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Turkey has ten times Austria's population. Wasn't going to happen as long as each state gets a veto. The fears thrown around were: >10% of Austria's populatio

Turkey has ten times Austria's population. Wasn't going to happen as long as each state gets a veto. The fears thrown around were: >10% of Austria's population is already foreign born, it would only take 1/100 Turkish citizens to double that. I like the idea of free movement of goods, money, and labor, but I think we're finding in elections around the world that once you hit that 10% foreign-born number, people tend to freak out.

matt4077 10y ago
Racism is pretty much anti-correlated with the local percentage of foreign-born residents. C. f. Hungary. Also, this is still fantastic: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-P9e2hoDKdUU/VFGYoFE7KnI/AAAAAAAAGtM/kGGOJWqT0cc/s1600/Immigrants%2B%3D%2Bperception%2Bv%2Breality.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-P9e2hoDKdUU/VFGYoFE7KnI/AAAAAAAAGt...
- brownbat 10y ago
  I'd heard that in passing, but in trying to research it, the best I can find is that studies of xenophobia are all over the map and completely contradictory: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rPNS83useA0J:www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/10/xenophobia-eastern-europe-refugees/410800/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rPNS83u... The only thing anyone seems to agree on is that the French really hate foreign workers. That said, I hope you turn out to be right, and the populist/nativist zeitgeist burns itself out.
  - pluma 10y ago
    I think basing this around countries is too fuzzy. If you look at Germany it's pretty evident: At a glance it seems that East Germans are more xenophobic/racist than West Germans. But that's only half the story. Once you look at population densities you quickly see that xenophobia is most widespread in the areas with the least dense population. But even then you can see a clear trend that absence of "foreigners" correlates with a higher level of xenophobia. There may be a limit to this effect (e.g. I'm not sure what the numbers look like for areas with a "foreign" majority) but anecdotally people seem to be less xenophobic the more they are exposed to "foreigners" (usually with the cliché stopgap "obviously you're okay, but those other foreigners..."). Anecdotally in Germany there's also a phenomenon where Eastern European immigrants are more xenophobic/racist towards other immigrants than native Germans are. This may have to do with "Russland-Deutsche" historically seeing themselves as ethnic Germans rather than immigrants. As a counterpoint, the Iranian spree killer in Munich this year also was a xenophobe who considered himself German.
- the8472 10y ago
  People may just be terrible at assessing percentages. If they mentally round down <10% to "does not happen" then conversely even low fractions will still lead to a reported >10% perception. Maybe the questions should be phrased as X out of 5, i.e. 20% increments. Or even more accurately 0-1 out of 5, 1-2 out of 5, etc. Also, an anti-immigration stance may just be isolationism, not necessarily racism. Fear of "the other" is more general than just race.
pluma 10y ago
According to Wikipedia, ethnic Turks make up 3% of the population in Austria. There are more Serbians in Austria than Turks. Approximately 4% of the population is Muslim. I have a lot of things to say about Austrian political sensibilities, few of them are nice. Let's just say that it doesn't take much for Austria to act xenophobic.

matt4077 10y ago

Racism is pretty much anti-correlated with the local percentage of foreign-born residents. C. f. Hungary. Also, this is still fantastic: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-P9e2hoDKdUU/VFGYoFE7KnI/AAAAAAAAGtM/kGGOJWqT0cc/s1600/Immigrants%2B%3D%2Bperception%2Bv%2Breality.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-P9e2hoDKdUU/VFGYoFE7KnI/AAAAAAAAGt...

brownbat 10y ago
I'd heard that in passing, but in trying to research it, the best I can find is that studies of xenophobia are all over the map and completely contradictory: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rPNS83useA0J:www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/10/xenophobia-eastern-europe-refugees/410800/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rPNS83u... The only thing anyone seems to agree on is that the French really hate foreign workers. That said, I hope you turn out to be right, and the populist/nativist zeitgeist burns itself out.
- pluma 10y ago
  I think basing this around countries is too fuzzy. If you look at Germany it's pretty evident: At a glance it seems that East Germans are more xenophobic/racist than West Germans. But that's only half the story. Once you look at population densities you quickly see that xenophobia is most widespread in the areas with the least dense population. But even then you can see a clear trend that absence of "foreigners" correlates with a higher level of xenophobia. There may be a limit to this effect (e.g. I'm not sure what the numbers look like for areas with a "foreign" majority) but anecdotally people seem to be less xenophobic the more they are exposed to "foreigners" (usually with the cliché stopgap "obviously you're okay, but those other foreigners..."). Anecdotally in Germany there's also a phenomenon where Eastern European immigrants are more xenophobic/racist towards other immigrants than native Germans are. This may have to do with "Russland-Deutsche" historically seeing themselves as ethnic Germans rather than immigrants. As a counterpoint, the Iranian spree killer in Munich this year also was a xenophobe who considered himself German.
the8472 10y ago
People may just be terrible at assessing percentages. If they mentally round down <10% to "does not happen" then conversely even low fractions will still lead to a reported >10% perception. Maybe the questions should be phrased as X out of 5, i.e. 20% increments. Or even more accurately 0-1 out of 5, 1-2 out of 5, etc. Also, an anti-immigration stance may just be isolationism, not necessarily racism. Fear of "the other" is more general than just race.

pluma 10y ago

According to Wikipedia, ethnic Turks make up 3% of the population in Austria. There are more Serbians in Austria than Turks. Approximately 4% of the population is Muslim. I have a lot of things to say about Austrian political sensibilities, few of them are nice. Let's just say that it doesn't take much for Austria to act xenophobic.