7 ms·

This guy is sad. All those people on Quora who ask unending questions about Google are sad. They're suckers. They've eaten up Google's marketing. You want to k

by fdsfsaa 10y ago

This guy is sad. All those people on Quora who ask unending questions about Google are sad. They're suckers. They've eaten up Google's marketing. You want to know the reality? Whatever's special about Google is long gone. Management let the smoke out a long time ago. Nowadays, Google is just another big software company, with all the opaque politics, purposelessness, and random nonsense that comes with being a big company. It's sad to see people strive to be a faceless drone.

scarmig 10y ago
How can you say that? Google gives an expensive Christmas gift every year!
- user5994461 10y ago
  And free food all year along!
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
JonDav 10y ago
I try to let new grads know this and they still fall for it. Just like when Goldman Saks comes calling. They just do not see these companies and the experience for what it is.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- ceras 10y ago
  I don't think it's fair to say people are "falling for it." Their motivations may just differ from yours. For example, say you're interested in earning a lot of money as a software developer - where else are you going to work that's clearly better?
  - fdsfsaa 10y ago
    Finance.
    - savanaly 10y ago
      That's true if the goal is purely money. I think, though, that if you're just looking to make six figures and don't quite care if it's 150k or 500k then working at a Google or Facebook will be the far better alternative as the workplace culture is better and the hours are likely to be better. For a lot of (most?) engineers, there's not enough money in the world to offset the difference in utility from working at a finance company instead of a development/research company. It's your life after all, and you spend a sizeble chunk of every day at work either way.
      - elbear 10y ago
        The work in finance can also be intellectually stimulating.
        savanaly 10y ago
        Of that I have no doubt, but I think on average the perception is that you are giving up your quality of life for money by going to finance.
        user5994461 10y ago
        Working in finance: 1) Go to finance for the money 2) Stay there because work and people are interesting
    - morgante 10y ago
      It's questionable whether you'll make more money as a developer in finance than at Google. It'll certainly require a lot more politics and careful planning.
      - 10y ago
gdulli 10y ago
There's a turning point in the lifespan of a company whose product you use. You stop looking forward to product updates and start dreading them because they keep making it worse. A company makes a good product, gets successful. Hires a ton more people, because they can afford to. Original staff turns over, because that's the way of things. All these new people have to be given things to do whether the product needs a lot of new work or not. Even if the product is in an optimal state, it can't be seen as standing still.
20years 10y ago
I too don't understand the appeal of working for Google and the likes but I am not sure I would consider this guy sad. It feels like he may partly be doing this as confirmation to himself of his worth. The fact that he has started 2 successful businesses both of which are still generating revenue is what he should be looking at for confirmation. That is hard and a skill that many developers will never acquire. He may be disappointed when working for a big company especially after running his own businesses. But it is something else he can say he has done and has learned from. Plus, after he has Google on his resume, he can probably start doubling his contract rates.
- user5994461 10y ago
  I too don't understand the appeal of working for big tech companies. Until a recruiter from Facebook contacted me and sent me a list of teams at Facebook to pick the ones I'd be interested in. http://imgur.com/9p7QJ5s http://imgur.com/9p7QJ5s (just an excerpt) Then I figured out there aren't many places in the world where I could do cache infrastructure "to handle over a billion requests per second" or storage datacenters to store "350+ million photos uploaded per day to Facebook -the largest photos site on the Internet-". Next thing you know. I'm interviewing at yet-another-big-company. Damn, they got me with their marketing //(^-^)//
preordained 10y ago
That's maybe a bit harsh, but I'm pretty much with you. It's passed the tipping point where it's inevitable it takes on the mold of a soulless megacorp. its really obvious that so many people just "need" to get into Google because it's validation for their ego. "I told you I'm a special snowflake genius!" Google is awesome, and I'm at Google, so you know I'm awesome...yada, yada. The inauthenticity is palpable; you just know these same people wouldn't be busting their ass to work on the cutting edge in No-Name software shop because they wouldn't have that big shiny feather in their cap.
- 40acres 10y ago
  I think this is a shortsighted view. I work for a pretty influential tech company as a Software Developer, I've interviewed with Google twice and have failed both times, but I look at interviewing with and potentially being hired at Google as a great challenge and opportunity rather than something to validate myself. I'm 25, and I think I speak for a lot of folks my age when I saw that Google is the 'Bell Labs / IBM / whatever big influential company that makes a mark on you as a young adult" company of our time. Now I know that may not be the case now, but when I was deciding that being in technology was what I truly wanted to do (teenage years), Google was coming out with Gmail, and was the 'key' to the internet with search, and bought YouTube/Android, and was everywhere, so I really saw them as a pillar of modern day technology, and to a sense I still do. So whenever I get a call from a recruiter I can't help but be excited. I know their hiring practices are not perfect, but they are still a company who I look towards with bright eyes.* * Albeit less bright as time goes on.
  - judahmeek 10y ago
