8 ms·

ESR is a racist and a misogynist. And that document might as well be called "how to be ESR".

by sdevlin 10y ago

ms7 10y ago
Care to share a source for that?
- tptacek 10y ago
  The cites would fill the whole thread. You can take his word for it.
- sdevlin 10y ago
  Just read his blog.
fao_ 10y ago
Not to mention violently right-wing and believes he was, for a short period, a god[1] >.> [1]: http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/dancing.html http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/dancing.html
- notduncansmith 10y ago
  Just read the linked post in full and that's an awfully reductive comment on the experiences he describes there. I suggest taking a more intellectually honest look at that writing (not to defend any of his other writing or views, which I haven't read).
  - tptacek 10y ago
    I think we're all pretty sure ESR is not in fact a god, and that nothing could have occurred with ESR or his magic flute to have demonstrated to him that he was. Rather, the story is more broadly illustrative of a pretty extreme narcissism and --- challenging --- variant of self-awareness. For a more down to earth example, consider how many of us would non-ironically write the following passage: I’m wondering about this because my wife Cathy asked me a simple question last night, and I realized I didn’t have an answer to it. “Are you” she asked “the most famous programmer in the world?” This was a question which I had, believe it or not, never thought about before. But it’s a reasonable one to ask, given recent evidence – notably, the unexpected success of my Patreon page. This is relevant because Patreon is mainly an arts-funding site – it’s clearly not designed for or by techies. It goes on in this vein. Here, by the way, is a link to his Patreon page: https://www.patreon.com/esr https://www.patreon.com/esr Apparently we value "the code that makes our digital world work" a bit less than we value the person who fries our french fries at McDonalds. If that sounds mean, well, it is, but it was also Eric Raymond who put forward the idea that his Patreon page may indicate that he's among the most famous programmers in the world. For a nerdier take on ESR's merits, hunt down Terry Lambert's take on fetchmail. (You should know who Terry Lambert is, if you don't already).
    - armitron 10y ago
      Not to mention that ESR was, at some point, a multi-millionaire. Pretty sure he still is, in which case that Patreon page of his would be nothing but a con.
pedrodelfino 10y ago
What if we separated his work from himself? I don't know Eric enough. I know he is right wing, but not sure if he is racist. Suppose he is a racist, can't his text about being a hacker be great? I read "How to become a hacker" in 2014. It is awesome and he does not say anything about woman and race on the text. According to some historians, Da Vinci was a dushbag. Should we ignore his crafts just because, apparently, he was a bad person? I don't think so.
tptacek 10y ago
That's true, but the bigger problem with the document is that ESR's role in "hacking" is largely "making things to assign CVEs to".

ESR is a racist and a misogynist. And that document might as well be called "how to be ESR".

by sdevlin 10y ago

ESR is a racist and a misogynist. And that document might as well be called "how to be ESR".

ms7 10y ago

Care to share a source for that?

tptacek 10y ago
The cites would fill the whole thread. You can take his word for it.
sdevlin 10y ago
Just read his blog.

fao_ 10y ago

Not to mention violently right-wing and believes he was, for a short period, a god[1] >.> [1]: http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/dancing.html http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/dancing.html

notduncansmith 10y ago
Just read the linked post in full and that's an awfully reductive comment on the experiences he describes there. I suggest taking a more intellectually honest look at that writing (not to defend any of his other writing or views, which I haven't read).
- tptacek 10y ago
  I think we're all pretty sure ESR is not in fact a god, and that nothing could have occurred with ESR or his magic flute to have demonstrated to him that he was. Rather, the story is more broadly illustrative of a pretty extreme narcissism and --- challenging --- variant of self-awareness. For a more down to earth example, consider how many of us would non-ironically write the following passage: I’m wondering about this because my wife Cathy asked me a simple question last night, and I realized I didn’t have an answer to it. “Are you” she asked “the most famous programmer in the world?” This was a question which I had, believe it or not, never thought about before. But it’s a reasonable one to ask, given recent evidence – notably, the unexpected success of my Patreon page. This is relevant because Patreon is mainly an arts-funding site – it’s clearly not designed for or by techies. It goes on in this vein. Here, by the way, is a link to his Patreon page: https://www.patreon.com/esr https://www.patreon.com/esr Apparently we value "the code that makes our digital world work" a bit less than we value the person who fries our french fries at McDonalds. If that sounds mean, well, it is, but it was also Eric Raymond who put forward the idea that his Patreon page may indicate that he's among the most famous programmers in the world. For a nerdier take on ESR's merits, hunt down Terry Lambert's take on fetchmail. (You should know who Terry Lambert is, if you don't already).
  - armitron 10y ago
    Not to mention that ESR was, at some point, a multi-millionaire. Pretty sure he still is, in which case that Patreon page of his would be nothing but a con.

pedrodelfino 10y ago

What if we separated his work from himself? I don't know Eric enough. I know he is right wing, but not sure if he is racist. Suppose he is a racist, can't his text about being a hacker be great? I read "How to become a hacker" in 2014. It is awesome and he does not say anything about woman and race on the text. According to some historians, Da Vinci was a dushbag. Should we ignore his crafts just because, apparently, he was a bad person? I don't think so.

tptacek 10y ago

That's true, but the bigger problem with the document is that ESR's role in "hacking" is largely "making things to assign CVEs to".