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I think defining social need by linking it to supply and demand for labor is dangerous and dehumanizing, and is in fact exactly what I was trying to point out i

I think defining social need by linking it to supply and demand for labor is dangerous and dehumanizing, and is in fact exactly what I was trying to point out in my comment. edit: similarly, we need more engineers to rebuild basic infrastructure which would benefit society in tangible ways (Flint, Michigan?), but those jobs don't exist either. why?

weberc2 10y ago
> I think defining social need by linking it to supply and demand for labor is dangerous and dehumanizing This is a false dichotomy. There's no need to dignify people in proportion to their economic output (or any other measure of human worth). We can assign dignity equally without pretending everyone contributes equally to society. Further, I think it's materially dangerous to push a bunch of people toward majors they can't afford and which won't support them financially because of some notion of a "social need" that is divorced from any economic reality. > similarly, we need more engineers to rebuild basic infrastructure which would benefit society in tangible ways (Flint, Michigan?), but those jobs don't exist either. why? Let me head you off--capitalism isn't perfect, it's just the best economic model humans have discovered to date. More importantly, fixing student loans and social security is a tractable problem; changing our national economic model is not. So let's not waste time debating what won't happen in our lifetimes.
- LesZedCB 10y ago
  Did you change your comment? I can't respond to your point if you respond to mine and then edit your comment to make it look more innocuous. Also, just making the statement that capitalism is the best economic model doesn't make it true. Democratic control of the means of production absolutely makes more sense ethically and socially. I think it is quite possible we will see another big socialist revolution in our lifetime.
  - weberc2 10y ago
    I began to rephrase it for clarity within 30 seconds of posting it. I didn't change my point to make it "look more innocuous". > Also, just making the statement that capitalism is the best economic model doesn't make it true. Feel free to point me to one with a better track record. > Democratic control of the means of production absolutely makes more sense ethically and socially. And every time it's attempted, it ends in disaster. > I think it is quite possible we will see another big socialist revolution in our lifetime. I hope not. Many places in the world are still recovering from the last one. Anyway, I'm not interested in debating philosophies here. We have a practical problem at hand; there's no need to make it philosophical.

weberc2 10y ago

> I think defining social need by linking it to supply and demand for labor is dangerous and dehumanizing This is a false dichotomy. There's no need to dignify people in proportion to their economic output (or any other measure of human worth). We can assign dignity equally without pretending everyone contributes equally to society. Further, I think it's materially dangerous to push a bunch of people toward majors they can't afford and which won't support them financially because of some notion of a "social need" that is divorced from any economic reality. > similarly, we need more engineers to rebuild basic infrastructure which would benefit society in tangible ways (Flint, Michigan?), but those jobs don't exist either. why? Let me head you off--capitalism isn't perfect, it's just the best economic model humans have discovered to date. More importantly, fixing student loans and social security is a tractable problem; changing our national economic model is not. So let's not waste time debating what won't happen in our lifetimes.

LesZedCB 10y ago
Did you change your comment? I can't respond to your point if you respond to mine and then edit your comment to make it look more innocuous. Also, just making the statement that capitalism is the best economic model doesn't make it true. Democratic control of the means of production absolutely makes more sense ethically and socially. I think it is quite possible we will see another big socialist revolution in our lifetime.
- weberc2 10y ago
  I began to rephrase it for clarity within 30 seconds of posting it. I didn't change my point to make it "look more innocuous". > Also, just making the statement that capitalism is the best economic model doesn't make it true. Feel free to point me to one with a better track record. > Democratic control of the means of production absolutely makes more sense ethically and socially. And every time it's attempted, it ends in disaster. > I think it is quite possible we will see another big socialist revolution in our lifetime. I hope not. Many places in the world are still recovering from the last one. Anyway, I'm not interested in debating philosophies here. We have a practical problem at hand; there's no need to make it philosophical.