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I come at this as an active Mormon, but I see a consistent effort on the part of the leadership to make it clear that shunning shouldn't happen. I definitely se

I come at this as an active Mormon, but I see a consistent effort on the part of the leadership to make it clear that shunning shouldn't happen. I definitely see individuals with issues on this, but I haven't seen it as institutional, even though I've had a number of family members leave the church.

36bydesign 10y ago
As an exmo, I agree and for the most part I haven't been shunned. Several people unfriended me on Facebook but that was the worst of it for me. Others aren't always so fortunate, but with how many exmo's there are now it has made the transition a lot easier.
xou4ieZi 10y ago
Well, as long as you don't count BYU...
- cookiecaper 10y ago
  All universities have codes of conduct and expel students who violate them. Everyone who enrolls at BYU knows that BYU students are expected to behave in accordance with the Church's values while they're students. No one has a right to go to a specific university, much less a private one like BYU. Getting kicked out of BYU for breaking rules you'd explicitly and knowingly agreed to is not the same thing as shunning. I'm not seeing a problem here?
  - kupiakos 10y ago
    It's a tad more difficult when one realizes they don't believe in the church when they've already gone through most of BYU. Or break the Honor Code by coming out as gay or transgendered (and expressing themselves). These individuals are not far enough to get a degree, but far enough so that they'd lose years of effort if they were to be kicked out. Depending on the situation, BYU doesn't allow you to keep your transcript for transference to another university, which is difficult enough as it is. Maybe they believed in the church when they joined. Maybe they didn't and they were simply pressured in by family or friends (all of your Mormon friends are going to BYU, so why shouldn't you?) I've seen the "kicked out and can't transfer" happen on two separate occasions, one of which was a good friend, from these policies and for differing reasons. I'm aware that's simply how the rules work. I'm saying the rules suck. To these people, it seems like they're saying "You decided to be who you are and stop lying to everyone that you believe? Well good luck with life, because we're going to make it as difficult for you as possible." Whereas, if they continued lying and went to church every week, and told the bishop "Yeah, I've paid full tithing. Yeah, I still believe in the Church.", they'd not have any of these problems. Dishonesty is being rewarded. It's not just the going to church. It's the requirement of belief, which can change over time and can screw people over that none of these other universities' codes of conducts would otherwise do (barring extreme circumstances). Apparently there have been some recent changes, though, for people who leave the church while at BYU: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865660524/BYU-adjusts-honor-code-policies-for-students-who-leave-LDS-Church.html http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865660524/BYU-adjusts-hon... So that's better. Not great, but better.
    - cookiecaper 10y ago
      In Mormon doctrine it's not a sin to come out and be honest about your experiences with sexuality and gender identity. It is sinful to engage in homosexual behavior. One does not risk Church discipline (including expulsion from BYU) merely by discussing his or her feelings/"being honest". You also don't have to be a believing Mormon to go to BYU. Non-members do have to pay a different rate for tuition and you do have to have a valid ecclesiastical endorsement from a bishop and stake president and be willing to adhere to the Honor Code, but otherwise it shouldn't be a problem to admit that you no longer believe (and IMO it's much healthier for everyone if people are honest about this). Resignation from the Church is a different matter than lost belief. Whether one continues to believe or not, he/she should be willing and able to see through the contractual commitment made to the university when his/her beliefs were different. Commitments are not worth anything if you can just say "my beliefs changed; ergo, I am exempt." We all have to put up with things that we've agreed to and no longer feel are beneficial to us, at least until the term of the agreement expires. I'd say a college student experiencing this is a good opportunity for character development that will serve the student well after graduation.

36bydesign 10y ago

As an exmo, I agree and for the most part I haven't been shunned. Several people unfriended me on Facebook but that was the worst of it for me. Others aren't always so fortunate, but with how many exmo's there are now it has made the transition a lot easier.

xou4ieZi 10y ago

Well, as long as you don't count BYU...

cookiecaper 10y ago
All universities have codes of conduct and expel students who violate them. Everyone who enrolls at BYU knows that BYU students are expected to behave in accordance with the Church's values while they're students. No one has a right to go to a specific university, much less a private one like BYU. Getting kicked out of BYU for breaking rules you'd explicitly and knowingly agreed to is not the same thing as shunning. I'm not seeing a problem here?
- kupiakos 10y ago
  It's a tad more difficult when one realizes they don't believe in the church when they've already gone through most of BYU. Or break the Honor Code by coming out as gay or transgendered (and expressing themselves). These individuals are not far enough to get a degree, but far enough so that they'd lose years of effort if they were to be kicked out. Depending on the situation, BYU doesn't allow you to keep your transcript for transference to another university, which is difficult enough as it is. Maybe they believed in the church when they joined. Maybe they didn't and they were simply pressured in by family or friends (all of your Mormon friends are going to BYU, so why shouldn't you?) I've seen the "kicked out and can't transfer" happen on two separate occasions, one of which was a good friend, from these policies and for differing reasons. I'm aware that's simply how the rules work. I'm saying the rules suck. To these people, it seems like they're saying "You decided to be who you are and stop lying to everyone that you believe? Well good luck with life, because we're going to make it as difficult for you as possible." Whereas, if they continued lying and went to church every week, and told the bishop "Yeah, I've paid full tithing. Yeah, I still believe in the Church.", they'd not have any of these problems. Dishonesty is being rewarded. It's not just the going to church. It's the requirement of belief, which can change over time and can screw people over that none of these other universities' codes of conducts would otherwise do (barring extreme circumstances). Apparently there have been some recent changes, though, for people who leave the church while at BYU: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865660524/BYU-adjusts-honor-code-policies-for-students-who-leave-LDS-Church.html http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865660524/BYU-adjusts-hon... So that's better. Not great, but better.
  - cookiecaper 10y ago
    In Mormon doctrine it's not a sin to come out and be honest about your experiences with sexuality and gender identity. It is sinful to engage in homosexual behavior. One does not risk Church discipline (including expulsion from BYU) merely by discussing his or her feelings/"being honest". You also don't have to be a believing Mormon to go to BYU. Non-members do have to pay a different rate for tuition and you do have to have a valid ecclesiastical endorsement from a bishop and stake president and be willing to adhere to the Honor Code, but otherwise it shouldn't be a problem to admit that you no longer believe (and IMO it's much healthier for everyone if people are honest about this). Resignation from the Church is a different matter than lost belief. Whether one continues to believe or not, he/she should be willing and able to see through the contractual commitment made to the university when his/her beliefs were different. Commitments are not worth anything if you can just say "my beliefs changed; ergo, I am exempt." We all have to put up with things that we've agreed to and no longer feel are beneficial to us, at least until the term of the agreement expires. I'd say a college student experiencing this is a good opportunity for character development that will serve the student well after graduation.