of this reform process, China will be transitioned in 2016 into a category for more developed nations, who generally pay higher terminal dues." [0] http://fortune.com/2015/03/11/united-nations-subsidy-chinese-shipping http://fortune.com/2015/03/11/united-nations-subsidy-chinese...
        vacri 10y ago
        Shipping in a container isn't free, but it's very very cheap. Earlier in the year, someone here on HN mentioned that if you have stuff to store, it's cheaper to put it in a shipping container and have it sail the seas, than it is to put in a local storage warehouse. That is, space on ships is cheaper than space in buildings. Or another anecdote: we grow oranges here in my home state of Victoria, Australia. However, oranges grown in Brazil, flash-frozen, and shipped across the pacific are moderately cheaper than the local ones. Of course, they taste like cardboard, but they have sailed almost halfway around the earth.
- Bedon292 10y ago
  If you are willing to wait for the shipping they are great. If something sells for $25 on amazon you might find it for $6 on Alibaba but with minimum quantities which are not consumer friendly, plus bulk shipping. Then on Aliexpress, the consumer level one, you might find the same thing for $15 for each one shipped. Source: Christmas shopping. Ended up having to go with Amazon because of shipping times and waiting too late, but its worth the wait for some things.
  - Declanomous 10y ago
    One thing to point out: the more commoditized something is, the better it is to buy on Aliexpress. If you've ever seen the same thing sold by two different manufacturers, that's a sure sign you can buy it on aliexpress for a fraction of the price. The simpler the item, the better. Consumer items I've bought that have turned out to be nearly identical to what I would have bought in the US: bike tools and parts (wire ferrules, valve wrenches, chain whips, cassette tools, wear indicators) inexpensive power bricks, earphones, small hand tools (bit sets, secure screwdrivers, pin vices, wire strippers and diagonal cutters), zip ties, etc. I've also bought a load of electronics (components, microcontrollers, and assembled items). This is a little difficult, because they are generally cut corners. This is terrible for batteries, not great for power supplies, and generally is imperceptible for LEDs. If you need a weird adapter or jack, this is definitely the place to find it. Looking for stuff can be hard though, because chinese names for things aren't always the same as English ones. I don't bother with anything that is less than 25% cheaper from China, unless it is a better product or comes directly from the manufacturer (there are some company stores on Aliexpress). I basically assume I'm self-insuring for defective products. I have never been screwed on a claim, but I have received a lot of products that are just poor quality. It is pretty much the perfect place to buy white elephant gifts though. I ordered a ton of 2x2 rubik's cubes last year (and a few larger ones) and gave them to all my friends. I'd say probably a quarter arrived totally destroyed, since most were just mailed in cheap padded envelopes and they are pretty fragile, but they were so cheap I didn't care. The entertainment value was definitely worth it, a 2x2 cube is much harder to solve than it looks, and I'm pretty sure some of my friends still haven't forgiven me for that gift. Anyways, you can buy most of this stuff on Amazon or Ebay with a modest mark-up. It will be listed as "fulfilled from China" or something similar. It's a good option if you are worried about fraud, since you'll be dealing with eBay/Amazon customer service, rather than Aliexpress. I would recommend buying something cheap off AE just to give it a shot though.
- paganel 10y ago
  > Huh, is Alibaba really very comparable to Amazon for the everyday consumer I live in Romania and around these parts Aliexpress already has a big presence among your "everyday consumer". I visit the Postal office closest to my workplace every week and during the last or so year I've started seeing more and more young people (under 25, mostly women) who had come to collect the stuff they had ordered from China (most probably from Aliexpress). Around these parts Amazon is only known and partially used for purchasing books.