    Nothing you said contradicts preordained's claim that a lot of Google's current hype is due to ego validation. In addition to having the highest average salaries in tech, Google has purposely made their hiring process very stringent, not because the techniques that they use more accurately predict job success rates, but because by making their job openings harder to obtain (in proportion to applications), they increase the subjective value of those job openings in the eyes of potential candidates. It's premium branding, plain and simple, and the fact that Google employees have to justify the effort and time they put in to get hired in the first place partially explains why Google is rated so highly by current/past employees. I'd be really curious to learn how much Google spends in man-hours for each hire in comparison to other tech companies.
hkmurakami 10y ago
This is like preparing for an iBanking or Management Consulting interview: undergrads and bschool students alike will spend months preparing for those. And it's "worth it", if they really have what you're after. For banking and consulting, analyst training is truly great. The signaling after those few years when you're a bright kid who studied history in undergrad, is pretty good too. And with Google, you can't deny that they're one of the highest paying employers around for tech. It's not for everyone but I think it's fine for folks who have those priorities.
- beachstartup 10y ago
  it wasn't so long ago that nobody did this for tech, because we had a self-selecting industry that paid smart people very well, and those banker and consultant kids looked to us with a certain level of envy because we could naturally, seemingly effortlessly (not really), do what they studied years and years to do, which is make over 100 grand in your early 20's without really trying. those days are almost over. the b-school invasion is in its 2nd decade now.
  - ryandrake 10y ago
    > it wasn't so long ago that nobody did this for tech Well, competition for jobs (especially the top ones) has never been so fierce. I remember my first job out of undergrad was programming for a (then) pretty well known hardware company. I cracked open a book on "how to write device drivers" the day before my interview and breezed through the interview and got the job. This would literally never happen today. Interviews (even at no-name "dog" companies) are so much tougher these days and there is so much competition that there is no longer room for mistakes. These top employers are seen as kingmakers for engineers' careers. It's totally believable that one would spend months (or even years) preparing for a single company's interview.
    - cm2187 10y ago
      I thought developers were now a scarce resource.
jonas21 10y ago
There's no need to personally insult him just because he has a different opinion on Google than you do.
pound 10y ago
but pay is still excellent there
ryandrake 10y ago
(Disclaimer: not a Googler) Like it or not, Google is consistently ranked near the top or #1 on all of those "Best places to work" lists that get published from time to time. Everyone I know who has managed to get hired there sings its praises, and none of them have left (yet). I think it's unlikely that each one of their opinions is fueled by Kool-aid. There's something to it. I don't think this guy is sad at all. I really admire what he did. It's pretty inspiring/motivating actually.
- dublinben 10y ago
  The median employee tenure at Google is only 1.1 years, so clearly lots of people are leaving. [0] They are right in line with much-derided Amazon. [0] http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/07/28/turnover_rates_by_company_how_amazon_google_and_others_stack_up.html http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/07/28/turno...
  - xxpor 10y ago
    Or it just means they're hiring lots of people.
    - greenleafjacob 10y ago
      You seriously think they doubled or more their engineering team in the last year?
      - uiri 10y ago
        Yes. They're hiring at a remarkable pace to the point that they're having trouble scaling the process. They're in the same position that Amazon was a few years ago.
  - evanws 10y ago
    Median employee tenure is almost entirely dominated by things other than employees leaving. A company that is not hiring will not have any new employees and as a result have a really high median tenure. The question you really want to ask is: what's the percentage of people leaving each year?
cryptozeus 10y ago
Sad really? Read the whole article...he even mentioned that by studying hard and setting him self to aim high...even if he does not get into google...he will be so good that he can get hired anywhere else....that is anything but sad
flavor8 10y ago
I think it's valuable to work for at least one big company early in your career. You'll get exposed to a wide range of tech and ideas that you wouldn't necessarily get in a small team, and it's also good for expanding your professional network quickly.
morgante 10y ago
Google doesn't need to be magically different from all other companies to make it a desirable place to work. They just need to pay more than everyone else. Which they (along with a select few other giants) do. Attracting droves of applicants really isn't hard. Just pay above market and advertise that.
aaachilless 10y ago
As far as I can tell, this guy is motivated, entrepreneurial, proactive, professionally competent, etc. He thinks working at Google would be awesome and he's worked hard to give himself a shot at doing so. He might be completely wrong, work for Google for 6 months, realize it's all bullshit, and quit. Even if that happens, there's nothing "sad" about it. Maybe you have some insider experience with Google and you already "know" that it's all bullshit once you get there. But we can't all have complete knowledge of reality and those individuals who keep moving, in any direction, to go and look and see and decide for themselves, are not sad.
- hex_3934252261 10y ago
  He thinks working at Google would be awesome and he's worked hard to give himself a shot at doing so. He might be completely wrong, work for Google for 6 months, realize it's all bullshit, and quit. Remember the guy (I dare not say his name) who had exactly that experience and ended up getting attacked by the worst people in the tech industry?
solipsism 10y ago
Your comment sounds like sour grapes. How many times did you apply?
thefastlane 10y ago
i'd like to think i could tolerate a sizable amount of opaque politics and purposelessness if it came with a 300,000k/year comp package.

