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It continues to amaze me that the US is so unambitious in this regard. Donald Trump on education: http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Donald_Trump_Education.htm ht

It continues to amaze me that the US is so unambitious in this regard. Donald Trump on education: http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Donald_Trump_Education.htm http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Donald_Trump_Education.htm His solution? School choice, competition. Completely ignoring what the 25 countries do that rank higher when it comes to education.

throwanem 10y ago
Our current regrettable situation originates in a century's worth of extremely ambitious educational systems design. Taking a step back from such things doesn't seem like all that bad an idea; we've had enough schoolmen on horseback to last us quite a while.
yummyfajitas 10y ago
Completely ignoring what the 25 countries do that rank higher when it comes to education. You mean have lots of Asian and white students but not so many black ones? Unfortunately it would be kind of racist to do that. Trump is hoping to come up with a plan that helps all Americans, rather than simply excluding the underperforming ones from the stats. https://web.archive.org/web/20150525165748/http://super-economy.blogspot.com/2011/01/how-well-do-above-average-american.html https://web.archive.org/web/20150525165748/http://super-econ... (Archive search is down, but search archive also for this URL: https://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-about-pisa-scores-usa.html https://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-abo... )
- altcognito 10y ago
  It is fair to have doubts that charter schools will be regulated enough and held accountable by a guy who was largely elected on "getting rid of all that red tape". http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2014/06/22/michigan-spends-1b-on-charter-schools-but-fails-to-hold/77155074/ http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2014/06/22/mi... When we turn children and education into a commodity, the problem is not going to get better. The system will be turned into a cost center for the country, and we'll get what we deserve per the usual.
  - yummyfajitas 10y ago
    Our last "deregulate all the things" president imposed strong regulation on education. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act This regulation was moderately successful, particularly for non-Asian minorities: https://www.nber.org/papers/w15531 https://www.nber.org/papers/w15531 http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19345747.2013.878011 http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19345747.2013.878... https://www.nber.org/papers/w20511 https://www.nber.org/papers/w20511 https://www.nber.org/papers/w16745 https://www.nber.org/papers/w16745 https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/no-child-left-behind-worked/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/no-child-left-behind-wo... Our last "regulate all the things" president deregulated education. Unsurprisingly, the sellers of education contributed a lot to his campaign and voted for him. https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/obama-signs-new-k-12-education-law-that-ends-no-child-left-behind/2015/12/10/c9e58d7c-9f51-11e5-a3c5-c77f2cc5a43c_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/obama-signs-n... It's pretty clear that over the past 16 years, campaign rhetoric doesn't really reflect what will actually happen.
- qntty 10y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity
  - yummyfajitas 10y ago
    I understand the parent poster believes that educational techniques are the primary driver of educational performance. I don't think he was suggesting adopting Singaporean demographics. My phrasing was a snarky way of pointing out that educational techniques don't seem to matter very much, that's all.
    - dang 10y ago
      Please don't, though, be snarky about divisive topics. Or any topics really, but there's a harm multiplier on divisive ones.
hash-set 10y ago
What do they do besides make the population so desperate to escape poverty that they will push their kids to the brink of madness to study for exams that are make or break for their lives?
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- umanwizard 10y ago
  Most people in places like France and Germany are not "desperate to escape poverty".
  - hash-set 10y ago
    I was referring the India and China.

throwanem 10y ago

Our current regrettable situation originates in a century's worth of extremely ambitious educational systems design. Taking a step back from such things doesn't seem like all that bad an idea; we've had enough schoolmen on horseback to last us quite a while.

yummyfajitas 10y ago

Completely ignoring what the 25 countries do that rank higher when it comes to education. You mean have lots of Asian and white students but not so many black ones? Unfortunately it would be kind of racist to do that. Trump is hoping to come up with a plan that helps all Americans, rather than simply excluding the underperforming ones from the stats. https://web.archive.org/web/20150525165748/http://super-economy.blogspot.com/2011/01/how-well-do-above-average-american.html https://web.archive.org/web/20150525165748/http://super-econ... (Archive search is down, but search archive also for this URL: https://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-about-pisa-scores-usa.html https://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-abo... )

altcognito 10y ago
It is fair to have doubts that charter schools will be regulated enough and held accountable by a guy who was largely elected on "getting rid of all that red tape". http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2014/06/22/michigan-spends-1b-on-charter-schools-but-fails-to-hold/77155074/ http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2014/06/22/mi... When we turn children and education into a commodity, the problem is not going to get better. The system will be turned into a cost center for the country, and we'll get what we deserve per the usual.
- yummyfajitas 10y ago
  Our last "deregulate all the things" president imposed strong regulation on education. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act This regulation was moderately successful, particularly for non-Asian minorities: https://www.nber.org/papers/w15531 https://www.nber.org/papers/w15531 http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19345747.2013.878011 http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19345747.2013.878... https://www.nber.org/papers/w20511 https://www.nber.org/papers/w20511 https://www.nber.org/papers/w16745 https://www.nber.org/papers/w16745 https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/no-child-left-behind-worked/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/no-child-left-behind-wo... Our last "regulate all the things" president deregulated education. Unsurprisingly, the sellers of education contributed a lot to his campaign and voted for him. https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/obama-signs-new-k-12-education-law-that-ends-no-child-left-behind/2015/12/10/c9e58d7c-9f51-11e5-a3c5-c77f2cc5a43c_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/obama-signs-n... It's pretty clear that over the past 16 years, campaign rhetoric doesn't really reflect what will actually happen.
qntty 10y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity
- yummyfajitas 10y ago
  I understand the parent poster believes that educational techniques are the primary driver of educational performance. I don't think he was suggesting adopting Singaporean demographics. My phrasing was a snarky way of pointing out that educational techniques don't seem to matter very much, that's all.
  - dang 10y ago
    Please don't, though, be snarky about divisive topics. Or any topics really, but there's a harm multiplier on divisive ones.

hash-set 10y ago

What do they do besides make the population so desperate to escape poverty that they will push their kids to the brink of madness to study for exams that are make or break for their lives?

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
umanwizard 10y ago
Most people in places like France and Germany are not "desperate to escape poverty".
- hash-set 10y ago
  I was referring the India and China.