  - Freak_NL 10y ago
    I've noticed that a lot of the feedback on AliExpress comes from Russia, Eastern European countries, and the assorted former Soviet Union satellite states. Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? From what I can tell AliExpress is mostly popular as a cheap source of (low voltage) electrical components here in The Netherlands. People buy clothing from local web shops (or traditional brick and mortar shops) due to speed, quality, and friendly returns policies though.
    - paganel 10y ago
      > Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? I don't think it's because of the lack of local web shop, at least not in Romania's case. I think it's only a question of costs, it seems that for certain items whatever comes from China is that much less expensive compared to what's available locally, even accounting for the long-ish waiting times and the customs duty.
    - baybal2 10y ago
      >I've noticed that a lot of the feedback on AliExpress comes from Russia, Eastern European countries, and the assorted former Soviet Union satellite states. Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? 1. All those ex-commie nations have high double digit VAT and import tarifs. 2. Western brands do not contest for that market 3. Those guys had no other choice other than buying Chinese goods since the fall of the Soviet bloc. What has changed now is that they can buy from China without middlemen
- nomercy400 10y ago
  Try Aliexpress. That one is for consumers. Resellers go to Alibaba. And Taobao is yet another marketplace, but focussed on China. And have a look around for a month. Bookmark Aliexpress, and every time you look something up on Amazon, see if you can find a comparable product on Aliexpress.
jarboot 10y ago
As someone younger on HN, I see a lot of people my age buying stuff from Taobao even though it is specifically for Chinese people. There's a lot of hype around counterfeit luxury clothing and shoes ('reps' of nike, adidas, supreme, etc.) because they are extremely cheap on Chinese sites but look close (and sometimes '1:1') to the real thing. They use agents that speak Chinese and live in China that can order what the consumer wants on Taobao and then ship it to them in the west independently. You can see some examples and discussion on /r/fashionreps. Even beyond that, plenty of sports fans I know buy jerseys from Alibaba because the official ones are way too expensive for young people in the Midwest. I also personally know a guy that makes money using a python bot to get shoes when they release and resell them with a markup when they're sold out. It might be more difficult to use some of these sites, but for many the savings are worth the inconvenience of navigating foreign sites, and there's a big market for the goods it sells.
- mistermann 10y ago
  Thanks for that info I am going to look into this, very interesting!
- iamatworknow 10y ago
  >Even beyond that, plenty of sports fans I know buy jerseys from Alibaba because the official ones are way too expensive for young people in the Midwest. Let's just say someone I know is a big NBA fan, and he purchased 4 jerseys off of Aliexpress for the price of one authentic jersey, with no discernable difference in quality or production, even while wearing one to a game and comparing the stitching to those on the rack in the gift shop. I don't think jerseys are listed on Aliexpress anymore, though. At least not the last time I looked.
- dghughes 10y ago
  And then you find out that fire retardant in clothing is an actual thing and necessary. The clothing is cheap for a reason not just licensing costs.
kbart 10y ago
"When I'm looking for stuff on Amazon, it is often difficult to find out whether they ship to my country and if so, how much the delivery costs. Often, great deals from the US don't ship to Europe. " Hundred times yes! I can buy same thing from Aliexpress or Gearbest cheaper than Amazon and get it shipped for free or negligible cost to my doorstep. Also, I'm sure that what I see there, I can get with no hassle. Amazon search sucks and finding shipping information sucks even more. What's the rationale behind hiding a shipping fee and if certain item ships to my country at all? My current places to go for online shopping: Aliexpress > Gearbest > Ebay > Amazon.