by fdsfsaa 10y ago

scarmig 10y ago

How can you say that? Google gives an expensive Christmas gift every year!

user5994461 10y ago
And free food all year along!
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

JonDav 10y ago

I try to let new grads know this and they still fall for it. Just like when Goldman Saks comes calling. They just do not see these companies and the experience for what it is.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
ceras 10y ago
I don't think it's fair to say people are "falling for it." Their motivations may just differ from yours. For example, say you're interested in earning a lot of money as a software developer - where else are you going to work that's clearly better?
- fdsfsaa 10y ago
  Finance.
  - savanaly 10y ago
    That's true if the goal is purely money. I think, though, that if you're just looking to make six figures and don't quite care if it's 150k or 500k then working at a Google or Facebook will be the far better alternative as the workplace culture is better and the hours are likely to be better. For a lot of (most?) engineers, there's not enough money in the world to offset the difference in utility from working at a finance company instead of a development/research company. It's your life after all, and you spend a sizeble chunk of every day at work either way.
    - elbear 10y ago
      The work in finance can also be intellectually stimulating.
      - savanaly 10y ago
        Of that I have no doubt, but I think on average the perception is that you are giving up your quality of life for money by going to finance.
        user5994461 10y ago
        Working in finance: 1) Go to finance for the money 2) Stay there because work and people are interesting
  - morgante 10y ago
    It's questionable whether you'll make more money as a developer in finance than at Google. It'll certainly require a lot more politics and careful planning.
    - 10y ago

gdulli 10y ago

There's a turning point in the lifespan of a company whose product you use. You stop looking forward to product updates and start dreading them because they keep making it worse. A company makes a good product, gets successful. Hires a ton more people, because they can afford to. Original staff turns over, because that's the way of things. All these new people have to be given things to do whether the product needs a lot of new work or not. Even if the product is in an optimal state, it can't be seen as standing still.

