7 ms·

So, the author tries to run linux on apple hardware. then he goes on installing a GUI on a server, misunderstands the difference between rpm and yum, judges pac

by alkz 10y ago

So, the author tries to run linux on apple hardware. then he goes on installing a GUI on a server, misunderstands the difference between rpm and yum, judges package managers by command length. Also mistakes GB for TB This was a depressing read.

laumars 10y ago
It's weird because he uses GB correctly when talking about system memory but uses it incorrectly every time he refers to storage space. He also did a good job at the start of the article of acknowledging that Ubuntu gives a good desktop experience yet then goes on to rant about how bad Linux is in general after using one other, unrelated, distro. The whole article reads incredibly ignorantly which I wouldn't have expected given his credentials. I can only assume he approached the exercise with an axe to grind so continued his tasks in a unintentionally negative way. In my experience, if someone is impatient when using unfamiliar platforms and/or wants to find problems with it, then they will find a way to expose problems regardless of the platform.
Unman 10y ago
Yes. Doesn't seem like a reliable witness at all.
facorreia 10y ago
Also, aknowledges that Ubuntu does a good job polishing the user experience, and is "not impressed" with Linux when trying Fedora.
legulere 10y ago
Your comment is more depressing in my opinion, as it shows that it's still typical with the linux to blame users. Software is there to be used by humans, if you put the blame on your users, you have actually failed to design the software correctly. Why blame someone for wanting to install linux on apple hardware (which btw is often better supported than other hardware)? Why blame someone developing 3D acceleration for virtual machines for wanting to have a GUI on the server that contains test VMs? Why blame someone for being annoyed having to know the difference between 3 package manager programs? Why blame someone for talking about the usability of command line options, of which command length certainly is a part?
- alkz 10y ago
  What does apple do in order to help support their hardware on Linux? nothing. It's all coming from reverse engineering efforts, correct me if I'm wrong. You can't expect it to work flawlessly. He's installing the mac mini server in order to run jenkins, redmine and backup. Why would you need a GUI for that?Fortunately he doesn't say anywhere he's going to run VMs on that 4GB ram machine. I blame laziness. I blame not trying to understand why new programs were written instead of merging new features in old ones. Or failing to appreciate an OS that at least has a package manager which is not a third party one. But then well, you know what they say. Unix IS user friendly, it just chooses its friends. And I like Linux like that.
- mSparks 10y ago
  apple go to a lot of effort to make only their software work on their hardware, and vice versa, the days of the linux crowd caring enough to test it have long since passed. whats the point in having a gui installed on a machine that by definition has no keyboard mouse or moniter (Aka a server) they arent 3 "package managers". yum is a package manager, rpm is a package installer and dnf is a proposed replacement for yum. fyi https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy nearly all linux commands can be completed with around 4 key presses. e.g. aptTAB should give you apt-get
  - laumars 10y ago
    I don't disagree with your points but your aptTAB example isn't quite right as apt has a number of tools with that prefix (apt-get, apt-cache, apt-key, etc). Plus there's aptitude too. In fact I often set aliases for apt-get and apt-cache because of apt breaking the 4 key press / tab rule you raised.
    - alkz 10y ago
      or you can use just the "apt" command to search/install/upgrade/remove packages nowadays
      - 10y ago
mSparks 10y ago
more depressing because fedora is the "canary" for new hardware rather than an everyday in use desktop let alone server. so the fact it struggled on what seems like ancient hardware is hardly a surprise. wonder what his reaction will be when he finds he has to go through the whole ordeal again after they end of life his installation in 6 months.
- michaelmrose 10y ago
  Technically I think you can now more easily upgrade between releases but there are so many other choices beyond fedora anyway.
  - mSparks 10y ago
    i seem to recal they were working on a "fedora upgrade" package, but only works as long as you dont miss a release iirc.
    - op00to 10y ago
      Works just fine going from older releases progressively to newer releases.

by alkz 10y ago

laumars 10y ago

It's weird because he uses GB correctly when talking about system memory but uses it incorrectly every time he refers to storage space. He also did a good job at the start of the article of acknowledging that Ubuntu gives a good desktop experience yet then goes on to rant about how bad Linux is in general after using one other, unrelated, distro. The whole article reads incredibly ignorantly which I wouldn't have expected given his credentials. I can only assume he approached the exercise with an axe to grind so continued his tasks in a unintentionally negative way. In my experience, if someone is impatient when using unfamiliar platforms and/or wants to find problems with it, then they will find a way to expose problems regardless of the platform.

Unman 10y ago

Yes. Doesn't seem like a reliable witness at all.

facorreia 10y ago

Also, aknowledges that Ubuntu does a good job polishing the user experience, and is "not impressed" with Linux when trying Fedora.

legulere 10y ago

Your comment is more depressing in my opinion, as it shows that it's still typical with the linux to blame users. Software is there to be used by humans, if you put the blame on your users, you have actually failed to design the software correctly. Why blame someone for wanting to install linux on apple hardware (which btw is often better supported than other hardware)? Why blame someone developing 3D acceleration for virtual machines for wanting to have a GUI on the server that contains test VMs? Why blame someone for being annoyed having to know the difference between 3 package manager programs? Why blame someone for talking about the usability of command line options, of which command length certainly is a part?

alkz 10y ago
What does apple do in order to help support their hardware on Linux? nothing. It's all coming from reverse engineering efforts, correct me if I'm wrong. You can't expect it to work flawlessly. He's installing the mac mini server in order to run jenkins, redmine and backup. Why would you need a GUI for that?Fortunately he doesn't say anywhere he's going to run VMs on that 4GB ram machine. I blame laziness. I blame not trying to understand why new programs were written instead of merging new features in old ones. Or failing to appreciate an OS that at least has a package manager which is not a third party one. But then well, you know what they say. Unix IS user friendly, it just chooses its friends. And I like Linux like that.
mSparks 10y ago
apple go to a lot of effort to make only their software work on their hardware, and vice versa, the days of the linux crowd caring enough to test it have long since passed. whats the point in having a gui installed on a machine that by definition has no keyboard mouse or moniter (Aka a server) they arent 3 "package managers". yum is a package manager, rpm is a package installer and dnf is a proposed replacement for yum. fyi https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy nearly all linux commands can be completed with around 4 key presses. e.g. aptTAB should give you apt-get
- laumars 10y ago
  I don't disagree with your points but your aptTAB example isn't quite right as apt has a number of tools with that prefix (apt-get, apt-cache, apt-key, etc). Plus there's aptitude too. In fact I often set aliases for apt-get and apt-cache because of apt breaking the 4 key press / tab rule you raised.
  - alkz 10y ago
    or you can use just the "apt" command to search/install/upgrade/remove packages nowadays
    - 10y ago

mSparks 10y ago

more depressing because fedora is the "canary" for new hardware rather than an everyday in use desktop let alone server. so the fact it struggled on what seems like ancient hardware is hardly a surprise. wonder what his reaction will be when he finds he has to go through the whole ordeal again after they end of life his installation in 6 months.

michaelmrose 10y ago
Technically I think you can now more easily upgrade between releases but there are so many other choices beyond fedora anyway.
- mSparks 10y ago
  i seem to recal they were working on a "fedora upgrade" package, but only works as long as you dont miss a release iirc.
  - op00to 10y ago
    Works just fine going from older releases progressively to newer releases.