tyingq 10y ago

The article says it's only the Taobao site.

pen2l 10y ago

Huh, is Alibaba really very comparable to Amazon for the everyday consumer? I was under the impression that they weren't exactly targeting the same consumers. I thought Alibaba was moreso for resellers, folks who buy in large quantities and such to sell it themselves later. Would you recommend that I, an American, start looking at Alibaba as an Amazon alternative for everyday things?

tyingq 10y ago
Their aliexpress.com site is targeted at end consumers, lower quantities, etc.
CapitalistCartr 10y ago
I do. My wife buys fabric there literally 1/5 to 1/10 the price at the local store. Its only practical for some things, though.
- semi-extrinsic 10y ago
  A friend of mine has started buying cotton swabs (Q-tips) from AliExpress, because it's 1/10th the price at local grocery stores. I also recently learned that we have no cheap generic paracetamol over here, because the pharma guys did a consumer study and found people preferred the $8/packet ones to the $1/packet ones, even though they contain the exact same ingredients, as the latter were perceived as low quality/dodgy.
robert_foss 10y ago
AliExpress is for consumers. Taobao and Alibaba sell more things in bulk.
the_duke 10y ago
Alibaba.com is for retailers. taobao is only targeting China. aliexpress.com is an international and consumer facing. Expect considerably cheaper prices, and delivery times from 2-6 weeks.
- rconti 10y ago
  Or, as I call it, AliEventually.
  - umanwizard 10y ago
    Well yeah, the stuff is probably being sent over on a container ship. Have you ever tried shipping something by airmail from a faraway country to the US? It would cost way more than the value of the actual product.
    - kogepathic 10y ago
      > It would cost way more than the value of the actual product. Shipping from China is already subsidized by postal rates from the rest of the developed world[0]. Shipping in a container on a boat isn't free, and probably costs more than you pay now when buying something from China: "As part of this reform process, China will be transitioned in 2016 into a category for more developed nations, who generally pay higher terminal dues." [0] http://fortune.com/2015/03/11/united-nations-subsidy-chinese-shipping http://fortune.com/2015/03/11/united-nations-subsidy-chinese...
      - vacri 10y ago
        Shipping in a container isn't free, but it's very very cheap. Earlier in the year, someone here on HN mentioned that if you have stuff to store, it's cheaper to put it in a shipping container and have it sail the seas, than it is to put in a local storage warehouse. That is, space on ships is cheaper than space in buildings. Or another anecdote: we grow oranges here in my home state of Victoria, Australia. However, oranges grown in Brazil, flash-frozen, and shipped across the pacific are moderately cheaper than the local ones. Of course, they taste like cardboard, but they have sailed almost halfway around the earth.
Bedon292 10y ago
If you are willing to wait for the shipping they are great. If something sells for $25 on amazon you might find it for $6 on Alibaba but with minimum quantities which are not consumer friendly, plus bulk shipping. Then on Aliexpress, the consumer level one, you might find the same thing for $15 for each one shipped. Source: Christmas shopping. Ended up having to go with Amazon because of shipping times and waiting too late, but its worth the wait for some things.
- Declanomous 10y ago
  One thing to point out: the more commoditized something is, the better it is to buy on Aliexpress. If you've ever seen the same thing sold by two different manufacturers, that's a sure sign you can buy it on aliexpress for a fraction of the price. The simpler the item, the better. Consumer items I've bought that have turned out to be nearly identical to what I would have bought in the US: bike tools and parts (wire ferrules, valve wrenches, chain whips, cassette tools, wear indicators) inexpensive power bricks, earphones, small hand tools (bit sets, secure screwdrivers, pin vices, wire strippers and diagonal cutters), zip ties, etc. I've also bought a load of electronics (components, microcontrollers, and assembled items). This is a little difficult, because they are generally cut corners. This is terrible for batteries, not great for power supplies, and generally is imperceptible for LEDs. If you need a weird adapter or jack, this is definitely the place to find it. Looking for stuff can be hard though, because chinese names for things aren't always the same as English ones. I don't bother with anything that is less than 25% cheaper from China, unless it is a better product or comes directly from the manufacturer (there are some company stores on Aliexpress). I basically assume I'm self-insuring for defective products. I have never been screwed on a claim, but I have received a lot of products that are just poor quality. It is pretty much the perfect place to buy white elephant gifts though. I ordered a ton of 2x2 rubik's cubes last year (and a few larger ones) and gave them to all my friends. I'd say probably a quarter arrived totally destroyed, since most were just mailed in cheap padded envelopes and they are pretty fragile, but they were so cheap I didn't care. The entertainment value was definitely worth it, a 2x2 cube is much harder to solve than it looks, and I'm pretty sure some of my friends still haven't forgiven me for that gift. Anyways, you can buy most of this stuff on Amazon or Ebay with a modest mark-up. It will be listed as "fulfilled from China" or something similar. It's a good option if you are worried about fraud, since you'll be dealing with eBay/Amazon customer service, rather than Aliexpress. I would recommend buying something cheap off AE just to give it a shot though.
paganel 10y ago
> Huh, is Alibaba really very comparable to Amazon for the everyday consumer I live in Romania and around these parts Aliexpress already has a big presence among your "everyday consumer". I visit the Postal office closest to my workplace every week and during the last or so year I've started seeing more and more young people (under 25, mostly women) who had come to collect the stuff they had ordered from China (most probably from Aliexpress). Around these parts Amazon is only known and partially used for purchasing books.
- Freak_NL 10y ago
  I've noticed that a lot of the feedback on AliExpress comes from Russia, Eastern European countries, and the assorted former Soviet Union satellite states. Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? From what I can tell AliExpress is mostly popular as a cheap source of (low voltage) electrical components here in The Netherlands. People buy clothing from local web shops (or traditional brick and mortar shops) due to speed, quality, and friendly returns policies though.
  - paganel 10y ago
    > Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? I don't think it's because of the lack of local web shop, at least not in Romania's case. I think it's only a question of costs, it seems that for certain items whatever comes from China is that much less expensive compared to what's available locally, even accounting for the long-ish waiting times and the customs duty.
  - baybal2 10y ago
    >I've noticed that a lot of the feedback on AliExpress comes from Russia, Eastern European countries, and the assorted former Soviet Union satellite states. Do you know why it is so popular there? Is it a lack of local web shops? 1. All those ex-commie nations have high double digit VAT and import tarifs. 2. Western brands do not contest for that market 3. Those guys had no other choice other than buying Chinese goods since the fall of the Soviet bloc. What has changed now is that they can buy from China without middlemen
nomercy400 10y ago
Try Aliexpress. That one is for consumers. Resellers go to Alibaba. And Taobao is yet another marketplace, but focussed on China. And have a look around for a month. Bookmark Aliexpress, and every time you look something up on Amazon, see if you can find a comparable product on Aliexpress.

