Right, and that's the bit I'm not keen on. You either end up with a totally bespoke stack of libraries for each project, importing the same boilerplate for basi

Right, and that's the bit I'm not keen on. You either end up with a totally bespoke stack of libraries for each project, importing the same boilerplate for basic things like csrf-protection, or you have Luminus vomit a bunch of code on disk and then you have to pick through the project and get rid of the stuff you don't want. Then you realize that much of the code in the Luminus scaffold is managing state with mount (used to be with Component), and that's just a poor imitation of OTP from the Erlang world. I dunno, I've been there, done that, and wasn't so fond of it. Phoenix, by contrast, strikes me as the right balance of lightness and pragmatism, with first-class support for managing stateful resources in a sane way (OTP mofos), and all the right defaults so I can be productive from day-zero on a new project. [EDIT: to clarify, the Clojure way isn't _wrong_, and I do see the merit, but in my experience I prefer how things work out with Elixir and Erlang]