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>For example, there’s one machine where you typically need to wait five to 10 years in machining before touching that piece of equipment. For good reason. If w

>For example, there’s one machine where you typically need to wait five to 10 years in machining before touching that piece of equipment. For good reason. If we are talking real production, not 3D printing a bust of Beethoven for fun of buying a Shapeoko to cut a little bracket. If that's what we are talking about, well, you are not going to take someone who hasn't proven themselves trough years of training and learning on the job to run something like my Haas VF2-SS, VF3-SS or VF4-SS. One mistake could cost tens of thousands of dollars in damage to the machine and untold losses due to disruption to production. This can include damage to very expensive tools (we are not talking about $0.50 Home depot drill bits here). And then there are such things as optimizing tool wear and throughput. Despite what is said in this article real machinists don't sit there guessing at what to do. They know because they studied, learned and made enough mistakes. Fields such as manufacturing highly accurate medical, optical or aerospace parts require real skills. Can all of this be automated to the point of eliminating both human CAM toolpath programming and the machinist? I'd say in a very limited set of cases and with restrictions that do not make for efficient manufacturing. This is one of the problems with Proto Labs. They can machine quite a range of parts but they are very, very expensive for what you get. Sure, for quick turn "I just need a part" manufacturing (and, to be fair, more than that) they work fine. For anything else, no way. Here's an example from a couple of weeks ago. I needed a half dozen copies of a part made out of mild steel. We needed to send it out because our machines are busy. Proto Labs could make them for $300 a piece. I called a couple of local shops. I had them made for $20 a piece and delivered to us overnight (one of the guys from the shop drove them over). They used their waterjet machine to cut the basic shape quickly and then threw it on a VMC to square-up and finish all the other features. Twenty bucks. Yes, we will eventually succeed at automating the CAD-to-Machined-Part process to a significant degree and with good results. This will require AI, Machine Learning and a lot of the knowledge accumulated out there encoded into these systems. You need to be able to make real parts with real manufacturing problems. Any part. Some parts require designing new parts to make them, whole machines even (fixtures, jigs, clamping and alignment systems). It isn't a simple problem. And, even as these problems are solved the totality of manufacturing isn't CNC maching aluminum. Not even close.

cranialdivot 10y ago
I have had a large professionally equipped CNC shop in my home shop for a long time as well with a similar array of equipment you mention. I use it intensively for product development for my own company and others. I also have an equally electronics fab lab and a range of other work centers. I have also been programming since CP/M days, but I hate coding, so whatever. I do my own injection molds, boards, as well. I've taught a number of people to use 3-axis CNC equipment more or less safely if not capably in several evenings, including Solidworks introductions. I don't have patience for people telling me how hard it is to learn to use machinery well. I have less patience for the guild system. It takes something pretty straight forward and whines about how hard things are to keep prices high. The best tools for learning to make your own electronics, machined parts, code, and actual products is the right attitude, some intelligence, and the right tools that don't require months of intense tolerance to bad tool design that require you to have months of knowledge to make basic models or parts. It takes a while to learn to machine well, but not years for crying out loud. Rather than expounding on all this experience you have and all the effort and blood and sweat and tears it took you to gain those skills, it might be better to acknowledge that a lot of the hurdles are bad systems. Myself and a lot of other people have gained these skills with a lot less frustration than perhaps many others. There are a lot of smart people out there. They don't need Proto labs. They won't need this offering really, either. But some will, and a broader swath of the product development public will have greater access to more options with good free CAD, automated post processing, or better/easier PC layout tools. The app kiddies aren't going to take the manufacturing world by storm. But the guilds are basically watching themselves get eaten alive, and that is a good thing. Let product developers do this stuff themselves. The mythology of it being so hard is a fantasy, and a lot of people are starting to realize it. Any young ME who doesn't have strong EE chops and vic versa already has a harder time making a career these days, and frankly, any engineer without strong fab skills now is definitely less valuable.
- rebootthesystem 10y ago
  I have no love for what you call "guilds" either. That said, there's a huge difference between learning to run machines casually and through some combination of schooling and supervised hands-on. Example: TIG and MIG welding. I have both. I can make decent welds. They look pretty. Learned on my own just futzing around here and there. Yet, I would never, in a million years, trust my welding to, say, build even a light aircraft. I, objectively speaking, don't know what I am doing when compared to the aerospace certified welders I walk by every day. > The mythology of it being so hard is a fantasy I disagree. Perhaps scale and application is the difference here. A gadget for a Kickstarter campaign? Sure, anyone can screw around at a maker space and get one or a few done. Something like a Dyson vacuum cleaner that needs to be designed and manufactured at scale and be safe and durable in the field? No way. This requires experienced engineering specializations from EE, ME design to manufacturing engineers, materials engineers, test engineers, machinists, mold makers, process engineers, etc. Way different reality. Move up another level to Medical or Aerospace and things get even more interesting. And some industries are just awe-inspiring in terms of their manufacturing process. One such product are LCD displays. A typical factory for the LCD displays on your computer costs somewhere in the range of two billion dollars to build. Two billion. It's a massive undertaking. Automation, clean rooms, robotics and all kinds of specialized processes designed to optimize quality, cost and yields. To compare that to the software "manufacturing" process is as silly as one can get. Will AI help streamline some of these processes over time? Sure. Of course. You are still going to need a two billion dollar plant to make LCD's and similarly scaled facilities and equipment to make cars, radios, batteries, ovens, etc. Look at making cars as another example. Even if the CAD-to-CNC process was completely automated and perfectly executed it would still be less than a rounding error in the context of the cost, processes and complexity of manufacturing a car.