jarboot 10y ago

As someone younger on HN, I see a lot of people my age buying stuff from Taobao even though it is specifically for Chinese people. There's a lot of hype around counterfeit luxury clothing and shoes ('reps' of nike, adidas, supreme, etc.) because they are extremely cheap on Chinese sites but look close (and sometimes '1:1') to the real thing. They use agents that speak Chinese and live in China that can order what the consumer wants on Taobao and then ship it to them in the west independently. You can see some examples and discussion on /r/fashionreps. Even beyond that, plenty of sports fans I know buy jerseys from Alibaba because the official ones are way too expensive for young people in the Midwest. I also personally know a guy that makes money using a python bot to get shoes when they release and resell them with a markup when they're sold out. It might be more difficult to use some of these sites, but for many the savings are worth the inconvenience of navigating foreign sites, and there's a big market for the goods it sells.

mistermann 10y ago
Thanks for that info I am going to look into this, very interesting!
iamatworknow 10y ago
>Even beyond that, plenty of sports fans I know buy jerseys from Alibaba because the official ones are way too expensive for young people in the Midwest. Let's just say someone I know is a big NBA fan, and he purchased 4 jerseys off of Aliexpress for the price of one authentic jersey, with no discernable difference in quality or production, even while wearing one to a game and comparing the stitching to those on the rack in the gift shop. I don't think jerseys are listed on Aliexpress anymore, though. At least not the last time I looked.
dghughes 10y ago
And then you find out that fire retardant in clothing is an actual thing and necessary. The clothing is cheap for a reason not just licensing costs.

kbart 10y ago

"When I'm looking for stuff on Amazon, it is often difficult to find out whether they ship to my country and if so, how much the delivery costs. Often, great deals from the US don't ship to Europe. " Hundred times yes! I can buy same thing from Aliexpress or Gearbest cheaper than Amazon and get it shipped for free or negligible cost to my doorstep. Also, I'm sure that what I see there, I can get with no hassle. Amazon search sucks and finding shipping information sucks even more. What's the rationale behind hiding a shipping fee and if certain item ships to my country at all? My current places to go for online shopping: Aliexpress > Gearbest > Ebay > Amazon.