4 ms·

I'm starting to worry about the future of clojure, given that it's based on the JVM.

by mstevens 16y ago

mahmud 16y ago
Clojure on .NET CLR is coming along nicely. and if you want bare-metal, you can always switch to Common Lisp.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  I am not sure I would like to be vulnerable to the whims of Microsoft.
- jedbrown 16y ago
  CL and Clojure are very different Lisps.
  - mstevens 16y ago
    In my (inexperienced, non-lisp-coding) book, Clojure looks really cool and the sort of thing I can see myself using a lot. CL looks old and painful to deal with, although it does have all the lisp goodness in there somewhere.
- hga 16y ago
  Clojure in Clojure is something that Rich has started thinking about. Turtle Clojure ("It's turtles all the way down") to bare-metal as it counts for this (Linux, Xen, whatever) will follow that.
rbanffy 16y ago
You can use the OpenJDK to host Clojure. At least until Oracle decides they want to collect some money for all Sun patents they bought with the package. Oh boy... This is getting really nasty real quick.
- hga 16y ago
  WRT patents, let's not borrow trouble, there's no sign that Oracle will get ugly in that way and they have a lot to lose if they start a patent war with the open software world.
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    Agreed. They haven't mentioned that, but it appears some mid-level execs are all too eager to hit their targets, sacrificing long-term viability for their yearly bonuses. We can make them behave by showing they have more to lose than us.
- Kadin 16y ago
  Oracle is definitely showing itself to be a bunch of scumbags, but I'm not sure they're quite that stupid. Attempting to squeeze OpenJDK would almost certainly call off the long-held truce with IBM, who has their own (admittedly unpopular, relative to Sun's) Java implementation. Starting a patent war with IBM is like starting a land war against Russia; you might be able to hurt them, but in the end they will destroy you.
- mstevens 16y ago
  Yes, there's OpenJDK, but I'm a bit suspicious over whether enough of a community has built up around OpenJDK to continue development without Sun support. I'd be delighted to be proved wrong, of course.
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    Me too. I really don't like Java the language, but the JVM is a really cool platform to host your code on.

I'm starting to worry about the future of clojure, given that it's based on the JVM.

mahmud 16y ago

Clojure on .NET CLR is coming along nicely. and if you want bare-metal, you can always switch to Common Lisp.

rbanffy 16y ago
I am not sure I would like to be vulnerable to the whims of Microsoft.
jedbrown 16y ago
CL and Clojure are very different Lisps.
- mstevens 16y ago
  In my (inexperienced, non-lisp-coding) book, Clojure looks really cool and the sort of thing I can see myself using a lot. CL looks old and painful to deal with, although it does have all the lisp goodness in there somewhere.
hga 16y ago
Clojure in Clojure is something that Rich has started thinking about. Turtle Clojure ("It's turtles all the way down") to bare-metal as it counts for this (Linux, Xen, whatever) will follow that.

rbanffy 16y ago

You can use the OpenJDK to host Clojure. At least until Oracle decides they want to collect some money for all Sun patents they bought with the package. Oh boy... This is getting really nasty real quick.

hga 16y ago
WRT patents, let's not borrow trouble, there's no sign that Oracle will get ugly in that way and they have a lot to lose if they start a patent war with the open software world.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  Agreed. They haven't mentioned that, but it appears some mid-level execs are all too eager to hit their targets, sacrificing long-term viability for their yearly bonuses. We can make them behave by showing they have more to lose than us.
Kadin 16y ago
Oracle is definitely showing itself to be a bunch of scumbags, but I'm not sure they're quite that stupid. Attempting to squeeze OpenJDK would almost certainly call off the long-held truce with IBM, who has their own (admittedly unpopular, relative to Sun's) Java implementation. Starting a patent war with IBM is like starting a land war against Russia; you might be able to hurt them, but in the end they will destroy you.
mstevens 16y ago
Yes, there's OpenJDK, but I'm a bit suspicious over whether enough of a community has built up around OpenJDK to continue development without Sun support. I'd be delighted to be proved wrong, of course.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  Me too. I really don't like Java the language, but the JVM is a really cool platform to host your code on.