20years 10y ago

I too don't understand the appeal of working for Google and the likes but I am not sure I would consider this guy sad. It feels like he may partly be doing this as confirmation to himself of his worth. The fact that he has started 2 successful businesses both of which are still generating revenue is what he should be looking at for confirmation. That is hard and a skill that many developers will never acquire. He may be disappointed when working for a big company especially after running his own businesses. But it is something else he can say he has done and has learned from. Plus, after he has Google on his resume, he can probably start doubling his contract rates.

user5994461 10y ago
I too don't understand the appeal of working for big tech companies. Until a recruiter from Facebook contacted me and sent me a list of teams at Facebook to pick the ones I'd be interested in. http://imgur.com/9p7QJ5s http://imgur.com/9p7QJ5s (just an excerpt) Then I figured out there aren't many places in the world where I could do cache infrastructure "to handle over a billion requests per second" or storage datacenters to store "350+ million photos uploaded per day to Facebook -the largest photos site on the Internet-". Next thing you know. I'm interviewing at yet-another-big-company. Damn, they got me with their marketing //(^-^)//

preordained 10y ago

That's maybe a bit harsh, but I'm pretty much with you. It's passed the tipping point where it's inevitable it takes on the mold of a soulless megacorp. its really obvious that so many people just "need" to get into Google because it's validation for their ego. "I told you I'm a special snowflake genius!" Google is awesome, and I'm at Google, so you know I'm awesome...yada, yada. The inauthenticity is palpable; you just know these same people wouldn't be busting their ass to work on the cutting edge in No-Name software shop because they wouldn't have that big shiny feather in their cap.

40acres 10y ago
I think this is a shortsighted view. I work for a pretty influential tech company as a Software Developer, I've interviewed with Google twice and have failed both times, but I look at interviewing with and potentially being hired at Google as a great challenge and opportunity rather than something to validate myself. I'm 25, and I think I speak for a lot of folks my age when I saw that Google is the 'Bell Labs / IBM / whatever big influential company that makes a mark on you as a young adult" company of our time. Now I know that may not be the case now, but when I was deciding that being in technology was what I truly wanted to do (teenage years), Google was coming out with Gmail, and was the 'key' to the internet with search, and bought YouTube/Android, and was everywhere, so I really saw them as a pillar of modern day technology, and to a sense I still do. So whenever I get a call from a recruiter I can't help but be excited. I know their hiring practices are not perfect, but they are still a company who I look towards with bright eyes.* * Albeit less bright as time goes on.
- judahmeek 10y ago
  Nothing you said contradicts preordained's claim that a lot of Google's current hype is due to ego validation. In addition to having the highest average salaries in tech, Google has purposely made their hiring process very stringent, not because the techniques that they use more accurately predict job success rates, but because by making their job openings harder to obtain (in proportion to applications), they increase the subjective value of those job openings in the eyes of potential candidates. It's premium branding, plain and simple, and the fact that Google employees have to justify the effort and time they put in to get hired in the first place partially explains why Google is rated so highly by current/past employees. I'd be really curious to learn how much Google spends in man-hours for each hire in comparison to other tech companies.

hkmurakami 10y ago

This is like preparing for an iBanking or Management Consulting interview: undergrads and bschool students alike will spend months preparing for those. And it's "worth it", if they really have what you're after. For banking and consulting, analyst training is truly great. The signaling after those few years when you're a bright kid who studied history in undergrad, is pretty good too. And with Google, you can't deny that they're one of the highest paying employers around for tech. It's not for everyone but I think it's fine for folks who have those priorities.