cranialdivot 10y ago

I have had a large professionally equipped CNC shop in my home shop for a long time as well with a similar array of equipment you mention. I use it intensively for product development for my own company and others. I also have an equally electronics fab lab and a range of other work centers. I have also been programming since CP/M days, but I hate coding, so whatever. I do my own injection molds, boards, as well. I've taught a number of people to use 3-axis CNC equipment more or less safely if not capably in several evenings, including Solidworks introductions. I don't have patience for people telling me how hard it is to learn to use machinery well. I have less patience for the guild system. It takes something pretty straight forward and whines about how hard things are to keep prices high. The best tools for learning to make your own electronics, machined parts, code, and actual products is the right attitude, some intelligence, and the right tools that don't require months of intense tolerance to bad tool design that require you to have months of knowledge to make basic models or parts. It takes a while to learn to machine well, but not years for crying out loud. Rather than expounding on all this experience you have and all the effort and blood and sweat and tears it took you to gain those skills, it might be better to acknowledge that a lot of the hurdles are bad systems. Myself and a lot of other people have gained these skills with a lot less frustration than perhaps many others. There are a lot of smart people out there. They don't need Proto labs. They won't need this offering really, either. But some will, and a broader swath of the product development public will have greater access to more options with good free CAD, automated post processing, or better/easier PC layout tools. The app kiddies aren't going to take the manufacturing world by storm. But the guilds are basically watching themselves get eaten alive, and that is a good thing. Let product developers do this stuff themselves. The mythology of it being so hard is a fantasy, and a lot of people are starting to realize it. Any young ME who doesn't have strong EE chops and vic versa already has a harder time making a career these days, and frankly, any engineer without strong fab skills now is definitely less valuable.

rebootthesystem 10y ago
I have no love for what you call "guilds" either. That said, there's a huge difference between learning to run machines casually and through some combination of schooling and supervised hands-on. Example: TIG and MIG welding. I have both. I can make decent welds. They look pretty. Learned on my own just futzing around here and there. Yet, I would never, in a million years, trust my welding to, say, build even a light aircraft. I, objectively speaking, don't know what I am doing when compared to the aerospace certified welders I walk by every day. > The mythology of it being so hard is a fantasy I disagree. Perhaps scale and application is the difference here. A gadget for a Kickstarter campaign? Sure, anyone can screw around at a maker space and get one or a few done. Something like a Dyson vacuum cleaner that needs to be designed and manufactured at scale and be safe and durable in the field? No way. This requires experienced engineering specializations from EE, ME design to manufacturing engineers, materials engineers, test engineers, machinists, mold makers, process engineers, etc. Way different reality. Move up another level to Medical or Aerospace and things get even more interesting. And some industries are just awe-inspiring in terms of their manufacturing process. One such product are LCD displays. A typical factory for the LCD displays on your computer costs somewhere in the range of two billion dollars to build. Two billion. It's a massive undertaking. Automation, clean rooms, robotics and all kinds of specialized processes designed to optimize quality, cost and yields. To compare that to the software "manufacturing" process is as silly as one can get. Will AI help streamline some of these processes over time? Sure. Of course. You are still going to need a two billion dollar plant to make LCD's and similarly scaled facilities and equipment to make cars, radios, batteries, ovens, etc. Look at making cars as another example. Even if the CAD-to-CNC process was completely automated and perfectly executed it would still be less than a rounding error in the context of the cost, processes and complexity of manufacturing a car.