beachstartup 10y ago
it wasn't so long ago that nobody did this for tech, because we had a self-selecting industry that paid smart people very well, and those banker and consultant kids looked to us with a certain level of envy because we could naturally, seemingly effortlessly (not really), do what they studied years and years to do, which is make over 100 grand in your early 20's without really trying. those days are almost over. the b-school invasion is in its 2nd decade now.
- ryandrake 10y ago
  > it wasn't so long ago that nobody did this for tech Well, competition for jobs (especially the top ones) has never been so fierce. I remember my first job out of undergrad was programming for a (then) pretty well known hardware company. I cracked open a book on "how to write device drivers" the day before my interview and breezed through the interview and got the job. This would literally never happen today. Interviews (even at no-name "dog" companies) are so much tougher these days and there is so much competition that there is no longer room for mistakes. These top employers are seen as kingmakers for engineers' careers. It's totally believable that one would spend months (or even years) preparing for a single company's interview.
  - cm2187 10y ago
    I thought developers were now a scarce resource.

jonas21 10y ago

There's no need to personally insult him just because he has a different opinion on Google than you do.

pound 10y ago

but pay is still excellent there

ryandrake 10y ago

(Disclaimer: not a Googler) Like it or not, Google is consistently ranked near the top or #1 on all of those "Best places to work" lists that get published from time to time. Everyone I know who has managed to get hired there sings its praises, and none of them have left (yet). I think it's unlikely that each one of their opinions is fueled by Kool-aid. There's something to it. I don't think this guy is sad at all. I really admire what he did. It's pretty inspiring/motivating actually.

dublinben 10y ago
The median employee tenure at Google is only 1.1 years, so clearly lots of people are leaving. [0] They are right in line with much-derided Amazon. [0] http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/07/28/turnover_rates_by_company_how_amazon_google_and_others_stack_up.html http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/07/28/turno...
- xxpor 10y ago
  Or it just means they're hiring lots of people.
  - greenleafjacob 10y ago
    You seriously think they doubled or more their engineering team in the last year?
    - uiri 10y ago
      Yes. They're hiring at a remarkable pace to the point that they're having trouble scaling the process. They're in the same position that Amazon was a few years ago.
- evanws 10y ago
  Median employee tenure is almost entirely dominated by things other than employees leaving. A company that is not hiring will not have any new employees and as a result have a really high median tenure. The question you really want to ask is: what's the percentage of people leaving each year?

cryptozeus 10y ago

Sad really? Read the whole article...he even mentioned that by studying hard and setting him self to aim high...even if he does not get into google...he will be so good that he can get hired anywhere else....that is anything but sad

flavor8 10y ago

I think it's valuable to work for at least one big company early in your career. You'll get exposed to a wide range of tech and ideas that you wouldn't necessarily get in a small team, and it's also good for expanding your professional network quickly.

morgante 10y ago

Google doesn't need to be magically different from all other companies to make it a desirable place to work. They just need to pay more than everyone else. Which they (along with a select few other giants) do. Attracting droves of applicants really isn't hard. Just pay above market and advertise that.

aaachilless 10y ago

As far as I can tell, this guy is motivated, entrepreneurial, proactive, professionally competent, etc. He thinks working at Google would be awesome and he's worked hard to give himself a shot at doing so. He might be completely wrong, work for Google for 6 months, realize it's all bullshit, and quit. Even if that happens, there's nothing "sad" about it. Maybe you have some insider experience with Google and you already "know" that it's all bullshit once you get there. But we can't all have complete knowledge of reality and those individuals who keep moving, in any direction, to go and look and see and decide for themselves, are not sad.

hex_3934252261 10y ago
He thinks working at Google would be awesome and he's worked hard to give himself a shot at doing so. He might be completely wrong, work for Google for 6 months, realize it's all bullshit, and quit. Remember the guy (I dare not say his name) who had exactly that experience and ended up getting attacked by the worst people in the tech industry?

solipsism 10y ago

Your comment sounds like sour grapes. How many times did you apply?

thefastlane 10y ago

i'd like to think i could tolerate a sizable amount of opaque politics and purposelessness if it came with a 300,000k/year comp package.